USAF N-3B parkas - Let's talk about them!!

bn1966 said:

Nice Parka that, just had a look...wouldn't mind the black version & what a good price (agree about the orange lining).

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Still, the orange lining is great for the Feargal Sharkey impression. I'm actually a bit tempted to pick up a black one. The slightly more expensive GTH (a house brand) ones are also nice...

I like the N3A the best of the series with those exposed cuffs and the blue nylon, and zipping and buttoning right to the bottom. If only the sleeves were another inch or two longer...

Doctor Damage said:

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Where can I buy one??????????? Need more PINK though dude

Doctor Damage said:

Here's a 1972 issue N3B with a camo-printed lining, which I presume is an aftermarket job although it appears extremely well integrated.

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DD - I don't think this is an aftermarket job. This parka has the designation Mil 6279H whereas later the same year ie 1972, the designation turns to Mil 6279H (I) and back to olive green lining. All I can deduce is that there was a short run of camo lining perhaps because it was a shot at making it reversible in emergency situations?

Does anybody have any tips on spotting good surplus N3Bs? I'm eyeing a nice Skyline parka on eBay. The seller claims 1970s production. Is that a good manufacturer and vintage? Would the fur ruff be real or synthetic? Insight much appreciated!

Hi EarlGrey,
I'd say that Skyine is one of the more preferable makers (mine is an Albert Turner. I consider them to be good too) - but I'd try to veer towards the earlier vintages if funds and time allow. Just keep trawling the websites and see as many as you can - and you'll get a good sense of what's out there, the colours, the zips, the conditions of them all and what's the general value.
In general, I'd look for a jacket that has a black makers label in it - they're older models and have more appeal as the quality went down as the decades went by - and they subsequently had white labels. If you look at the copies that Buzz Ricksons make, they too have black labels - they knew which ones to copy!
I'd say a good body is key as well as a working zip - missing buttons isn't a deal-breaker to an otherwise-appealing jacket as they can be found on eBay and can be sewn on (as I did mine).
Some have USAF decals (ranging from the faded or near-invisible to the bright and looking great) and some don't at all - would that be a point of interest for you?
Some have reflective trim and others are plain - it all depends on your personal preference.
Some have a sheen to their nylon (better quality nylon as a rule of thumb - again, see Buzz Ricksons for the specs on what makes the nylon so special) and the later ones have a matt look - and IMO aren't as appealing.
Some have plush fur ruffs but many have worn fur ruffs but they can be found on-line and replaced, along with the knits, but that's a minor pain to organize but not insurmountable, so really, try to find one that ticks enough boxes for you. Something with stains I'd avoid and keep hunting for something cleaner.
And there's a wealth of people here who know these jackets really well who can guide you better. I got mine and believed its vintage to be 1960-ish - and I posted the label here for help and was instantly told it was mid- to late-1950s!
There are tons of them out there (and the prices aren't going up) - so your patience and research will be rewarded.
Good hunting!

^ To add, there are tons of the 3rd generation sage green ones and they can be had cheaply. Sometimes the wolf fur ruffs are disintegrating, which doesn't show in photos but when you get it and clumps come off in your hands you'll realize it's something which might need replacement. These are also "wide-body" coats - not for those who are slim and/or tall. Although quality supposedly declines, I don't agree and the current models are extremely robust and effective parkas; what changed is the materials and trims, if you are a nylon nut then stick with vintage. As for the nylon itself, I have sitting upstairs a mid-50s Albert Turner N3B and a 1990s Alpha civilian MA-1, and the nylon is only slightly thicker on the vintage parka.

So from what I gather so far, black label good, white label not so much. Fur/Synthetic ruff would always be questionable, but can be replaced anyway. I know Greenbrier and Southern Athletic are good, guess I can add Skyline and Albert Turner. Outer fabric went from a cotton blend over to nylon, and liner went from wool to nylon?

Does it make that much of a difference though, especially when compared to a civilian Alpha? I see a few recent vintage Proppers on the market, which I suspect is the current contractor. Did the battening decrease as time went by, so newer coats are less warm/durable? I guess what I'm asking is: Is this like peacoats where earlier vintage wool really do make something of a difference, or are vintage N3Bs sought after because they're Vintage?

EarlGrey said:

So from what I gather so far, black label good, white label not so much. Fur/Synthetic ruff would always be questionable, but can be replaced anyway. I know Greenbrier and Southern Athletic are good, guess I can add Skyline and Albert Turner. Outer fabric went from a cotton blend over to nylon, and liner went from wool to nylon?

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Differences between manufacturers in the 1950s and 1960s are not going to be significant. The fanatics will disagree, but they won't be able to prove their position. My suggestion with the vintage ones is to ignore the manufacturer and get the best condition you can afford. The original military parkas shells were nylon, the liners nylon, with wool/cotton pile insulation and real fur ruff. Today, the military parkas have a cotton blend shell, cotton liner, and synthetic insulation with synthetic fur ruff. See also below.

Does it make that much of a difference though, especially when compared to a civilian Alpha? I see a few recent vintage Proppers on the market, which I suspect is the current contractor. Did the battening decrease as time went by, so newer coats are less warm/durable? I guess what I'm asking is: Is this like peacoats where earlier vintage wool really do make something of a difference, or are vintage N3Bs sought after because they're Vintage?

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The modern day military parkas use different materials and detailing than the vintage ones as I noted above, but they're every bit as hard-core when it comes to keeping you warm. The civilian Alpha parkas are much inferior and are suitable only for regular use by regular folks going about their daily lives. The modern day military parkas are arguably too heavy for daily use unless you spend a lot of time outside in winter in Alaska or Minnesota or Canada.

I only made the comment about the nylon since it's an article of faith that vintage USAF nylon is some sort of miraculous material not seen today, but in reality Alpha's early civilian nylon from the 1980s and 1990s wasn't significantly inferior. Inside baseball.

As the Doc States above.

I've flirted with 50's USAF NYLON Parkas & have generally been happy. The only unexpected problem Encountered has been the mouton inside Parka hoods starting to come apart..worth asking about condition prior to purchase..varies from ropey to excellent.

Yep, have found some Alpha civilian nylon jackets to be very good quality & non vintage USAF items extremely serviceable.

Terrific info!

So far I've nailed down on largely surplus (70s seem very common and quite cheap), lots of stuff on eBay by Skyline for some reason.

For civilian coats, I see some Spiewak Golden Fleeces floating around. These would probably be attractive, although I suspect prices are about to shoot up, what with Spiewak ending their US productions if rumors are to be believed. Haven't seen any vintage Alphas, but I haven't looked too hard for Alphas.

How's the sizing on these things? True to size, or should I size down?

EarlGrey said:

How's the sizing on these things? True to size, or should I size down?

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Sizing for vintage military nylon or modern-day military? I posted the official size chart earlier in this thread for the modern day military parkas, although they chart isn't very accurate in my limited experience. Even so, these fit super wide in the chest and shoulders, but a bit short in the arms. I'm 6'1" and 175 lbs and I should take a size Large, but I look like I'm an NFL player wearing one of those rain coats they wear during a game over top of their full gear, and the arms need another inch. I've learned the hard way to avoid the military parkas of all ages due to these fit problems for me. If they did the military parks in a size Medium Long then I'd be set, but the Medium is too short and the Large too wide and short. However, if you are a Regular or Short height person and a bit bulky in the torso (too many beers!) then these parkas could be just the thing for you.

>>>> Just my opinions based on my observations. Buyer take caution, etc etc. ha ha

As for the civilian parkas, they're not in the same league as old and new military. They really are a separate discussion, frankly.

So reporting back on my N3B quest. I snagged a near-mint parka off eBay. Greenbrier 1980s production. I decided to forgo the real fur ruff in exchange for not having to worry about bugs getting to them. Besides, for 70 bucks I can't complain!

I can see what people mean by the parka fit. The shoulders seem to be extra puffed up due to the stitching used, making me look like an NFL linebacker. The parka also has some vastly powerful heating compared to my modern civilian Alpha. The hood also fits differently, less concessions made for style and ease of use, but much more focused on keeping the wearer warm.

However, I was wondering. How is the insulation distributed on your coats? On my coat the insulation in the shoulders seem thinner than the rest of the coat. In comparison my Alpha's insulation is more evenly distributed around the parka. Just wondering if that's by design.

I was in Strategic Air Command during the 1980's and wore my N3-b half the year. There weren't very many snipers in Great Falls Montana, but there was enough freezing cold and blowing snow for a life time. The vast majority of Air Force Airmen never get anywhere near a ground combat situation. Enjoy your parka, I loved mine.

EarlGrey said:

So reporting back on my N3B quest. I snagged a near-mint parka off eBay. Greenbrier 1980s production. I decided to forgo the real fur ruff in exchange for not having to worry about bugs getting to them. Besides, for 70 bucks I can't complain!

I can see what people mean by the parka fit. The shoulders seem to be extra puffed up due to the stitching used, making me look like an NFL linebacker. The parka also has some vastly powerful heating compared to my modern civilian Alpha. The hood also fits differently, less concessions made for style and ease of use, but much more focused on keeping the wearer warm.

However, I was wondering. How is the insulation distributed on your coats? On my coat the insulation in the shoulders seem thinner than the rest of the coat. In comparison my Alpha's insulation is more evenly distributed around the parka. Just wondering if that's by design.

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Congratulations! I am not sure on the insulation distribution, mines a 70s issue. I can tell you, if it's like mine, even when it is below zero it gets really hot if you are shoveling snow!

This is the big discussion thread for N3B parkas.