Dinner and Dancing

I thought a thread on this might be fun (Bartenders: if there is one, please feel free to move this post there or eliminate it altogether - no hard feelings).

Based on TV shows, movies, books from the period (in addition to speaking with several people I've known from the Golden Era and cultural, social, historical books I've read / documentaries I've seen on the period), it seems that going out to dinner and dancing was incredibly common and popular.

While we are probably all familiar - from the movies - with the idea of wealthy people in the Golden Era getting all dressed up and going out to fancy restaurants for dinner and dancing, it seems that it was quite common for people to go to very ordinary places and dance to either a small band, a jukebox or even a radio. These where not high-end places, but quite often (at least in the movies) dives, bars or diners.

Since I'm old enough to just bridge the gap, it doesn't seem crazy to me, but I bet most people under 40 and definitely under 30 would see this as some "crazy thing people did back in the day." Sure, there is dancing at weddings and a few dinner-dance places still exist, but from the above-mentioned sources, it seems that a meaningful number of places that served food also offered, or at least allowed for, dancing.

I don't have a specific example in mind, but regularly, when I'm watching TCM, a couple might be in a basic, not-fancy restaurant and a song will come on the radio and they'll get up and dance - sometimes on a small dance floor, sometimes just in an open area - and there might or might not be other couples doing the same, but nobody looks askance at them. This also happens at home where you'll see, in a movie of the period, a couple - middle class or working class (not just the swells) - start dancing in their living room or kitchen to a song on the radio (especially, but not exclusively) if they are eating or drinking.

One thought I've always had was that in a period of, at least outwardly, restrictive sexual codes and norms, dancing was an acceptable way to get physically close in a prurient manner. Today - if some TV shows are to be believed - some young men and women have sex and then go on their date so that it isn't "hanging out there," but back in the GE, dancing was one of the few publicly and even privately acceptable ways to get intimate.

I was wondering what others thought about this cultural norm / what experiences they had with it / memories of it / impressions from their parents / knowledge of its history / etc?

"Roadhouses"were very popular in the 1930s -- these were restaurants located on the outskirts of a town or city which usually featured moderately-priced food and an area for dancing. In the divey places the music would come from a jukebox, but it was common for even a moderately-priced roadhouse to feature a live orchestra. There were many "territory bands" which played in small venues like this in a particular area of the country -- they weren't usually nationally known because it was rare for a roadhouse to have a radio wire for remote broadcasts -- but they would occasionally become popular enough that they'd make a few recordings.

My grandfather led such a small orchestra in the mid-1930s and played in a lot of roadhouses in New England and Atlantic Canada -- the dancing was usually very stiff, and the tempos were selected accordingly. Most of the music was fox trots and waltzes played in an unchallenging "businessman's bounce" tempo. The roadhouses themselves were built like large function halls with one end of the rooom set up with a small bandstand, an area for dancing, and then an area at the other end of the room for the dining tables.

There were roadhouses, though, that were very famous and hosted name bands. The Meadowbrook, "on the Newark-Pompton Turnpike in Cedar Grove, New Jersey," owned by former bandleader Frank Dailey, was legendary in the Era as a spot where the top bands of the moment played -- Tommy Dorsey was practically the resident bandleader there during much of 1940, and the Casa Loma Orchestra wasn't far behind. The Meadowbrook had an NBC radio wire, so bookings there were highly coveted by bands looking for radio exposure. The proximity of the Meadowbrook to New York meant it got a lot of the city trade, people willing to drive a few miles out of town to dance to a favorite orchestra. It was a far more upscale place than the usual roadhouse, but it wasn't a shiny art-deco cliche kind of thing -- it was decorated much more in a "small-town" style than its clientele might suggest.

Dinner & dancing at a nice place was the norm to get acquainted with a girl.
Even if there was no dance floor, dancing to the music on the jukebox was great.

I have never related with night clubs as a way to enjoy an evening with someone
that I like to get to know better.

The art, or social norm, that was partner dancing, seemed to die in the sixties. The ballroom disciplines were fading in the fifties, but jiving was still very popular. Just like the attention to attire and it's demise, so too has dancing slid from favour. My wife jokes that partner dancing was helped in it's decline when the ladies stopped dancing with their men and started dancing with their handbags. (purses.) In the sixties it was common to see a gaggle of girls, on the ballroom floor, with their bags near them for security.

Dancing for my wife and I has been a life long passion, we met through dancing. We just missed the zenith of Latin & Ballroom, but dance still brought us a wonderful social group of friends. As FF so eloquently described, dancing is easily the most accepted way of social intimacy, as long as the rules of social etiquette are observed.
In the last ten years I've noticed that more and more establishments are setting aside a dance area, so too are those places booking live bands. Whether that's due to the popularity of shows like, Dancing with the Stars/Strictly Come Dancing, or not is anyone's guess. Maybe it's a coincidence, who cares? For now I'm just enjoying the renaissance, and the fact that I get asked to dance by many a young lady.

Dance Halls, as we call them in Texas, have always been popular (Gruene Hall, built in 1878, is probably the most famous), and feature either live music or music from a jukebox or DJ. They typically have drinks, but usually don't offer food. Some will have a separate restaurant where you might get simple country cooking or BBQ, but you typically don't eat and dance at the same place.

When I was growing up in the UK, the dinner dance concept was quite popular. I recall when my girlfriend and I were planning to get married in the early 70's, we took her parents to such an event in Clacton-on-Sea (yes, really!), where the main act was a singer called Kathy Kirby (some of the older Brits will remember her I'm sure). The idea was to ask the father if it was ok to marry his daughter. The prospective Father in Law said yes, which is just as well because he was my boss at the time and would have created an interesting working dynamic if he wasn't impressed

Had we still been married, we would have gotten to 40 years, last month.


Cheers!
David!

DJH said:

When I was growing up in the UK, the dinner dance concept was quite popular. I recall when my girlfriend and I were planning to get married in the early 70's, we took her parents to such an event in Clacton-on-Sea (yes, really!), where the main act was a singer called Kathy Kirby (some of the older Brits will remember her I'm sure). The idea was to ask the father if it was ok to marry his daughter. The prospective Father in Law said yes, which is just as well because he was my boss at the time and would have created an interesting working dynamic if he wasn't impressed

Had we still been married, we would have gotten to 40 years, last month.


Cheers!
David!

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Great story, love "Clacton-on-Sea," but one has to think that the eventual divorcing of the boss' daughter also makes for an interesting story of a family / work dynamic in flux and tension.

My aunt and uncle in California went dancing back in the 50s and 60s. My aunt picked up my uncle from wherever he was working--he worked as a lineman--and go straight to a dance place. He was still in his work clothes--no ermine and pearls in that scene.

Paisley said:

My aunt and uncle in California went dancing back in the 50s and 60s. My aunt picked up my uncle from wherever he was working--he worked as a lineman--and go straight to a dance place. He was still in his work clothes--no ermine and pearls in that scene.

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That's part of what I find so fascinating about it (and tried to capture in my opening post), this wasn't just about the swells, regular people, in diners, dives, bars were dancing during dinner. Great story about your aunt and uncle - love it.

Here's a fella in blue jeans
Dancin' with an older queen
Who's dolled up in her diamond rings and
Twistin' the night away
Man, you oughta see her go
Twistin' to the rock and roll
Here you find the young and old
Twistin' the night away

from "Twistin' the Night Away" by Sam Cooke

Fading Fast said:

Great story, love "Clacton-on-Sea," but one has to think that the eventual divorcing of the boss' daughter also makes for an interesting story of a family / work dynamic in flux and tension.

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No problem - I was working aways from there by then. He's a good guy, in his 90's now and poorly, but I always call and see him when I'm back in the UK.

DJH said:

No problem - I was working aways from there by then. He's a good guy, in his 90's now and poorly, but I always call and see him when I'm back in the UK.

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It always says a lot when someone stays in touch with their in-laws after a divorce. I get along very well with my girlfriend of twenty years, but I always joke with her that if we did break up, I still get to go home at Christmas to spend time with her parents - she'll just have to deal with it. Her comeback is that they'd probably choose me over her (not really, but we are lucky, we all get along very well).

In the closest big city to me, there is an old, historic building that has a large ballroom and a smaller dance hall that both have various ballroom, swing (sometimes with a live band!), and Latin dance nights, as well as a restaurant/bar, all on the same floor of the building, but in completely separate rooms. You can get something close to the old-fashioned "dinner and dancing" experience, but you cannot watch the dancing while you dine and drink.

And there's the rub; the dining and the dancing are managed as completely separate operations. There are probably different ordinances, codes, etc. for restaurants vs. dance clubs/halls, not to mention the logistics of trying to mix the two. It would likely be a nightmare to combine ballroom dancing with a decent level of dining, with respectable entrees and good-quality beverages, without the whole thing being prohibitively expensive. And besides, it gets HOT in the ballroom with so many people dancing in close quarters! Who would want to eat in there?

The only places I can think of in my area that have both food and dancing are rave or hip-hop (or the occasional honkytonk) nightclubs that only serve simple bar food, or some restaurants that have been around a few decades, and have a separate bar section that happens to have a tiny little dance floor where the clientelle never stopped doing disco.

Partner dancing does seem to be something that went out the window somewhere between my parents generation and mine. Certainly by the time I was going to school discos (or, more commonly, standing around outsdie them grousing about the appalling pop music being played), dancing was wholly dismissed as 'for girls', any guy with any talent or interest in that area, let along being any good at it, was automatically dismissed in some rather unpleasant, homophobic terms.

The 'Gap Khakis' ad of the early nineties did spring a boom in lindy hop which extended from the US - I dabbled with that at a time, but found it an unpleasant scene. Cliquey. Lindy Hoppers (as opposed to nice people who just happen to dance lindy hop) are an odd bunch, all about learning a routine rather than social dancing per se, and extremely selfish on the dancefloor (all my own experience, though surprisingly common in temrs of what I hear reported elsewhere). Jive, which I stumbled across a few years later, has in my experience been the polar opposite. Cracking fun. Feels like the majority of folks are there for the same reason I am - that they love the music, and that makes them want to move to it. I like that. Plenty of jive nights here and there, and some gigs (depending on room in the venue) see a dancefloor break out. It's definitely a scene thing now, though - I don't get the impression that partnered dancing of any variety just happens spontaneously in the mainstream any longer. That said, it does seem to be a hobby that has become more popular with the rise of dance-based shows on television; hopefully that will be longer-lasting than the gardening craze that came when those shows were popular.