Yet More Aloofness

Mr Lilleythorpe · Dec 13, 2012

Hio! I've not really done much posting recently- just been stalking the place

But I decided I'd turn up at a minor WW2 day, at Berkely (I think?) Hall quite near where I live. I was going to go in mufti, but seeing 'All period clothing welcome!' on the bottom of the leaflet, I dug out my reenactment kit. As of yet, I don't have a unit I'm attached to, but I have fully-authentic officer's SD and BD uniforms, both finally completed and copied from period photographs and guides.

And thus, I arrived all went well, even getting free entry due to the uniform, and meeting two very nice US reenactors, more or less in the same boat I was. However, we were confronted in the courtyard by another reenactor, who, in no uncertain terms, told us that this was his group's event, and he wanted us to leave- as we were 'giving the wrong impression', despite the fact that I was wearing an identical uniform to his, and the Americans were both in what looked like accurate kit.

We didn't leave, in the end, but earned ourselves so many dirty looks from the other 'professionals' that I thought I'd post on here. I considered getting the groups name or something, but I don't think it would have served much purpose.

I was quite shocked, to be honest. Before I come over all indignant, is this normal, and was I actually in the wrong?

Cheers,
Joe.

ButteMT61 · Dec 13, 2012

I've been doing this a while. Like any hobby/passtime, there's nice folks and d*cks. You ran into the latter. It comes with the territory which is sad. We have a group that's pretty well-respected for our kits and attitude. That means we're not tools about gear, but have a high standard and try to help others get there. We had an event with a great group of people this last summer. They are not as sophisticated and don't have the best gear. I don't care. Those guys and gals are wonderful people and a lot of fun. Once the battles commence, who cares? If you continue on, just know there's both kinds out there - try to ignore the tools.

Mr Lilleythorpe · Dec 13, 2012

Thanks, but the irritating thing is, I had almost identical kit (which was early war officer's SD with puttees, boots and pistol order) to the person telling me I was too amateurish.

nice hat dude! · Dec 13, 2012

I think it falls into the category of..."How dare you upstage me at my event"

dhermann1 · Dec 14, 2012

I have to say, as a real military veteran, I resent the reenactors who are snotty like this. I mean, I have issues with the whole reenactor hting, but by the same token I do appreciate the respect for service that is at the heart of reenactment. And these little twirps who act like that are just jerks as far as I'm concerned.

ButteMT61 · Dec 14, 2012

True, good reenactors appreciate history, and those that served. Many also have. And yes, upstaging is an issue too for those with little fragile egos. To heck with 'em. You can't please everyone - don't even try. Even here, people get bent out fo shape for whatever reasons every day. Enjoy what you do and find folks of like minds.

Hunter_aka_Scotty · Dec 14, 2012

I am inclined to think there is more to this story.

Mr Lilleythorpe · Dec 14, 2012

Would you care to elaborate?

the hairy bloke · Dec 14, 2012

Be careful for what you wish for. You might not be happy with the result.

kiwilrdg · Dec 14, 2012

When you go to an event like that it is good form to find the host unit and thank them for inviting you (which since the leaflet said that all period clothing welcome, they did). Tell them what a nice event it is and compliment their camp or display. That shows that you appreciate the work they put into their impression and organizing the event.

'giving the wrong impression',

Perhaps you should have appologized and discussed what you could do that could present a better interpretation. Perhaps there was the wrong type of interaction with the public or improper handling of weapons rather than a problem with your kit. If you were asked to leave you should have talked to the head of the unit and worked things out. Not leaving, or at least clearing things up with the unit may be why you got those looks from the reenactors.

Just find a group with an impression style that you like and asking them how to join. This is sometimes best done in modern, or at least civilian kit because they might get the impression that you are trying to take over their group if you are in an officer uniform. When you ask about joining also be sure to ask what kit you need to have and if items that you have will work, almost identical kit may have anachronisms that they see that you do not.

Mr Lilleythorpe · Dec 14, 2012

Yes, kiwilrdg, I agree with you, and I'm sorry if I came over a little strongly. There style of interaction was sitting by tents with jeeps and weapons laid out. I assumed at the time it was to do with the American bods, seeing as their camp was British- even so, I wouldn't expect them to be turned away.

As an aside, I always take an empty holster as, legally, I can't take the yellow tape off my replica Webley without being in a group.

kiwilrdg · Dec 14, 2012

If you did not discuss the matter with the group you do not know what the issue really was.

Historical interpretation is difficult to do alone and reenacting is impossible to do alone. It is important to learn how to not offend folks. On the positive side, most reenactors do respond well to people asking how an impression can be improved.

Mr Lilleythorpe · Dec 14, 2012

I've not had much luck with them so far

rjb1 · Dec 15, 2012

Can you tell us about the protocols there for participation in events of varying sorts? Here, it's not unusual to have explicit warnings and policies banning "walk-ons" for tactical events. If an unknown and unregistered person just showed up they would be turned away for sure. (They would not even get on the field.)
This would be less in force (or possibly not at all) for display-only events. However, even some of those are by invitation only.
Are there such "rules" or unofficial policies over there?

p51 · Dec 15, 2012

Mr Lilleythorpe said:
'All period clothing welcome!' on the bottom of the leaflet

That says it all.
Of course, I habve no idea what you and the other two gents looked like, but I'm willing to accept those who suggest you simply upstaged the organizers. If that'd been me, I'd have laughed at them (mostly because I've been in the hobby since the 1980s and my impressions are always accurate) and said, "If you didn't want people showing up in uniforms, you shouldn't have invited them to do so on your leaflet," and walked away.
Re-enacting is very odd in that many re-enactors feel some manner of 'ownership' over a specific type of impression or unit designation. Veterans of said units really throw a curve into this, especially with Airborne impressions. Those who jumped from a C-141 in the 1990s in peacetime feel they have more a 'right' to wear a jumpsuit than those who hadn't (when in fact, neither did so in combat and certainly not in WW2, a point that is lost by those who claim said ownership).
I did, however, have an experience sort of along these lines. I went to an event in a part of the country I'd never been to before, and showed up invited by a friend, in a US Infantry impression, with all original gear and uniforms (back when most GIs wore all original stuff), and my shoulder patch was the same as a group already there. Someone played that childish, "You'll be mistaken for us" game. I looked the guy over and said, "You're right, I don't want to be mistaken for being in your unit... because your authenticity isn't remotely up to my standards." :eusa_clap
You could have heard a pin drop were it not for the German guys standing near by laughing their heads off (one of them offered to buy me a beer later for putting that guy in his place).

Hunter_aka_Scotty · Dec 22, 2012

Mr Lilleythorpe said:
Would you care to elaborate?

Nothing for me to elaborate upon. I believe there is more to this story. It seems it happens to you a lot and that it bothers you quite a bit. There are two sides to this story. There is obviously more to this.

MikeBravo · Jan 8, 2013

Hunter_aka_Scotty said:
Nothing for me to elaborate upon. I believe there is more to this story. It seems it happens to you a lot and that it bothers you quite a bit. There are two sides to this story. There is obviously more to this.

So, the old saying is true.

All answers are replies, however not all replies are answers

MikeBravo · Jan 8, 2013

kiwilrdg said:
If you did not discuss the matter with the group you do not know what the issue really was.

Historical interpretation is difficult to do alone and reenacting is impossible to do alone. It is important to learn how to not offend folks. On the positive side, most reenactors do respond well to people asking how an impression can be improved.

It would have been nice of he had been given the opportunity to discuss the matter, rather than being rudely told to leave.

Guttersnipe · Jan 8, 2013

Mr Lilleythorpe said:
. . . officer's SD and BD uniforms, both finally completed and copied from period photographs and guides . . .

Joe, I may have mentioned this before, but it's possible that by showing up in an officer's uniform you ruffled some feathers. I'm not sure how new to reenacting / living history you are, but in most organizations you quite literally have to earn your stripes (typically through seniority, election to club office, or a combination of the two).

Before I gave up regular reenacting, I was a elected officer in a West Coast American Civil War reenactment club. In that capacity, I served as the battalion adjutant of a Federal infantry battalion of approximately 200-300 officers and men (read: I had very real administrative, logistics, and chain of command responsibilities because of the number of people in our club).

Per historical U.S. Army regulations, I "ranked" a First Lieutenant. When our club hosted or attended large multi-club events, it was not uncommon that I would find myself the lowest ranked staff officer there, despite have three direct reports and actual responsibility (often smaller clubs would have an adjutants "ranked" as captain or even majors, which are the ranks appropriate for a regiment and a brigade, respectively, during the Civil War). When this occurred, I did find it a little irksome at times.

Hopefully that might help you see where these other guys might have been coming from.

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