USAF N-3B parkas - Let's talk about them!!

Doctor Damage · Feb 20, 2018

bla-ake said:
Thanks for taking a look by the way.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Military-N...s-Medium-Greenbrier-Jacket-Coat-/162774632134
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Greenbrier-Industries-Inc-N-3B-Cold-Weather-Parka-/131973782507

Both appear to be genuine to me, but that's no guarantee. When I get home tonight I'll dig through my collection of photos and check tags, etc.

Just remember, if you're looking to buy one of these, they fit wide and short. So if you're over 6' and/or skinny, avoid.

MeachamLake · Feb 20, 2018

Doctor Damage said:
Both appear to be genuine to me, but that's no guarantee. When I get home tonight I'll dig through my collection of photos and check tags, etc.

Just remember, if you're looking to buy one of these, they fit wide and short. So if you're over 6' and/or skinny, avoid.

Strangely, I'm 6 foot 3 and I found the '60 Skyline N3B I purchased to fit fine length wise. That was in a size XL. Although it was too big, the width of the shoulders (raglan construction too) made the sleeves fine.

Perhaps difference contracts vary in terms of length though?

bla-ake · Feb 20, 2018

Doctor Damage said:
Both appear to be genuine to me, but that's no guarantee. When I get home tonight I'll dig through my collection of photos and check tags, etc.

Just remember, if you're looking to buy one of these, they fit wide and short. So if you're over 6' and/or skinny, avoid.

Thanks for the heads up, I'm 5 foot 10 so I think I'll be alright. I had a Lancer MFG & a Workroom for Designers, Inc. one before they seemed fairly the same in length.

bn1966 · Feb 20, 2018

Had a look at a few contracts, your links appear genuine Service Parkas to me too, could have used an N-3B over here recently since I sold my Irvin

Doctor Damage · Feb 20, 2018

Doctor Damage said:
Both appear to be genuine to me, but that's no guarantee. When I get home tonight I'll dig through my collection of photos and check tags, etc.

Looking at photos, it appears on more recent issue dates the MIL-etc. is not on the tag, only older issues (up to the 70s, guess-timate).

bla-ake · Feb 21, 2018

Cool thanks for checking, yeah it seems pretty on and off I've seen them on the Greenbriers up to 86-87 and there are others that I saw when I scoured some pictures that had the MIL-etc and some that didn't, but it could have just been a different manufacturing contract.

Doctor Damage · Mar 10, 2018

Monsoon · Mar 10, 2018

I tried on my fathers Skyline N-3B in Medium last week and it was snug in the shoulders and the sleeves were short. It was too bad, since it was in outstanding condition.

My niece has it now and has gotten a lot of good wear out of it recently in NE PA.

Setok · Jul 18, 2018

Every now and then I ponder about acquiring an N-3B. It's not really my regular style and, if I'm honest, I have too many winter coats already (I love those great coats!), but then again, it is a classic, and still available at low prices. I was turned off Alpha after learning their version is now manufactured outside the US. Obviously this all happened without a drop in price. At the same time I really don't appreciate any drop in spec, as I live in Finland so it really should be putting up with temperatures as low as -30C.

I just bumped into a version by Valley Apparel, which is an actual US military supplier, and the parka appears to be done to military spec, and made in the USA. Sold here at least:

http://www.usarmynavystore.com/va-made-in-usa-n3b-sage-green

Edited to add, it is claimed the factory is the one that has been making them for decades. So perhaps someone acquired the capacity after Alpha, or someone else, stopped manufacturing?

Any thoughts or experiences?

MeachamLake · Jul 18, 2018

Setok said:
Every now and then I ponder about acquiring an N-3B. It's not really my regular style and, if I'm honest, I have too many winter coats already (I love those great coats!), but then again, it is a classic, and still available at low prices. I was turned off Alpha after learning their version is now manufactured outside the US. Obviously this all happened without a drop in price. At the same time I really don't appreciate any drop in spec, as I live in Finland so it really should be putting up with temperatures as low as -30C.

I just bumped into a version by Valley Apparel, which is an actual US military supplier, and the parka appears to be done to military spec, and made in the USA. Sold here at least:

http://www.usarmynavystore.com/va-made-in-usa-n3b-sage-green

Edited to add, it is claimed the factory is the one that has been making them for decades. So perhaps someone acquired the capacity after Alpha, or someone else, stopped manufacturing?

Any thoughts or experiences?

I saw these as well back when I was looking N3-Bs. I don't think it's mil-spec, as it has too many buttons on the front - the authentic jackets only have four buttons, most civillian versions (including the Alpha) have five.

The best looking cheaper repros I came across were all on Rakuten at various stores. I've always found ordering and shipping to the UK to be very fast. ZenMarket is also an excellent proxy service to buy from Japan that I would highly recommend.

Waiper is a brand which looks like it exclusively rips off Buzz Rickson products and has them remade in Chinese factories - they do a damn good job though from a visual standpoint because they look near identical. Unfortunately they don't go up to my size (44!): https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/auc-waiper/item/nojd72906111/

Avirex Japan also makes a very nice looking N3-B: https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/revolut1/item/6152145073xxl/

As does Buzz Rickson's sister brand United Carr: https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/earthmarket/item/uc13087/

Flightengineer · Jul 18, 2018

Setok said:
Every now and then I ponder about acquiring an N-3B. It's not really my regular style and, if I'm honest, I have too many winter coats already (I love those great coats!), but then again, it is a classic, and still available at low prices. I was turned off Alpha after learning their version is now manufactured outside the US. Obviously this all happened without a drop in price. At the same time I really don't appreciate any drop in spec, as I live in Finland so it really should be putting up with temperatures as low as -30C.

I just bumped into a version by Valley Apparel, which is an actual US military supplier, and the parka appears to be done to military spec, and made in the USA. Sold here at least:

http://www.usarmynavystore.com/va-made-in-usa-n3b-sage-green

Edited to add, it is claimed the factory is the one that has been making them for decades. So perhaps someone acquired the capacity after Alpha, or someone else, stopped manufacturing?

Any thoughts or experiences?

N3B not for Finland winter IMO,
If only wear warmed pants with.
Anyway, it's pretty short for real cold winter and if you wear jeans (not warm flight overalls or flight pants wih this jacket), then the cold wind will get to your values in your pants

LaymanX · Jul 18, 2018

I absolutely love my Spiewak Golden Fleece N3B parka but it's a bit long in the tooth now. Any recommendations for a top notch quality N3B parka? I need real fur and hopefully no decal.

handymike · Jul 18, 2018

Mine is a Spiewak Golden Fleece as well. A bit large for me, but a great Winter coat IMHO.

Setok · Jul 20, 2018

MeachamLake said:
I saw these as well back when I was looking N3-Bs. I don't think it's mil-spec, as it has too many buttons on the front - the authentic jackets only have four buttons, most civillian versions (including the Alpha) have five.

I'm not too concerned about four vs five buttons (to me five sounds better anyway?), if the change is functional. I'm guessing it's possible that spec has changed over time. When it comes to military spec, I'm keen that the seams and materials and sizing and functionality are as it should be. The Valley Apparel do quote a military specification and stocking number, and the manufacturer is an official military supplier. I would assume that should mean you're getting something decent.

Personally it's also important that a product respects its heritage. In this case a USAF product really should be manufactured in the USA, not outsourced to Asia.

One funny thing about the modern variant of the N-3B and N-2 is the use of polyester and nylon. For an airforce product that sounds surprising since both are highly flammable. While it's definitely feasible airport crew would use them, that sounds dangerous for actual pilots. I wouldn't want to be inside one of those in a bad situation...

Setok · Jul 20, 2018

Flightengineer said:
N3B not for Finland winter IMO,
If only wear warmed pants with.
Anyway, it's pretty short for real cold winter and if you wear jeans (not warm flight overalls or flight pants wih this jacket), then the cold wind will get to your values in your pants

There seems to be differing views on this one. Some say the N-3B is very warm, others not so. In particular the Alpha version seems to get some flack for not being as toasty as it should be. You're right that in some pictures the jacket seems a tad short. Then again in others it looks fine. Perhaps this is a particular problem for tall people (which I am). In general I do prefer longer coats.

Flightengineer · Jul 20, 2018

Setok said:
There seems to be differing views on this one. Some say the N-3B is very warm, others not so. In particular the Alpha version seems to get some flack for not being as toasty as it should be. You're right that in some pictures the jacket seems a tad short. Then again in others it looks fine. Perhaps this is a particular problem for tall people (which I am). In general I do prefer longer coats.

We have the same weather in winter.
I had several N3b (USAF originals) and the truth is that this jacket (as and N3A) in real cold weather pilots was worn over warmed pants (or over warm flight suits). Its length and cut from below are made for easy sitting in the cockpit. Without these pants, this jacket (warm in itself), in REAL Russian or Finnish frosty winter, has a weak spot just what I meant. Therefore, I, like you have a lot of long winter jackets (such as СG) and others

I'm 180 cm.

Doctor Damage · Jul 20, 2018

Flightengineer said:
I had several N3b (USAF originals) and the truth is that this jacket (as and N3A) in real cold weather pilots was worn over warmed pants (or over warm flight suits). Its length and cut from below are made for easy sitting in the cockpit. Without these pants, this jacket (warm in itself), in REAL Russian or Finnish frosty winter, has a weak spot just what I meant. Therefore, I, like you have a lot of long winter jackets (such as СG) and others I'm 180 cm.

This is an extremely important point. If you need a winter parka and aren't wearing insulated pants, then an N3B will be inadequate for many people. They simply don't come down far enough to cover up much more than your twig and giggleberries, and they don't close up even that far down since (as Flightengineer says) they were designed to be worn while sitting. And more generally, they fit wide and short in the sleeves, so if you're Regular you're okay, but if you're a Long find something else.

Doctor Damage · Jul 20, 2018

Setok said:
One funny thing about the modern variant of the N-3B and N-2 is the use of polyester and nylon. For an airforce product that sounds surprising since both are highly flammable. While it's definitely feasible airport crew would use them, that sounds dangerous for actual pilots. I wouldn't want to be inside one of those in a bad situation...

Back when the N3B parkas (and associated trousers) were designed and issued, this was the best fabric technology available. Yes, nylon melts, which is why when flame/heat resistant fabrics became available and affordable they were issued (see the Nomex thread). The USAF has not used nylon flight clothing for flying since the early 1970s.

Doctor Damage · Jul 20, 2018

Setok said:
Every now and then I ponder about acquiring an N-3B. It's not really my regular style and, if I'm honest, I have too many winter coats already (I love those great coats!), but then again, it is a classic, and still available at low prices. I was turned off Alpha after learning their version is now manufactured outside the US. Obviously this all happened without a drop in price. At the same time I really don't appreciate any drop in spec, as I live in Finland so it really should be putting up with temperatures as low as -30C.

I just bumped into a version by Valley Apparel, which is an actual US military supplier, and the parka appears to be done to military spec, and made in the USA. Sold here at least:

http://www.usarmynavystore.com/va-made-in-usa-n3b-sage-green

Edited to add, it is claimed the factory is the one that has been making them for decades. So perhaps someone acquired the capacity after Alpha, or someone else, stopped manufacturing?

Any thoughts or experiences?

That is NOT a military spec parka.

I suggest reading this whole thread to learn how to i.d. mil-spec parkas from civilian ones.

Setok · Jul 26, 2018

Doctor Damage said:
Back when the N3B parkas (and associated trousers) were designed and issued, this was the best fabric technology available. Yes, nylon melts, which is why when flame/heat resistant fabrics became available and affordable they were issued (see the Nomex thread). The USAF has not used nylon flight clothing for flying since the early 1970s.

Yes, but the funny thing is that the early N3Bs would have been way more fire resistant (wool + cotton). So for that particular purpose (an actual flight jacket), it seems an odd choice.

USAF N-3B parkas - Let's talk about them!!

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