Did fedoras originate with the "upper class"?

[Lean'n'mean]

In answer to the OP's question the answer is probably ......yes.

The Fedora was named after a French play named 'Fedora' in 1882. written by Victorien Sardou. iN 1889 the play was staged in the US where the main character was played by Sarah Bernhardt. During the next decade the fedora was introduced as a woman's fashion accessory for the middle & upper classes.
Men soon adopted them with a few changes (but kept the rather feminin silk bow) & were particually popular with urban chaps as they gave some weather protection & added a certain elegance to their attire.
During the first 2 decades of the 20th century the black fedora was also adopted by the Orthodox Jewish community as part of their standard dress which carries on to this day.
The history of the fedora during the 30's & 40's is known to all. The late 50's saw the begining of the decline of the fedora.


The choice of Indie's hat by the way was by chance & not design, & the 'poet' (Raiders hat) was in fact of an Australian outback design. It's unlikely anyone ever wore a fedora with such a wide brim but it does give our Indy an individualism & quirkiness (along with the asymetric brim) which he probably wouldn't have had with a standard Fedora.

 

[mayserwegener]

In answer to the OP's question the answer is probably ......yes.

The Fedora was named after a French play named 'Fedora' in 1882. written by Victorien Sardou. iN 1889 the play was staged in the US where the main character was played by Sarah Bernhardt. During the next decade the fedora was introduced as a woman's fashion accessory for the middle & upper classes.
Men soon adopted them with a few changes (but kept the rather feminin silk bow) & were particually popular with urban chaps as they gave some weather protection & added a certain elegance to their attire.

Not correct. Please read the following.

This information is a myth that has been repeated as people merely mimic the erroneous statements. Only the name part of the statement is true. Introduced in the USA as a men's hat by Knox copying the traditional European Alpine style and exploiting the first USA production of the popular play for marketing. A more casual "Bohemian" soft style of hat. Story is identical for the Trilby. Same general type as Edward VII's trendy Homburg of the period.

Also check out this thread for the details.

Fedoras in the 19th Century.

 

[Rabbit]

As this thread seems to attract some attention - there's an update at the Links To Important Hat Forum Threads.

The new additions are a list of the main vintage hatmaker threads and a list of hat history- and hat dating-related topics.
The Fedoras in the 19th Century thread is among them.

 

[mayserwegener]

That is good to see. This follow-up by RLK (Robert) should also be listed.

Fedoras, first decade of the 20th Century.

 

[Hal]

The late 50s saw the beginning of the decline of the fedora.

This took place at different times in different countries; in Britain the decline started in the middle 30s.

 

[mayserwegener]

It started even earlier in the US (could also be the case in Britain). From what I can remember the zenith was around 1900. This includes soft and stiff hats.

 

[scottyrocks]

The choice of Indie's hat by the way was by chance & not design, & the 'poet' (Raiders hat) was in fact of an Australian outback design. It's unlikely anyone ever wore a fedora with such a wide brim but it does give our Indy an individualism & quirkiness (along with the asymetric brim) which he probably wouldn't have had with a standard Fedora.

There is some debate as to the chronology of the events that led up to what would become the Raiders hat(s).

Deborah Nadoolman (Landis) originally used 'an Australian model' as the basis for what she thought the hat should look like. But the hats used in the film were Poets, a model produced by Herbert Johnson in England at that time. It is said that Ford and Spielberg went into the shop, themselves, and made the final selections.

The most famous modification from the shop was the dimensionally cut brim, scissor-trimmed by Richard Swales at Herbert Johnson, while the most famous on-set modification was 'the turn,' where the hat was rotated on Ford's head about a half inch to the right, and the pinch recentered, resulted in a lived-in, wonky look. Of course, the hats, as well as Ford's entire outfit, were pre-distressed to look well-lived-in.

Neither of these modifications were typical of fedoras in the 1930s, which is one of the reasons the Raiders hats come under so much fire here.

 

[Lean'n'mean]

Not correct.

I beg to differ. prehaps this type of hat existed before the play so often mentioned but was nameless.....t'was the play that gave it a name & popularity. The play it's self was named after the main character, Fedora Roumanov...which comes from the Russian Fedor.
Much like the trilby which became popular after the audiences noticed a rather nifty short brimmed hat worn by one of the characters in the play 'trilby' & there after this type of hat was called a trilby.
Fedoras were one of the most popular hat styles worn in both America & Europe throughtout the first half of the 20 th century (the cinema helped a lot) so I have no idea where some folks are claiming that fedora died at the end of the 19 th century.
Fedoras have had their comes & goes as far as the choice of hats since the 1970's, again influenced by the movies & media personalities. True enough there is a hard core of staple enthousiasts but most of these have been touched by the images of fedora wearers the movies have projected.
Fedoras weren't as popular in the UK during the 20 th century as other types of head wear such as trilbys & cloth caps. Felt hats were very expensive & luxury items way out of reach for the majorty of worker's purses & so confined to the less numerous, affluent middle & upper classes.

 

[Lean'n'mean]

Neither of these modifications were typical of fedoras in the 1930s, which is one of the reasons the Raiders hats come under so much fire here.

Arhhh, the magic of movie hats, in fact there wasn't just one hat but hundreds of the 'poet' were made, not only for the stunt men & stand ins but also there had to be hats pre dusted, cob-webbed, soaked, sweat stained, squashed etc. depending on the scene to be played & off course the production had to cater for the odd hat that 'went missing' during filming.
I love the raiders hat (more than the other slightly different types in the following movies ) & remains my ideal in both iconic movie hats & fedoras.
I think Speilberg tried to re-create a new hat trend in Jurassic park 3 where Sam Niel's character wore a sort of bush/ safari hat throughout the movie & when he did loose it near the end of the film, it came back to him in the final scenes thus showing it's importance, much like Indies hat used to find it's way back to it's rightful owner.......

 

[scottyrocks]

I've never seen it written anywhere that 'hundreds' of hats were used for the movie. It was more like a half dozen.

 

[Lean'n'mean]

I'll try & find some links.

 

[scottyrocks]

Fedoras weren't as popular in the UK during the 20 th century as other types of head wear such as trilbys & cloth caps.

A trilby is a type of fedora. It's sort of like the difference between a bowler and derby. Same basics, with some detail changes, but the names are based on the country you are in at the time. Bowler = England. Derby = America.

 

[Lean'n'mean]

I'll try & find some linkies........

 

[rlk]

Sept. 26, 1883 New York Sun

Marketing begins to tie in with the first USA(New York) production of Fedora with Fanny Davenport opening later in October of 1883, years before Sarah Bernhardt's French language 1887 production came.

To L.A. by January 1884:

Soon Sears and Montgomery Ward had Fedoras and soft felts for less than $1.00

 

[Hal]

A trilby is a type of fedora. It's sort of like the difference between a bowler and derby. Same basics, with some detail changes, but the names are based on the country you are in at the time. Bowler = England. Derby = America.

This analogy is correct: Trilby=UK, Fedora=USA

Fedoras weren't as popular in the UK during the 20th century as other types of head wear such as trilbys & cloth caps.

The word "fedora" was barely known in the UK before 1980 - perhaps even as late as 1990; a soft felt hat was always referred to as a trilby. Scottyrocks is absolutely right about different names in different countries.

 

[mayserwegener]

Not correct.

I beg to differ. prehaps this type of hat existed before the play so often mentioned but was nameless.....t'was the play that gave it a name & popularity. The play it's self was named after the main character, Fedora Roumanov...which comes from the Russian Fedor.
Much like the trilby which became popular after the audiences noticed a rather nifty short brimmed hat worn by one of the characters in the play 'trilby' & there after this type of hat was called a trilby.
Fedoras were one of the most popular hat styles worn in both America & Europe throughtout the first half of the 20 th century (the cinema helped a lot) so I have no idea where some folks are claiming that fedora died at the end of the 19 th century.
Fedoras have had their comes & goes as far as the choice of hats since the 1970's, again influenced by the movies & media personalities. True enough there is a hard core of staple enthousiasts but most of these have been touched by the images of fedora wearers the movies have projected.
Fedoras weren't as popular in the UK during the 20 th century as other types of head wear such as trilbys & cloth caps. Felt hats were very expensive & luxury items way out of reach for the majorty of worker's purses & so confined to the less numerous, affluent middle & upper classes.

I have looked at many hat trade papers from Austria and Germany from the late 1890s up to 1938 and have never come across the word "Fedora". The term wasn't used in either country and I assume this was the case for the rest of Europe during that time period. The same with the name Homburg although I did see it once mentioned in an export related adverstisement by the original maker Möckel (of Bad Homburg). Also please see the American newspaper ad (Knox the Hatter) that RLK posted above. That is the origin of the hat called the "Fedora".

 

[Undertow]

This does not seem to match info I've read on FL. Is there any truth to this?

I'd say there's quite a bit of information; much easily found via searches, and some of which has been discussed here already.

Regarding "upper-class", I don't think anyone has yet provided any kind of proof that these soft felt hats (typically country hats or soft Homburg styled hats) were any more difficult to acquire than any other hat.

I have scans from the 1920's showing hats to be a relatively affordable accessory. Suits were more in the price range of $15-25 (not the $50-70 previously mentioned) and hats were anywhere from $5-10. Cotton and wool caps were only slightly less expensive. There are catalog scans all over the Lounge.

I think most people that have researched this topic even briefly would agree that the soft felt hats of the early 20th century were accessible to all classes. One might argue that it was the upper and middle classes that drove fashion because they had more disposable income, but that is merely incidental - not definitive.

 

[rlk]

 

[Undertow]

rlk, that must be early '30's, post-crash. Do you have a date for this?

 

[Brad Bowers]

Something else to keep in mind, too, is that hat manufacturers rarely used the term Fedora up through the first half of the twentieth century, especially in regards to specific styles or models. The Knox model excepted, of course. What we term a Fedora today was called a "soft felt snap-brim hat" by the manufacturers. The Fedora name was more common among the general population.

Brad