Double breasted waistcoats, slipped version

ErWeSa · Jun 8, 2015

Ladies and Gentlemen,

I love double breasted waistcoats and possess some originals:

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Some time ago, when my financial situation allowed this, I had several made to measure, this is the one which worked out best:

Now to my questions: does anybody possess a slipped version of a double breasted waistcoat? I would be interested in seeing how the material (I presume it is white piqué) is attached to the inside? Does anybody know to which occasions one would wear such an item?

The only living person I know of who wears slipped waistcoats is his HRH the Prince of Wales:

One can see that the "slip" is made of piqué, he seems to wear a detachable collar as well and the black waiscoat displays silk edging/braiding - a wonderful piece.

Two Types · Jun 8, 2015

There was a discussion about these but I can't remember where it was. I think there is a general thread on waistcoats, try that.

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/show...us-your-waistcoats-Vests&highlight=waistcoats

I'm sure that Anthony Jordan (who started that thread) has posted about slipped waistcoats.

It might need you to do some long searches. Sorry I can't be more helpful at the moment.

ErWeSa · Jun 8, 2015

Thanks

Two Types said:
There was a discussion about these but I can't remember where it was. I think there is a general thread on waistcoats, try that.

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/show...us-your-waistcoats-Vests&highlight=waistcoats

I'm sure that Anthony Jordan (who started that thread) has posted about slipped waistcoats.

It might need you to do some long searches. Sorry I can't be more helpful at the moment.

Thank you very much for the hint Two Types! I was trying to find a thread on the forum but wasn't able to. Great material there.

Rabbit · Jun 8, 2015

ErWeSa, I'm certain that I've seen slipped waistcoats in combination with three-piece lounge suits, as an odd waistcoat or to match, being worn in 1930s movies (i.e. period movies, not recent ones) to portray well-to-do (or just very well dressed) men. Just mentioning it because one might easily be led to think that it was exclusive to formal morning wear throughout the decades, which it wasn't.

ErWeSa · Jun 8, 2015

Rabbit said:
ErWeSa, I'm certain that I've seen slipped waistcoats in combination with three-piece lounge suits, as an odd waistcoat or to match, being worn in 1930s movies (i.e. period movies, not recent ones) to portray well-to-do (or just very well dressed) men. Just mentioning it because one might easily be led to think that it was exclusive to formal morning wear throughout the decades, which it wasn't.

Thank you Rabbit! I wore the waiscoat without back (in picture 4) for my wedding with a morning coat and when I was younger some of the other ones with different suits - so I seem not to have been too far away from what once was considered not to be too exclusive (even if the vests were/are not slipped) although wearing suits and waistcoats was already regarded as "extraordinary" (to put it positively) at that time (I was a student then).

Rabbit · Jun 8, 2015

Same here, about wearing suits - vintage ones - at the university I mean.

The general idea of the slipped waistcoat is of course that the white border signifies cleanliness and as such, wealth. Like the white pique waistcoat of full dress, it needs regular cleaning - it probably needed cleaning more often when exposed to city life in late 19th/ early 20th century Machine Age.
I have no sources to substantiate this, but I imagine that slipped waistcoats with lounge suits were never common, and limited to those who took extra care in their way of dressing.

F. J. · Jun 9, 2015

Slips . . .

The traditional material for waistcoat slips is white Marcella, often called piqué on this side of the pond. They simply button to the back of the lapels so that they may be easily removed for cleaning.

Here is an example I found:

And another:

With single-breasted waistcoats, it is fairly straightforward, but a problem arises with the double-breasted variety:

See how the slip extends well past the lapel crossing? Slips are supposed to imitate an under-waistcoat, but this ruins the illusion entirely. Aside from that, it just looks off.

Prince Charles avoids this problem by simply having his slips cross right over left, but there must be a better way to do it.

ErWeSa · Jun 9, 2015

Dear F.J.,
thanks a lot for the photos. Interesting that there are two versions of the slip: one that goes round the neck and the other one that doesn't. The doublebreasted vest is awesome!
Wish I had a source where I could get something like it for a reasonable price (my London flea market days are over).
I noticed Prince Charles' solution and that was why I wondered how the slip is attached - there must be a button behind the lapel that holds both "ends" of the slip.

F. J. · Jun 9, 2015

Pictures . . .

ErWeSa said:
Dear F.J.,
thanks a lot for the photos. Interesting that there are two versions of the slip: one that goes round the neck and the other one that doesn't. The doublebreasted vest is awesome!
Wish I had a source where I could get something like it for a reasonable price (my London flea market days are over).
I noticed Prince Charles' solution and that was why I wondered how the slip is attached - there must be a button behind the lapel that holds both "ends" of the slip.

My pleasure, though they’re not mine. I found them through an image search for ‘waistcoat slips’. The first image is from a waistcoat owned by the afore-mentioned Mr. Jordan.

The second image is from an article on bespoke morning dress by Mr. Francis Bown.

The third happens to be from the Style Forum.

I imagine one could make his own slips from a yard or two of suitable Marcella and six or eight nice buttons. I may eventually do it to one or two of mine myself. They’re removable, so you could wear the waistcoat slipless when not in morning dress.

Strapped-4-Cache · Jun 10, 2015

Amazon recently included 'Mr. Selfridge' as part of the programs available to Prime members, and I noticed the main character can be seen wearing slips with his waistcoats. I'll need to go back and view some of the episodes to be sure, but I could swear that he even had some red slips as part of the wardrobe.

I'm thinking about trying to work up a pattern to include with my morning dress. I don't wear it often, but the subtle pop of color seems that it could add a bit of interest to the outfit.

Anthony Jordan · Jun 11, 2015

Just checking in! ErWeSa, you may wish to know that an eBay seller is offering new slips, made by their in-house tailor, for £35 a pair, in both styles illustrated above. This is much cheaper than Ede & Ravensvroft, who were charging £65 last time I heard. A search for "waistcoat slips" should find them. As to wearing them with a d/b waistcoat, I am lending mine to a friend for Ascot & shall ask for pictures, if any one is interested to see them. Anthony

ErWeSa · Jun 11, 2015

Thank you, Strapped-4-Cache and Anthony Jordan, for your comments/tips. I sure am interested in seeing photos of Ascot and the doublebreasted waistcoats with or without slip being worn there (plus the top hats and morning coats).

Anthony Jordan · Jun 11, 2015

I will see what I can do, with pleasure.

I would like to raise one small caveat in relation to slip material. I have handled perhaps three or four sets of slips, and whilst they were all made of material which was used in other contexts for white waistcoats, ties, etc, none of them were in the "dimpled" fabric which we now know as marcella/pique: rather the fabric was ribbed, as in the examples below (apologies for poor picture):

F. J. · Jun 11, 2015

Ribbing . . .

Anthony Jordan said:
[...] rather the fabric was ribbed, as in the examples below (apologies for poor picture): [...]

I’m having trouble seeing the ribbing in the image. In what direction is the ribbing? Is it anything like grosgrain?

Anthony Jordan · Jun 12, 2015

Yes, it's a poor photograph. I will try and take a better one when I get the slips back. In the meanitime, the ribbing is horizontal, the ribs being a little thicker than grosgrain,

ErWeSa · Jun 14, 2015

Anthony Jordan said:
Yes, it's a poor photograph. I will try and take a better one when I get the slips back. In the meanitime, the ribbing is horizontal, the ribs being a little thicker than grosgrain,

Gentlemen: I think I know what AJ means, I possess 2 dress-vests with such a ribbing:

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Rabbit · Jun 14, 2015

I own a white bow tie or two made of such fabric. There's lots of such bows around in patterns slightly different from the standard Marcella, to match the waistcoat of course.

Grosgrain can have different widths of the ribs, so I doubt that the fabric above would have any other name than cotton grosgrain. Grosgrain, just like satin, is a weave and not a fabric, after all.

Since I got my first dinner clothes, I always wondered if the grosgrain facings are actually pure silk, or rather silk and cotton - or organic rayon and cotton, like hatbands.

Anthony Jordan · Jun 14, 2015

That's very much the sort of fabric.

AlmostDecapitatedByMyCollar · Mar 26, 2017

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