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View Full Version : Casablanca 'style' white Tuxedo / Dinner Jacket




























PADDY
09-08-2008, 01:52 AM
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/bogartcasablanca.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/bogartcasablanca1.jpg



The style of white/cream/ivory Tuxedo that Bogart wears in the movie, 'Casablanca,' is it the typical 'hour-glass' shape with high armpits & fitted waist that one associates with jackets of that era?

Also, what material is it likely to be? ie: wool, cotton, linen, rayon mix...?

Many thanks for any help and feedback that you can bring to this, as I was totally taken by Ben's DB 4X2 white Tux at last year's QM weekend. Just looked so stylish under the Californian stars!! with a cocktail in hand.

cookie
09-08-2008, 03:57 AM
what size are you? I have a PB job around smallish 44R a bit like this...

Charlie Noodles
09-08-2008, 04:07 AM
If I ever got a Tux' it'd be a white one like that.

Edward
09-08-2008, 04:53 AM
No idea what Bogie's was made from, but my understanding is that they tended towards lighter cloths - linen would not have been unheard of, lighter wools. I'm sure I've heard of them in a silk/cashmere blend too? Not aware of them in cotton - I should have thought that while the white jacket was considered to be somewhat less formal, a relaxation in the black tie code in recognition of hot climates, an all-cotton affair would be too casual in the way it would drape? The lapel facings should also be same-material as the jacket itself - satin was generally a no no.

For what it's worth, in the movie The Great Rock and Roll Swindle, a young Sid Vicious wears a jacket identical to Bogart's in the My Way sequence. Not a film for the more, ah, genteel Lounger, but there were some really nice shots of the jacket! ;)

If Indy Magnoli happens to be around and check this thread, he might know a thing or two about the bogart jacket - there is a repro in his range, so I should imagine he's done a bit of research into it? I wonder where the original went.... to my mind, that jacket is as much a Bogart icon as the trenchcoat and fedora...

Feraud
09-08-2008, 05:57 AM
Here is my getup-
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Montauk%20Club%204%2008/DSC04789-1.jpg
I believe the jacket is a lightweight wool.

scotrace
09-08-2008, 06:54 AM
That's THE jacket to get your hands on, Paddy - and none-too-easy to find, as it sports both shawl collar/lapel and a double-breasted closure. You can find them with peaked lapels, but with that shawl configuration it's a much tougher game. And that collar/lapel is what makes that particular jacket unique and "Casablanca-esque." Good luck turning one up!

Where did yours come from, Feraud?

Feraud
09-08-2008, 07:01 AM
The gods of vintage were smiling down upon me one day as I was browsed a vintage shop in NYC. The last thing I was thinking of buying was a dinner jacket but this one fit too perfectly to pass up. Not to mention the obscenely affordable price.

A noticable difference between the Bogey jacket and mine is the lapel button hole on my jacket.
Here is a better pic.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Clothes/DSC04673.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Clothes/DSC04677.jpg

PADDY
09-10-2008, 03:22 AM
Just pulled the trigger on this baby. Vintage Palm Beach 2x4 DB with shawl collar. Just waiting for it to come knocking at Rick's Cafe here ;)

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/palmbeachtux1.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/palmbeachtux2.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/bogartcasablanca1.jpg

Edward
09-10-2008, 05:16 AM
Nice find! eBay?

cookie
09-10-2008, 05:43 AM
The gods of vintage were smiling down upon me one day as I was browsed a vintage shop in NYC. The last thing I was thinking of buying was a dinner jacket but this one fit too perfectly to pass up. Not to mention the obscenely affordable price.

A noticable difference between the Bogey jacket and mine is the lapel button hole on my jacket.
Here is a better pic.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Clothes/DSC04673.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Clothes/DSC04677.jpg

Nice one Patrick! Mine is the same as this one of Feraud's with the buttonhole. The PBs are not wide as the bogey job with the bellied lapels..

PADDY
09-10-2008, 06:08 AM
Click pic to enlarge - but plenty of detail in this large photo still from the iconic movie. So many iconic items stemmed from this film. The trenchcoat and the white tux being the most notable.


http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/th_BOGARTINTUXEDOJPEG.jpg (http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/BOGARTINTUXEDOJPEG.jpg)

scotrace
09-10-2008, 06:18 AM
Great discovery Paddy - glad you nailed that jacket.

One note about that last picture - all of the "extras" seated around Bogart and Wilson in that photo were actual refugees, fleeing the Nazis. When Casablanca was cast, there were a lot of European film industry people in CA, and they found work as best they could. Some were well-known in their home countries, but very few ever had any real success in the US. Most returned to their homeland after the war. Their accents were needed in the production of wartime films as someone had to play the Germans or their many non-English-speaking victims. Post-war, they found themselves out of work, though crew people had an easier time of it as their lack of fluency in English didn't matter so much.

Mike K.
09-10-2008, 06:25 AM
I bought a dinner jacket very similar to this at an eBay store. Off-white, 100% wool, double-breasted, shawl collar. Since I already had a black dinner jacket and pants, I figured this one would pair nicely with the black pants to give me more options. I might add two additional buttons above the existing ones to give it a more traditional look.
http://www.formalwearoutlet.com/EbayItems/DinnerJackets/IvoryDB.jpg

Feraud
09-10-2008, 06:27 AM
Nice one Patrick! Mine is the same as this one of Feraud's with the buttonhole. The PBs are not wide as the bogey job with the bellied lapels..
Not to stray off topic but I prefer the dinner jackets with fuller lapels.
Here is a midnight blue number I found in a local thrift shop.
The jacket was on rack and the pants were in another part of the store.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Clothes/DSC05637.jpg

PADDY
09-10-2008, 06:40 AM
It would be easy enough to change the buttons and pop four on the front and match them with smaller versions on the sleeves.

Feraud - that white tux really suits you sir!! I'm sure that turns a few heads in the cocktail bars of NYC!

Cricket
09-10-2008, 06:53 AM
I really like the light jackets. But, I would be so nervous about spilling something on them. I am the worst about spilling stuff. Wine, food..you name it. Well, that is why I am leaving it to you men.
Ya'll look wonderful and handsome.

kampkatz
09-10-2008, 09:43 AM
Thanks for the photos from thrift stores. There are some bargains out there waiting to be swooped up!

Edward
09-11-2008, 06:20 AM
I really like the light jackets. But, I would be so nervous about spilling something on them. I am the worst about spilling stuff. Wine, food..you name it. Well, that is why I am leaving it to you men.
Ya'll look wonderful and handsome.

For what it's worth, I find that a good dry cleaner can remove the evidence of a multitude of sins.... I once had half a glass of red wine spilled over a linen blazer of mine - one dry clean late,r came up good as new.

thunderw21
09-14-2008, 12:44 PM
Will over at "A Suitable Wardrobe" highlights the RL jacket that'll be available for next spring.

http://asuitablewardrobe.dynend.com/2008/09/dress-up-for-spring.html

PADDY
09-15-2008, 01:34 AM
Nice to see!! though the photo ensemble would look even better with a cumberbund. It 'is' the sort of thing that RL should be adding to their repertoire, as it is so classically colonial which is an image they tend to cultivate in their shops. I visited their Boston store last Fall and it was like walking into a little corner of Olde England. So this jacket I have no doubt will be a good seller for the coming spring and summer.

PADDY
09-15-2008, 02:42 AM
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/Mvc-010f.jpg

carter
09-15-2008, 02:52 AM
http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/theformalmale/IVORY.jpg

A 37R and a 39L are offered by the usual suspects.

LondonLuke
09-15-2008, 04:08 AM
Hmm, is that a black waistcoat with a white dj? The only appropriate waist covering in that case is a black cummerbund!

Feraud
09-15-2008, 05:29 AM
Who is offering this jacket?

http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/theformalmale/IVORY.jpg

A 37R and a 39L are offered by the usual suspects.

Edward
09-15-2008, 07:59 AM
Hmm, is that a black waistcoat with a white dj? The only appropriate waist covering in that case is a black cummerbund!

I have a vague recollection that Dr Jones wore a waistcoat with his white dj in the Shanghai sequence at the beginning of Temple. That would, of course, be counter to the traditionally accepted 'rules,' as well as somewhat counter intuitive - the very purpose of the white / ivory jackets being to keep the wearer cooler. If memory serves, the requirement was that the cummerbund (if wearing a single breated jacket, of course) should be dark in colour - but not necessarily black. I've been pleased with a late 50s burgundy example I turne up for pennies on eBay:

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b122/Edwardmarlowe/Fedora%20Lounge%20photos/Uploaded8August2008013.jpg

Still keeping an eye out for a straw homberg to go with this.....

Feraud
09-15-2008, 08:14 AM
I think you are correct on all points Edward.

You can easily pull off a straw skimmer with the above outfit if you choose. Skimmers seem more available on the bay.

Here is a nice pic of a maroon cummerbund.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Catalog%20pics/pic2.jpg

carter
09-15-2008, 10:41 AM
Who is offering this jacket?

I sent you a PM.

scotrace
09-15-2008, 11:07 AM
PM Scotrace also, if you've a moment.

:)

carter
09-15-2008, 11:34 AM
PM Scotrace also, if you've a moment.

:)

done

PADDY
09-15-2008, 12:39 PM
That is just 'one' great picture displaying those wonderful tuxes!! And with the boater, it just looks the bees knees (I had no idea up until seeing that, that it would look so good with the straw!! marvellous!!:eusa_clap ). And creates such a different look to the Casablanca one styled by Bogart.

LondonLuke
09-15-2008, 12:40 PM
I have a vague recollection that Dr Jones wore a waistcoat with his white dj in the Shanghai sequence at the beginning of Temple. That would, of course, be counter to the traditionally accepted 'rules,' as well as somewhat counter intuitive - the very purpose of the white / ivory jackets being to keep the wearer cooler. If memory serves, the requirement was that the cummerbund (if wearing a single breated jacket, of course) should be dark in colour - but not necessarily black. I've been pleased with a late 50s burgundy example I turne up for pennies on eBay:
.


I do seem to recall it being very fashionable in the 1920s/1930s to wear one dark red part of the ensemble, either cummerbund, bow tie or pocket square (but never have all matching! Only one in maroon)

Very sharp looking in those pics! Umbrella looks a bit short for you though

PADDY
09-15-2008, 01:48 PM
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/whitetuxGarbo.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/whitetuxastaire.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/whitetuxsinglebreast.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/whitetuxvenice.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/bondintuxedo.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/whitetuxbradpitt_georg_14711942_600.jpg

Feraud
09-16-2008, 06:41 AM
Andre Benjamin from Outkast.
http://www.esquire.com/cm/esquire/images/m3/andre-benjamin-WI-0908-lg.jpg

Edward
09-23-2008, 10:46 AM
Very sharp looking in those pics! Umbrella looks a bit short for you though

Thanks! Yeah, it looks shorter in that shot than it seems in reality.... It is a comfortable height to use as a walking cane should I so choose to do (any shorter and it wouldn't be), though generally I tend to carry it rather than walk with it, if you follow me, so that's not so much an issue. Works admirably as a brolly, which is the main thing.... and at only GBP15 from eBay (Fulton brand - as apparently used by the Royals - and we do usually buy them the best of everything... :p ), not the end of the world should I lose it on the bus! ;)

PADDY
10-02-2008, 03:00 AM
Just a few snaps of the labels. Getting the jacket tailored slightly, so no point in seeing it with lots of pins and tucks..etc until jacket surgery is finished ;) But the condition is essentially NOS and MINT!!

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/th_TUXEDO001.jpg (http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/TUXEDO001.jpg)
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/th_TUXEDO003.jpg (http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/TUXEDO003.jpg)
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/th_TUXEDO004.jpg (http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/TUXEDO004.jpg)

cookie
10-02-2008, 03:54 AM
Just a few snaps of the labels. Getting the jacket tailored slightly, so no point in seeing it with lots of pins and tucks..etc until jacket surgery is finished ;) But the condition is essentially NOS and MINT!!

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/th_TUXEDO001.jpg (http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/TUXEDO001.jpg)
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/th_TUXEDO003.jpg (http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/TUXEDO003.jpg)
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/th_TUXEDO004.jpg (http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/TUXEDO004.jpg)

BK could correct me but is that a later type of PB cloth hence the newishness???

PADDY
10-03-2008, 02:46 AM
So Edward, you've 'got the look!!' Also included here is the iconic pic of Bogie outside Rick's Cafe.


http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/patrck2a.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/BogieinCasablanca.jpg

Edward
10-03-2008, 02:51 AM
Don't think I've seen our man Picard in black tie before - as expected, though, he carries it well! :)

PADDY
10-06-2008, 04:27 AM
1950's Palm Beach summerweight fabric (like a linen) 4x2 DB Dinner Jacket (or Tuxedo in the US). May shorten the body slightly to give it more of a 40's feel and the side/back have been tailored 'in.' Immaculate condition - really pleased with this, just need the weather and occasion to wear it now. Anyone heading Casablanca way..?


http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/WHITETUX003.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/WHITETUX004.jpg

Mr. Rover
10-06-2008, 09:57 PM
Andre Benjamin from Outkast.
http://www.esquire.com/cm/esquire/images/m3/andre-benjamin-WI-0908-lg.jpg

I ran into him at the drug store last week- we had a nice short chat about newsboy caps and his new line Benjamin Bixby while waiting to pay.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b50/WrongEra/n1452930112_30094893_2018.jpg
This is my cream 4x1 Palm Beach unlined dinner jacket. Creases like crazy and is a pain in the neck to press, but I really like it and don't really get to wear it enough.

carter
10-06-2008, 10:18 PM
1950's Palm Beach summerweight fabric (like a linen) 4x2 DB Dinner Jacket (or Tuxedo in the US). May shorten the body slightly to give it more of a 40's feel and the side/back have been tailored 'in.' Immaculate condition - really pleased with this, just need the weather and occasion to wear it now. Anyone heading Casablanca way..?
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/WHITETUX003.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/WHITETUX004.jpg

Impeccable, as always, sir. You have the ability to carry off any look in any vintage. The sartorial everyman. What a gift. :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

Mr. Rover
10-06-2008, 10:28 PM
I think you are correct on all points Edward.

You can easily pull off a straw skimmer with the above outfit if you choose. Skimmers seem more available on the bay.

Here is a nice pic of a maroon cummerbund.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Catalog%20pics/pic2.jpg


Really awesome picture, Feraud- goes to show you: you can be one of the few people at the party in a dinner jacket now and it doesn't really matter. Because even then, people in DJs and blazers/cream trousers and suits mingled. It's a party, after all!

Mr. Rover
10-06-2008, 10:31 PM
I had an opportunity to preview next Spring's lineup, and there is the Casablanca style white DJ available in Purple Label...some more casual pieces in the regular Polo label. If you are in New York, MrBern and I found a lot of white or cream linen and lightweight wool jackets in the sale rack around July at the RL store in Bloomingdale's for relatively affordable prices

Feraud
10-07-2008, 07:59 AM
Because even then, people in DJs and blazers/cream trousers and suits mingled. It's a party, after all!
Right. The ultimate goal is friends getting together and enjoying themselves!


I had an opportunity to preview next Spring's lineup, and there is the Casablanca style white DJ available in Purple Label...some more casual pieces in the regular Polo label. If you are in New York, MrBern and I found a lot of white or cream linen and lightweight wool jackets in the sale rack around July at the RL store in Bloomingdale's for relatively affordable prices Thanks for the tip. It's not like I need another DJ but if the price is right..

Edward
10-07-2008, 08:47 AM
Paddy-> Nice jacket.... the db version does have that certain air.... It'd be grand for the QM next year. ;)

anglophile
10-09-2008, 03:06 AM
I think you are correct on all points Edward.

You can easily pull off a straw skimmer with the above outfit if you choose. Skimmers seem more available on the bay.

Here is a nice pic of a maroon cummerbund.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Catalog%20pics/pic2.jpg

According to the Black Tie Guide:
Prior to the 1930s the standard apparel for formal summer evenings was a dark blue jacket and white flannel trousers.

PADDY
10-09-2008, 03:06 AM
Please excuse the quality, but hopefully it will illustrate the great wardrobe from the MadMen Series and how well the likes of character Don Draper pulls off this 'classic' Casablanca 'look!' A white TUX...Just timeless isn't it ;)

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/MADMEN003.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/MADMEN005.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/MADMEN006.jpg

cookie
10-15-2008, 02:46 AM
Impeccable, as always, sir. You have the ability to carry off any look in any vintage. The sartorial everyman. What a gift. :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

Paddy this looks like the one I spoke to you about - mine is a 44".

Feraud
10-15-2008, 05:51 AM
Does anyone else but me think compared to Bogey, the Don Draper character looks absolutely anemic in his outfit? Between the skinny lapels and Don's low self esteem, I find little to envy about the guy. I cannot help but take attitude into consideration when considering style. Don's a mess.
Here is a refresher on how it's done. ;)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/Casablanca/CASABLANCA-7.jpg

Fedora-in-a-Box
10-30-2008, 06:11 AM
Talking of jackets, sorry for the off topic but I can't find private messages...
PADDY what jacket/coat are you wearing in your avatar? I've been looking for something similar for a long time. Again apologies for posting an off topic message but I couldn't resist asking!

cookie
11-01-2008, 09:08 PM
http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/9439/thelostcity5rt9.th.gif (http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thelostcity5rt9.gif)http://img88.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php) http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/4392/thelostcity2ke8.th.gif (http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thelostcity2ke8.gif)http://img88.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

PADDY
02-14-2009, 09:37 AM
In a classic white tux...well you have to expect that EVERYONE will be looking at YOU..!! ;)


http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/OBAMA%20POSTER/BOGART1-1.jpg

PADDY
04-27-2009, 08:18 AM
Who's dusting off their white Tux then?;)

chanteuseCarey
04-28-2009, 09:35 PM
Wow, yours is a beauty. You look very handsome in it my dear Paddy!

Been wanting to find the hubby one for years... He's a 40R. Would love to have a 40s looking one ala Casablanca for him.

If yours was found on evilBay, could you please tell me what category etc? I tried under vintage, tuxedo, Palm Beach, dinner jacket, etc and turned up nothing.

PM
1950's Palm Beach summerweight fabric (like a linen) 4x2 DB Dinner Jacket (or Tuxedo in the US). May shorten the body slightly to give it more of a 40's feel and the side/back have been tailored 'in.' Immaculate condition - really pleased with this, just need the weather and occasion to wear it now. Anyone heading Casablanca way..?

JMVBHO (just my very biased humble opinion), Paddy you should consider this pic of you as a new avatar pic...



http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/WHITETUX004.jpg

chanteuseCarey
04-28-2009, 09:40 PM
Wow, yours is a beauty. You look very handsome in it my dear Paddy!

Been wanting to find the hubby one for years... He's a 40R. Would love to have a 40s looking one ala' Rick's in Casablanca for him.

If yours was found on evilBay, could you please tell me what category etc? I tried under vintage, tuxedo, Palm Beach, dinner jacket, etc and turned up nothing.

JMVBHO (just my very biased humble opinion) Paddy, you should consider this great pic of you in your PB dinner jacket as a new avatar pic.

PM
1950's Palm Beach summerweight fabric (like a linen) 4x2 DB Dinner Jacket (or Tuxedo in the US). May shorten the body slightly to give it more of a 40's feel and the side/back have been tailored 'in.' Immaculate condition - really pleased with this, just need the weather and occasion to wear it now. Anyone heading Casablanca way..?

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/WHITETUX004.jpg

WH1
05-05-2009, 10:22 AM
Just finished watching Song Of The Thin Man this evening and it is full of amazing dinner jacket both single and double breasted. I am going to have to get one before July as we are going to Europe and have several evening black tie events. Has anyone purchased the Magnoli Casablanca double breasted? Also where does one find tuxedo trousers that have the silohouette (sp?) you see in the Newport Casino illustration, they are outstanding?

scotrace
05-05-2009, 11:42 AM
I got one of these jackets at a consignment shop this spring. Now I need a place to wear it!

Forgotten Man
05-05-2009, 02:03 PM
They're dinner jackets... not white tuxes. White tuxes are worn to proms by goofy teens and they look very tacky. :p

A dinner jacket is either a linen blend such as "Palm Beach" and or cream colored gabardine. I've seen some that are a cream colored wool flannel. They have no satin on the lapels and are just like a suit coat but with shawl lapels. Came in single or double breasted styles.

http://www.citizenarcane.com/files/2005/May/23/bogart.jpg
Note: Dinner jackets came in cream. Notice how Bogart's is darker then the white shirt he wears. That indicates to a cream colored dinner jacket.

ortega76
05-05-2009, 02:53 PM
I love the look of a cream dinner jacket. I was tempted to buy one when the wife and I went on our honeymoon cruise but I couldn't find one that I really liked that didn't cost a small fortune. I am resolved to pick one up for the next cruise we take.

MrBern
05-05-2009, 06:16 PM
did anyone post this guy? Oh, its not a shawl collar.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/47/149709205_52f30e0123.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/52/149680744_697a489d98.jpg

chanteuseCarey
05-05-2009, 06:16 PM
Will have to watch SofTTM again just to see these...

On the trousers have you talked with Magnoli and Matt Deckard? Or looked on evilBay for vintage tuxedos?


Just finished watching Song Of The Thin Man this evening and it is full of amazing dinner jacket both single and double breasted. Also where does one find tuxedo trousers that have the silohouette (sp?) you see in the Newport Casino illustration, they are outstanding?

chanteuseCarey
05-05-2009, 06:19 PM
Is this from "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom"? If so, it is my least fave of the original trilogy, and I only saw it once when it was in the theaters...


did anyone post this guy?

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/52/149680744_697a489d98.jpg

WH1
05-05-2009, 07:49 PM
Is this from "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom"? If so, it is my least fave of the original trilogy, and I only saw it once when it was in the theaters...

Yes it is and wholeheartedly agree, Kate Capshaw screeching "Indy" every 10 seconds is enough to make one jam popcorn in the ears:eusa_doh:

As to trousers I am seriously looking at ordering both the Casablanca style dinner jacket and trousers from Indy, I recently ordered a Gittes suit and am eagerly awaiting its arrival.

Song of the thin man has some great evening clothes and it is just a good show.

cookie
05-06-2009, 12:47 AM
I recently ordered a Gittes suit and am eagerly awaiting its arrival.


Pix of it would be nice...

WH1
05-06-2009, 02:18 AM
Pix of it would be nice...

I will take pictures in Europe this summer along with my new Art Fawcett shaped Panama hat I was fortunate enough to purchase from Bob C recently. Now if I can only find a nice pair of linen and leather spectators!;)

cookie
05-06-2009, 08:03 AM
Now if I can only find a nice pair of linen and leather spectators!;)

http://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCatSectionView.process?IWAction=Load&Merchant_Id=1&Section_Id=523

Brooks Bros are having a 30% extra sale until 11 May use coupon friend75.

Forgotten Man
05-06-2009, 09:37 AM
The Indy movies were made in the late 70s and early 80s… some costumes are authentic but most are not.

A single breasted peak lapel cream/white coat was mostly likely a suit coat originally. I have never seen any ads for such a dinner jacket in any catalog from the period. Hollywood often puts things on the leading cast that they feel looks better then what is accurate… trust me, I know and it makes me upset. I’ve worked on sets before and we the extras are often times correct and the principals are not.

PADDY
05-06-2009, 09:48 AM
It looks totally out of balance, not just for 'the period' it is trying to represent, but 'any' period...PERIOD ;)

A DB would have been period accurate, and actually I hazard a guess that IJ would have looked better for it.

Also, the black waistcoat with white DJ combo is an insult to one's eyes - it just doesn't look good folks.

Whereas, Bogey in Casablanca, in a white/cream DB-DJ...cuts a dash like the true blade of a man that he is;)

Feraud
05-06-2009, 09:52 AM
I’ve worked on sets before and we the extras are often times correct and the principals are not.

I share this observation and particularly in Westerns.

Marc Chevalier
05-06-2009, 12:36 PM
A DB would have been period accurate, and actually I hazard a guess that IJ would have looked better for it.



But consider this, Paddy: IJ is wearing his white dinner jacket in an action sequence. It would have been far more difficult for him to run around, jump around, etc. in a buttoned double-breasted jacket, rather than an unbuttoned single-breasted one. True, he could have run around in an unbuttoned double-breasted, but it would have flapped all over the place and looked bad.



.

Forgotten Man
05-06-2009, 12:38 PM
I share this observation and particularly in Westerns.

Oh yes, very true!




It looks totally out of balance, not just for 'the period' it is trying to represent, but 'any' period...PERIOD ;)

A DB would have been period accurate, and actually I hazard a guess that IJ would have looked better for it.

Also, the black waistcoat with white DJ combo is an insult to one's eyes - it just doesn't look good folks.

Whereas, Bogey in Casablanca, in a white/cream DB-DJ...cuts a dash like the true blade of a man that he is;)

I agree with ya Paddy, Indy looks as if he forgot his black tux coat and just picked up a cream summer suit coat. The correct coat to wear with a black waistcoat and black tux pants is a black tux coat. Now, if he wore a black or red cummerbund and a short mess jacket, that would be correct and authentic to the period as well.

http://www.blacktieguide.com/History/1930s/1933_AA_v3_n1_mess_jackets_sweeteened_crop.jpg

Forgotten Man
05-06-2009, 12:40 PM
But consider this, Paddy: IJ is wearing his white dinner jacket in an action sequence. It would have been far more difficult for him to run around, jump around, etc. in a buttoned double-breasted jacket, rather than an unbuttoned single-breasted one. True, he could have run around in an unbuttoned double-breasted, but it would have flapped all over the place and looked bad.



.

A mess jacket would have been a better choice.;)

Marc Chevalier
05-06-2009, 12:41 PM
... if he wore a black or red cummerbund and a short mess jacket, that would be correct and authentic to the period as well.



True, but 1984's moviegoing audience would have thought that he looked like a waiter on an oceanliner or something.

.

Marc Chevalier
05-06-2009, 12:41 PM
A mess jacket would have been a better choice.;)



Yes indeed, but see my post above.

.

Forgotten Man
05-06-2009, 12:45 PM
True, but 1984's moviegoing audience would have thought that he looked like a waiter on an oceanliner or something.

.

Well, the general public are asleep to anything not modern... Ashley wore a beautiful green felt hat she got at the expo a few weeks ago and wore her matching green gloves with a nice dress to a car show with me last weekend... some men thought she was an airline stewardess...:eusa_doh: I don't know about some people these days.

Hang what people "might" think... do what's correct and you'll always come out on top in the end!

Marc Chevalier
05-06-2009, 12:47 PM
Hang what people "might" think... do what's correct and you'll always come out on top in the end!



That's the opposite of Hollywood! lol


It's because of Hollywood that we have these clothing stereotypes about eras. Pinstripe d/b suits ... pointy collar shirts ... spectator shoes. Hollywood would have us think that men wore nothing else in the '30s!


.

Forgotten Man
05-06-2009, 12:53 PM
That's the opposite of Hollywood! lol


It's because of Hollywood that we have these clothing stereotypes about eras. Pinstripe d/b suits ... pointy collar shirts ... spectator shoes. Hollywood would have us think that men wore nothing else in the '30s!


.

I know, hang Hollywood! They've ruined many a good movie due to bad costumes... that stuff gets under my skin... and it ain't new either. All the period styled films from the 30s to the 50s are just as bad if not worse! Just the movies taking place in the current time they were made are fantastic. ;)

avedwards
05-06-2009, 12:55 PM
But consider this, Paddy: IJ is wearing his white dinner jacket in an action sequence. It would have been far more difficult for him to run around, jump around, etc. in a buttoned double-breasted jacket, rather than an unbuttoned single-breasted one. True, he could have run around in an unbuttoned double-breasted, but it would have flapped all over the place and looked bad.



.
What about a black single breasted dinner jacket? Should be period accurate, at least in 1930s films they are worn. Would have been equally practical for the action sequences.

Djupis
05-06-2009, 12:56 PM
It's because of Hollywood that we have these clothing stereotypes about eras. Pinstripe d/b suits ... pointy collar shirts ... spectator shoes. Hollywood would have us think that men wore nothing else in the '30s!
.

They didn't!? :eek:

Oh, and I couldn't help but think of this, after all that talk about mess jackets:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_l_HuGQu9G6Q/SUNVuby-_NI/AAAAAAAAAxc/s21vM5mYc4M/s400/JWb-726047.jpg

Jeeves would not approve.

Marc Chevalier
05-06-2009, 12:56 PM
Forgotten Man, do I miss your knowledge and posts around here! A lot was lost when you left. Glad you're back, but wish I could learn more from you and see more photos of your collection.

.

Forgotten Man
05-06-2009, 12:57 PM
Yes, if he wore just a black tux, that would have been sharp too... but I figure that "Hollywood" would have liked him to wear white to stand out from the rest I guess... who knows what goes on in those costumer's small little minds some times lol

Marc Chevalier
05-06-2009, 12:59 PM
What about a black single breasted dinner jacket? Should be period accurate, at least in 1930s films they are worn. Would have been equally practical for the action sequences.



In that sequence, Indy is in Shanghai. The white dinner jacket looks more, well, exotic -- in keeping with the far-flung, steamy 'oriental' locale.

.

Viola
05-06-2009, 01:16 PM
Short Round should have made fun of the single-breasted jacket, though. "You left your tux at home, Doctor Jones? That's a suit jacket you stole off some guy, huh?" :p

WH1
05-07-2009, 01:09 AM
They didn't!? :eek:

Oh, and I couldn't help but think of this, after all that talk about mess jackets:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_l_HuGQu9G6Q/SUNVuby-_NI/AAAAAAAAAxc/s21vM5mYc4M/s400/JWb-726047.jpg

Jeeves would not approve.


That is a truly great picture. We really need an icon/smilie of jeeves looking disapprovingly. It would be most useful in some of the threads. Or perhaps a Mark Chevalier might be more appropriate to the lounge.;)

Feraud
05-07-2009, 06:23 AM
Here is my dinner jkt.
Excuse the tiny avatar pic.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v120/feraud/avatar/DSC04789-1.jpg

Forgotten Man
05-07-2009, 09:49 AM
A dinner mess jacket has cloth covered or mother of pearl buttons I believe and has no epaulets. The mess jackets that are worn by waiters or cruise ship staff have gold buttons and epaulets and also a cuff stripe or two.

Marc Chevalier
05-07-2009, 09:54 AM
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_l_HuGQu9G6Q/SUNVuby-_NI/AAAAAAAAAxc/s21vM5mYc4M/s400/JWb-726047.jpg




In this photo, Jeeves looks a LOT like Scotrace! :)



.

Marc Chevalier
05-07-2009, 09:56 AM
A dinner mess jacket has cloth covered or mother of pearl buttons I believe and has no epaulets. The mess jackets that are worn by waiters or cruise ship staff have gold buttons and epaulets and also a cuff stripe or two.




Which means that Bertie Wooster (see photo above) is dressed like a waiter.



.

Djupis
05-07-2009, 12:04 PM
Which means that Bertie Wooster (see photo above) is dressed like a waiter.



.

Which is precisely why Jeeves disapproved of it if I recall correctly. Bertie was quite fond of it because the ladies would always try to get his attention.

Feraud
05-07-2009, 12:14 PM
Which is precisely why Jeeves disapproved of it if I recall correctly. Bertie was quite fond of it because the ladies would always try to get his attention.
Now that is funny! lol

PADDY
05-08-2009, 06:20 AM
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/DSC_0004.jpg

Midnight Blue
05-08-2009, 09:03 AM
A dinner mess jacket has cloth covered or mother of pearl buttons I believe and has no epaulets. The mess jackets that are worn by waiters or cruise ship staff have gold buttons and epaulets and also a cuff stripe or two.

It is also best worn with a cummerbund and turndown collar, not a black waistcoat and stiff wing collar. And although I prefer off-white when it comes to dinner jackets, mess jackets are small enough that they look crisp and sharp in pure white. The off-white worn by Wooster comes across as dingy.

From a 1933 issue of Apparel Arts:

http://www.blacktieguide.com/History/1930s/1933_AA_v3_n1_mess_jackets_sweeteened_crop.jpg

Marc Chevalier
05-08-2009, 11:03 AM
Well worth reading:


http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u290/crosby_square/ProQuest_396340781-1_edited-1.jpg


http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u290/crosby_square/ProQuest_396340781-2_edited-1.jpg

avedwards
05-08-2009, 11:57 AM
In that sequence, Indy is in Shanghai. The white dinner jacket looks more, well, exotic -- in keeping with the far-flung, steamy 'oriental' locale.

.
How about a white single breasted shawl lapel tux? That would be pracitcal. Would it be period?

Forgotten Man
05-08-2009, 12:02 PM
How about a white single breasted shawl lapel tux? That would be pracitcal. Would it be period?


Yep! Just replace that black waistcoat with a black cummerbund and Indy would be ready for action and period correct.

Marc Chevalier
05-08-2009, 12:03 PM
Would it be period?




See the man in the center of the 1936 newspaper illustration in post #93, above.


.

Forgotten Man
05-08-2009, 12:07 PM
See the man in the center of the 1936 newspaper illustration in post #93, above.


.

Yeah, what he said... ;)

avedwards
05-08-2009, 12:07 PM
So the costume department for "Tempe of Doom" had no excuse for using the jacket they used as Indy's tux.

Marc Chevalier
05-08-2009, 12:10 PM
They didn't need an excuse.


.

MrBern
05-21-2009, 05:48 PM
thought some of you might like this

Inglorious Basterds premiere at Cannes
http://themoment.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/05/21/cannes-heat-day-3-on-the-cote-dazur/#more-14417


For this very special occasion I wore a cream silk jacket with a shawl collar that got a lot of attention along the Croisette — or was it the low-cut black lace dress of my colleague walking by my side?

— we arrive at the first gate in the front of the Palais. Here the young, very badly dressed security guys take one look at me and tell me I cannot get in because I am not wearing a tuxedo. I protest that I am wearing a tuxedo. They call over an older, better dressed security guy and I explain in my Italian/French that I am wearing a tuxedo, just not a black tuxedo. He kindly suggests that I follow him and takes me to the service entrance, where all of the tuxedo policy offenders are rounded up and judged by the security-guy Style Council. My turn: black pattern shoes, okay. Black tuxedo pants, okay. White pleated tuxedo shirt with cuffs and silver cufflinks, okay. Black silk grosgrain bow tie that matches the cummerbund and tuxedo stripes on the pants, okay. Cream dinner jacket with shawl collar, maybe. But in the end, they let me pass.

chanteuseCarey
05-21-2009, 06:17 PM
So I went for the next best thing. Its a former rental and not vintage, but the little guy's only got a chest measuring 24-1/2" at this age! Here's what I did find for him on evilBay:

http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/zaccstore/ivorydbshawl.jpg
This will be perfect for any and all summer events and on the Queen Mary! Yeah, okay so it ain't wool, but this will have to do until he can fit in a size men's size 36S or 36R! Maybe Wingnut can pass down some things on to Daniel someday down the road if he ever outgrows or gets tired of them:) ! At least it is being appreciated that Daniel is making the effort to want to be appropriately and well dressed for Deco era events and such. He's got white tie and tails already and a single button tux jacket- we just bought him new tux pants in time for the Art Deco Ball that he can grow with for a while. Here's Daniel as dressed for the Art Deco Ball dress, minus his vintage beaver top hat that was checked at the time I took this picture. The lithe blonde with him is his sister (almost 15yo) wearing her vintage silk velvet with ermine trim evening gown.

http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL988/3409603/22046993/364900490.jpg

Chasseur
06-01-2009, 02:33 AM
Putting mine together... 1940s/50s Palm Beach dinner jacket.
http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL301/2025534/21333412/365901804.jpg

FinalVestige79
06-01-2009, 03:36 AM
So I went for the next best thing. Its a former rental and not vintage, but the little guy's only got a chest measuring 24-1/2" at this age! Here's what I did find for him on evilBay:

http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/zaccstore/ivorydbshawl.jpg
This will be perfect for any and all summer events and on the Queen Mary! Yeah, okay so it ain't wool, but this will have to do until he can fit in a size men's size 36S or 36R! Maybe Wingnut can pass down some things on to Daniel someday down the road if he ever outgrows or gets tired of them:) ! At least it is being appreciated that Daniel is making the effort to want to be appropriately and well dressed for Deco era events and such. He's got white tie and tails already and a single button tux jacket- we just bought him new tux pants in time for the Art Deco Ball that he can grow with for a while. Here's Daniel as dressed for the Art Deco Ball dress, minus his vintage beaver top hat that was checked at the time I took this picture. The lithe blonde with him is his sister (almost 15yo) wearing her vintage silk velvet with ermine trim evening gown.

http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL988/3409603/22046993/364900490.jpg


Your family astounds me CC, I wish my mother was tolerant of my being vintage...wanna adopt me? I'm a swell cook!

PADDY
11-11-2009, 01:11 PM
It's gotta to be summertime somewhere in the World..! ;) So let's see those white Dinner Jackets (or as the Cousins would say...Tux'es :) ).

From the Fanhams 1938 week...

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/SUMMER%201938%20WEEK/SUMMER1938340.jpg

cookie
11-11-2009, 01:40 PM
So I went for the next best thing. Its a former rental and not vintage, but the little guy's only got a chest measuring 24-1/2" at this age! Here's what I did find for him on evilBay:

http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/zaccstore/ivorydbshawl.jpg
/3409603/22046993/364900490.jpg[/IMG[/CENTER]


That jacket profile is so authentic with the bellied lapels.....

chanteuseCarey
11-11-2009, 02:07 PM
young Daniel wearing his ivory dinner jacket to the recent Mobster's Ball at the Verdi Club in SF, pictured with his sister in her lovely vintage 40s gown. I think they were the youngest attendees.
http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL988/3409603/22051867/376294414.jpg

chanteuseCarey
11-11-2009, 02:12 PM
I must say it my dear, as much as some dislike this term we ladies oft use here--- *swoon*;)

You look most dashing in this Paddy. Did the lady pictured with you get to dance an Argentine Tango with you? Or a Foxtrot?

I want this lady's complete outfit, made up in my best colors- especially those killer gloves!!


It's gotta to be summertime somewhere in the World..! ;) So let's see those white Dinner Jackets (or as the Cousins would say...Tux'es :) ).
From the Fanhams 1938 week...
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/SUMMER%201938%20WEEK/SUMMER1938340.jpg

chanteuseCarey
11-11-2009, 02:16 PM
Sure GG617, I don't cook... I just heat up! That is not meant to be as blatant as it probably sounds, honest...


Your family astounds me CC, I wish my mother was tolerant of my being vintage...wanna adopt me? I'm a swell cook!

chanteuseCarey
11-11-2009, 02:18 PM
Thanks cookie, can't beat it for 29 bucks off evilBay. Its terrific except that Daniel gets the darn thing so filthy every time he wears it. Our dry cleaners is a miracle worker on this.
That jacket profile is so authentic with the bellied lapels.....

Tailor Tom
11-11-2009, 02:32 PM
Getting back to the original question…. Dinner jackets were (and still are) made from lightweight and even tropical weight fabrics, worsted wool & Mohair being the most common. The Mohair was specially sought after, as it had great characteristics for the warms climes, for its wrinkle resistance and its generally more open weaving structure. Some even were advertised as “washable” (obviously with the understanding that the light color would show dirt), these were usually a cotton blend of some sort. Covered buttons (matching the lapel) were favored, but many had Mother of Pearl, true Ivory or Bone buttons. To facilitate breath-ability & comfort further, many Jackets were only half-lined. Trousers had a single braid down the outseam.

For the summer months (particularly in tropical locations), Ivory was the favored color choice for dinner jackets. But, most any non-black color was accepted. Some popular choices in the late 30’s were Midnight blue (double-breasted, shawl collar and brass buttons), along with a tan or beige. The 40’s saw a rise in the popularity of collars made from matching material, or synthetics as opposed to traditional silk collar/lapels, what with silk being scarce and used mainly in the military (parachutes). The 50’s saw an even wider palette of colors, including French Blues and Burgundies, tone-on-tone, along with the onset of plaid.

I recently acquired the fabric I will be using for my own upcoming Dinner Jacket, lightweight worsted wool & Cashmere, approx 8.5 oz. in the classic Ivory color. When it will get built is an open-ended question, much as the cobblers going shoeless, personal items are the very last things to be built.

Marc Chevalier
11-11-2009, 02:37 PM
Some popular choices in the late 30’s were Midnight blue (double-breasted, shawl collar and brass buttons),...



Brass buttons? Huh? :confused:


.

jamespowers
11-11-2009, 03:01 PM
Good points. Your Palm Beach materials were a cotton Mohair blend. I forget the percentages but here is a blurry picture of the cleaning instructions:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/jamespowers2005/palmbeachservice.jpg

A page from a 1916 suit catalog noting the cotton content of Palm Beach Material.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/jamespowers2005/1916-Palm-Beach.jpg

Palm Beach Label:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/jamespowers2005/30spalmbeachsuit5.jpg

Marc Chevalier
11-11-2009, 03:06 PM
I forget the percentages ...



;) You can't forget what you never knew. (The exact percentages were a 'company secret'.)


.

jamespowers
11-11-2009, 03:12 PM
;) You can't forget what you never knew. (The exact percentages were a 'company secret'.)


.


Actually they weren't. I have the percentages here somewhere. In fact, I think it was on the clothing itself about how much of each was used. On the ties I think it was. Something in the order of 55-45.
Here's another ad:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/jamespowers2005/PalmBeachad.jpg

chanteuseCarey
11-11-2009, 03:20 PM
I can clearly remember seeing a man in a wool ivory dinner jacket was way back when I was single, and attended a Michael Feinstein summer concert at the Paul Masson Winery in Saratoga, CA in 1989. M. Feinstein's DJ jacket had a herringbone weave in the fabric. My goodness, that jacket was the most gorgeous thing I'd ever seen... Mr. Feinstein was very easy on a lady's eyes that night, with a singing voice like velvet...
http://images.uulyrics.com/cover/m/michael-feinstein/album-romance-on-filmromance-on-broadway.jpg

Marc Chevalier
11-11-2009, 04:49 PM
Actually they weren't. I have the percentages here somewhere. In fact, I think it was on the clothing itself about how much of each was used. On the ties I think it was. Something in the order of 55-45.



I'd like to see that, since I've read the opposite in Goodall's own ads -- and I've never come across the percentages anywhere, despite having seen many, many vintage Palm Beach Cloth items.


Not denying what you're saying ... just want to see it in black and white.

.

jamespowers
11-11-2009, 04:56 PM
I'd like to see that, since I've read the opposite in Goodall's own ads -- and I've never come across the percentages anywhere, despite having seen many, many vintage Palm Beach Cloth items.


Not denying what you're saying ... just want to see it in black and white.

.


I'll have to look for it. I think it was on one of my bowties. It kind of surprised me as well when I noticed it. [huh]

Tailor Tom
11-11-2009, 05:03 PM
Brass buttons? Huh? :confused:


.

The brass button adornment was quoted from Esquire. And I have seen formal ware with brass buttons, I admit very rare and some ties to the military come to mind, but they are out there.

PADDY
11-12-2009, 04:48 AM
Hard to beat a white Tux, but...this 60's rendition just wouldn't work for 'me,' (totally personal choice), as the narrow lapels wouldn't flatter my body shape, in my humble opinion. But Messr's Hamm does 'Ham it Up' well in the outfit.

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/MADMEN/61mm_ep207_don_betty_760x535_7219.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/MADMEN/66mm_ep_207_don_betty_760x535_7599.jpg

Feraud
11-12-2009, 07:32 AM
I'll have to look for it. I think it was on one of my bowties. It kind of surprised me as well when I noticed it. [huh]

Please do check your bowtie. I recently saw a Palm Beach bowtie label and I believe there was the fabric content noted on it.

Marc Chevalier
11-12-2009, 08:17 AM
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/MADMEN/61mm_ep207_don_betty_760x535_7219.jpg
http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/ROSSANDHARRY/MADMEN/66mm_ep_207_don_betty_760x535_7599.jpg




Look closely at the photos; Don and Betty are inside the Oviatt Building's "Cicada" restaurant.


.

Marc Chevalier
11-12-2009, 08:23 AM
Please do check your bowtie. I recently saw a Palm Beach bowtie label and I believe there was the fabric content noted on it.



This is getting "curiouser and curiouser". I'm wondering whether the label is from before or after Goodall sold the Palm Beach Cloth name. In the '50s, when the name was sold, Palm Beach Cloth became simply "Palm Beach", and artificial fibers were added to the fabric.



.

jamespowers
11-12-2009, 10:24 AM
Please do check your bowtie. I recently saw a Palm Beach bowtie label and I believe there was the fabric content noted on it.

Woudn't you know that I forgot to check last night. :eusa_doh:
I am sure this bowtie is from before the 1954 sale of The Sanford Goodall mills to Burlington.
I'll check tonight for sure.
If someone happens to have one sitting around, check and post it here. :D

filfoster
11-16-2009, 11:30 AM
I bought a dinner jacket very similar to this at an eBay store. Off-white, 100% wool, double-breasted, shawl collar. Since I already had a black dinner jacket and pants, I figured this one would pair nicely with the black pants to give me more options. I might add two additional buttons above the existing ones to give it a more traditional look.
http://www.formalwearoutlet.com/EbayItems/DinnerJackets/IvoryDB.jpg
I just got my Magnoli dinner jacket and trousers today (how on earth do they pack these in a box the size of a small city telephone book?) and it looks exactly like this except for the cuff buttons (Magnoli uses three).

jamespowers
11-16-2009, 12:47 PM
This is getting "curiouser and curiouser". I'm wondering whether the label is from before or after Goodall sold the Palm Beach Cloth name. In the '50s, when the name was sold, Palm Beach Cloth became simply "Palm Beach", and artificial fibers were added to the fabric.



.


And the labels says:
50% rayon
35% mohair
10% cotton
5%

Marc Chevalier
11-16-2009, 01:27 PM
And the labels says:

50% rayon
35% mohair
10% cotton
5%



Interesting! There's something mysterious about this, too: the presence of rayon. The original Palm Beach Cloth came out (I believe in the early 'teens) before rayon was used for clothing textiles. At some point (the '20s? the '30s? the '40s?), Goodall changed Palm Beach Cloth's fabric content and percentages in order to include rayon. Clearly, at some point Goodall also decided not to keep those number secret anymore. Fascinating!



.

chanteuseCarey
11-16-2009, 05:55 PM
We're expecting to pics soon of you wearing this...:)


I just got my Magnoli dinner jacket and trousers today (how on earth do they pack these in a box the size of a small city telephone book?) and it looks exactly like this except for the cuff buttons (Magnoli uses three).

filfoster
11-17-2009, 06:18 AM
We're expecting to pics soon of you wearing this...:)

I am almost ashamed to post mentioning my garments because I am so handicapped at the picture technology! I would love to post some! Perhaps my daughters, when home for the holidays will oblige with a few. They have all the gizmos and know-how.
I warn you though, I have never been threatened with a modeling career although I have the brains, not the looks for it.

jamespowers
11-17-2009, 12:37 PM
Interesting! There's something mysterious about this, too: the presence of rayon. The original Palm Beach Cloth came out (I believe in the early 'teens) before rayon was used for clothing textiles. At some point (the '20s? the '30s? the '40s?), Goodall changed Palm Beach Cloth's fabric content and percentages in order to include rayon. Clearly, at some point Goodall also decided not to keep those number secret anymore. Fascinating!



.


50% rayon
32% mohair
12%cotton
6% nylon

I didn't get to finish the list out right. :eusa_doh: The Palm Beach fabric was certainly changed after WWII or maybe even a bit before. Before that it is neither the same weave nor the same fabric. The earliest mention I have seen of the Palm Beach fabric is 1916. [huh]
Now have a heart atttack about the inclusion of nylon. ;) :p

CheBsAs
09-21-2013, 11:01 AM
I would like to thank all of those who posted photos to this thread. I copied many of them and brought them to my tailor’s shop in Buenos Aires, Argentina in order to explain to him what I wanted. Attached is a photo of myself wearing the finished dinner jacket shaking hands with Francisco. I’m very happy with the way it turned out, and would not have been able to find the particular details necessary if it hadn't been for the excellent images you all gathered and shared

A question, has anybody faced any issues with their jackets changing color or yellowing over time? Do you have any tips on maintenance and/or storage? I hope to keep and maintain this dinner jacket for a very long time.

Have a nice day!

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7396/9858895286_4fc2654b25_o.jpg

thunderw21
09-21-2013, 06:42 PM
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b367/thunderw21/junk/001_zps88099860.jpg (http://s23.photobucket.com/user/thunderw21/media/junk/001_zps88099860.jpg.html)

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b367/thunderw21/junk/002_zps290711f8.jpg (http://s23.photobucket.com/user/thunderw21/media/junk/002_zps290711f8.jpg.html)

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b367/thunderw21/junk/005_zps4499c883.jpg (http://s23.photobucket.com/user/thunderw21/media/junk/005_zps4499c883.jpg.html)

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b367/thunderw21/junk/004_zpsaabfedf9.jpg (http://s23.photobucket.com/user/thunderw21/media/junk/004_zpsaabfedf9.jpg.html)