Wool Felt vs. Fur Felt

[deanglen]

That's a 60's 3x Open Road, renovated by Optimo Hats, and then shaped by your's truly. It's a nice soft hat.

Joel

Hey Joel, can you post a pic wearing it? Love to see it on you.

dean

 

[barrowjh]

Yohanes and HamletJSD expressed some interest in the red BB porkpie, so here it is. The young lady standing next to me with the highly decorated western straw was also a volunteer worker for the Knoxville Marathon; that straw was worn by the 'clean-up' pacer the next day (4/1/07) as the course rolled-up/closed. Yes, Yohanes, the durability of this #$#@^& porkpie helped me decide to order a custom hat from BB (avatar) - Heritage body, center-dent crown, 2 3/8 snap brim, choc brown with matching 12 ligne ribbon and bound edge. The hat in my avatar is a bit more luvable than the porkpie!

 

[K.D. Lightner]

Barrowjh -- wow, those colors just woke me up this a.m.

Undertow: As for wool vs fur felt, one ought to wear what he/she can afford and what feels good. If it is wool, then seeks out the better made ones.

I have purchased a number of fedoras from VHS (they have two stores in San Diego where I used to live) and there are quite nice for the money. Bailey and Jaxon hats are great. I also was able to score a wonderful old Borsalino at an antique store plus an old soft Knox fedora and a Borsalino at Play It Again Sam's, a retro store in Hillcrest (or at least it was there when I left).

Plus, as some have said, if you are patient, eBay may have some good, cheap fur felts, though they are getting harder to find.

Also, I would suggest an Akubra -- one from Australian sellers online. For the price of two wool hats, you could get a nice Akubra. People here swear by them, I have several, too.

karol

 

[retrofashion]

I'm just researching about wool felt vs. fur felt and found this thread.
People say you can spot the difference from a mile away: While I'm sure this is metaphorical, unless you had a pair of binoculars or you are born in Krypton, I'm pretty sure a hat expert can tell the difference when he's talking face to face to somebody. But can this difference come across in a picture or in movies? Thanks.

 

[Shaul-Ike Cohen]

I'm not sure about the size of the grey zone, but mostly yes, often enough you can. Try Google's image search for "felt fedora" and then for "wool fedora" to compare. ("wool hat" will give you too many beanies and the like.)

 

[retrofashion]

I'm not sure about the size of the grey zone, but mostly yes, often enough you can. Try Google's image search for "felt fedora" and then for "wool fedora" to compare. ("wool hat" will give you too many beanies and the like.)

Oh, I have tried that actually. I can’t tell the difference. But I'm a complete newbie when it comes to hats. In the pictures I see nice looking ones and bad looking ones in both sides. What are the main visual clues when looking at a picture or movie to spot the difference?

 

[deanglen]

One clue might be that the brim thickness will be a bit greater, the crown bash might not be quite as sharp, but really, I can't think of any realible way of telling. That's why I don't mind the woolies, the look can be achieved for cheap, and aside from the often rougher feel of the felt, and the fact that they do fade if given enough UV, and shrink a bit if not treated, they can look great.

dean

 

[Undertow]

Any veteran members please feel free to make corrections as necessary. After my research into this topic and having reviewed many of the helpful hints I've received on this board (including various other threads), I would say some of the most important differences are usually most notable AFTER one has purchased the offending hat.

I believe the first question one must ask is this: Are you buying a dressy wool felt that is imitating a dressy fur felt, or are you looking for something casual?

For instance, there are some really excellent wool trilbies on the market that are pretty casual and I believe one might use them for afternoon autumn strolls, or perhaps hunting.

as an example of the casual wool trilby. However, there is a notable difference in these rugged hats as opposed to a softer, thinner wool counterpart, i.e. fedora, porkpie, etc.

When one is trying to purchase a wool felt with something dressy in mind, such as a fedora or a porkpie, I think they will notice the wool is not quite as soft, may shrink if not treated, tends to fade in the sun, may become ruined after a soaking, may bleed colors; the creases never seem to be as defined and are quite a bit harder (if not impossible) to create.

Now if you expect to get a decent fur felt from somewhere like Burlington Coat Factory or Walmart, you’ll not notice any differences. However, if you’re able to land some vintage fur felt, or any fur felt above $70 new, you’ll likely notice a pretty drastic difference.

Fur tends to be softer and more pliable. It accepts bashes and creasing much more easily. If it’s a good felt, or well treated, it should not bleed colors or become misshapen after having been wet. If you wear the hat often, it may fade with time, but the color should hold fast for a number of years. And although I can’t quite explain it, I really believe a person familiar with hats can tell the difference between fur felt and wool felt. Maybe it’s the way the light hits the material, maybe it’s all the points listed above, but regardless, I think it’s safe to say some people can tell the difference at a glance.

If you’re new to buying hats, I think you should most definitely purchase a cheap fur or wool felt fedora to start. Get the size preference figured out, get used to wearing a hat, and see how you treat the hat. If you tend to ruin wool felts within months, you’re probably going to ruin a more expensive fur felt as well. After you’ve had some time with a wool felt (and gotten used to the Indiana Jones/ Inspector Gadget comments), move on to the better hats.

Any thoughts on this?

 

[Spellflower]

When I decided to give up my suede outback hat and switch to fedoras, I went to Gus's hat shop in Manhattan. The very friendly clerk there showed me crushable wool hats as well as fur hats. I liked the feel of the fur a lot better- the wool hats just didn't have the character. But the gentleman warned me that I should not wear a fur hat in the rain, and recommended the wool hats for more intense use, as they were scotch-guarded and therefore would provide better protection.

So I bought a crushable wool hat, which began to lose its shape after a few soakings, and became permanently stained by sea spray when I wore it on a boat trip. While it may be true that a wool hat with scotch guard is better than the crappy fur hats available at Gus's (New York Hat Co. and Stetson, mainly), it ain't nothin compared to an Akubra.

My wool hat now resides in a box of junk in my grandmother's garage. I thought I'd use it when doing yard work at her house, but it was so uncomfortable after wearing real hats that I decided to risk sullying my Fed.

Now I'm not saying that all wool hats suck, and I know that not all fur hats are terrific, but if I had it to do over again, I would never have bought that wool hat. At least if I'd bought an Akubra and decided it wasn't for me, I could have sold it on ebay and recouped something, but a used wool hat is just junk.

If you see a nice wool hat that's lined, and not pathetically trying to pretend that it's a fur hat, go for it. Or if you're not really sure about this hat thing, and you're comfortable with blowing $40 to find out, go right ahead. But if you really want a fedora, I'd save up and buy an Akubra. Either you won't like it, and will end up selling it, or you will, and you'll be glad you invested in something worthwhile.

 

[HamletJSD]

Come full circle haven't you, Undertow?
With the little time that has passed since you first asked this question, I have to agree that you can tell the difference between a dress fur and dress wool even from some bit of a distance. You can tell and I can tell, but the general public still doesn't know the difference even on closer inspection (as Aaron pointed out so clearly). So maybe it depends whom you're trying to impress

In my experience, wear and tear on my wool (mentioned earlier in thread) became apparent quickly, making the differences easier to notice. It's still going strong, but it received hard wear. It's definitely faded and ... maybe "fuzzy" is the right word? ... compared to the fur felts. You can tell it is wool very easily (though at $15, it wasn't comparable even to a lot of other wools from the beginning).

All that said, I still stick by wool as a viable option. If you're new to hats, short on money, even if you just want to increase the size of your existing collection; try it on, buy it if you like it, and enjoy the journey! I would buy another wool if the price were right and it was a color or shape I was looking for, even now after two Akubras.

 

[HamletJSD]

On a side note, does anyone know if more expensive wools are a whole lot better? A very quick search (one web site) and I have already turned up a $70 (plus shipping) wool fedora. There are several Akubra furs that are only $80 (though admittedly the shipping is slightly higher) on Hatsdirect.

Seems a bit crazy to me.

 

[Edward]

If you’re new to buying hats, I think you should most definitely purchase a cheap fur or wool felt fedora to start. Get the size preference figured out, get used to wearing a hat, and see how you treat the hat. If you tend to ruin wool felts within months, you’re probably going to ruin a more expensive fur felt as well. After you’ve had some time with a wool felt (and gotten used to the Indiana Jones/ Inspector Gadget comments), move on to the better hats.

Any thoughts on this?

My take on it would be this: if you really want to wear a fedora style hat, or even more so if you're not sure but want to experiment - and money is tight, you can either try and buy used, or you can buy a new wool. My inclination if you don't want to wait forever with eBay is to buy a new wool one and see how you get on with that. Buy it in a colour that will go with just about anything - a good grey, for instance. now you have a flexible hat that you can use - if you really like it and want more, you've discovered that without being out a lot of cash - and you have a hat that will do you while you wait for a fur to come up at the right price. The main thing i have found with wool (which has been all my experience so far - my next hat will be my first fur) is that you have to watch it with rain and the brim - make sure when you get in from the rain to set it somewhere to dry where it can dry with the brim flat, or it will end up bent down. FWIW, Wool hats have over the years taken me from the point of wearing a fedora with evening wear to wearing one with a suit to much more regularly than that, and being prepared to spend the money on a fur. Had I been faced with a bald choice of fur or no from GBP50 and upwards from the off, it's entirely possible that I'd not have developed the taste for fedoras that i have acquired.

 

[Spellflower]

Anyone here trying to "pathetically" pretend something? Not clear on the what, or who, of that reference.[huh]

dean

Hi Dean. What I meant is that there's a difference between a wool hat that's like the ones Undertow describes, which are kind of hunting/taking a walk hats with a more rugged feel, and the cheapo wool hats like what I bought. One is just another kind of hat, that happens to be made of wool. The other is an imitation of a fur felt fedora, rendered in wool so as to provide a cheap alternative, but really not much closer to being a fur fedora than a toy store cowboy hat is to being a 10x Stetson.

 

[Undertow]

Come full circle haven't you, Undertow?

Well, yes and no. I still don't think people should shun wool hats and I'm still debating on buying a wool from VHS. But now having the opportunity to inspect wools myself, and having the opportunity to own some vintage furs now, I must admit, I've learned quite abit.

And a HUGE thank you to all the FL members. I've learned in a few months here what I would have learned in a few years and $1000 later on my own. Your opinions and feedback have been much appreciated and invaluable! :eusa_clap

 

[deanglen]

Hi Dean. What I meant is that there's a difference between a wool hat that's like the ones Undertow describes, which are kind of hunting/taking a walk hats with a more rugged feel, and the cheapo wool hats like what I bought. One is just another kind of hat, that happens to be made of wool. The other is an imitation of a fur felt fedora, rendered in wool so as to provide a cheap alternative, but really not much closer to being a fur fedora than a toy store cowboy hat is to being a 10x Stetson.

Uh-h-h-h, h-m-m-m, well, okay.

dean

 

[HamletJSD]

I must admit, I've learned quite abit.

Your learning is all I meant by coming full circle ... you're the one who opened the thread a few months ago and now you've practically answered yourself

 

[Yohanes]

I bought wool hats due to its crushable characteristic, I had to stuff it it my bag most of the time - I wouldn't dare doing such thing to fur felt! That's why I don't buy firm / stiff wool hat.

 

[Spellflower]

Personally, I find traveling with fur hats to be quite easy- I just keep my hat on my head unless I'm someplace with a hat rack. I don't have much use for folding, except for maybe when I'm at the movies, or riding my bike and wearing a helmet until I arrive at my destination.

But if I did need crushability, I think I'd try to find something like what Matt Deckard uses in his demonstration of rolling thin fur hats:

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=1915

Failing that, I'd go with an Akubra Traveller, which is both fur, and crushable. Though the Traveller is less dressy than a standard fedora, it is without a doubt a nicer hat than those cheap crushable wool hats.

I don't mean to demean any one who would choose to wear wool fedoras, by the way. It's just that I really feel that I wasted my money, and I'd hate for someone reading this to be disappointed like I was. If I only knew then what I know now...

 

[Yohanes]

Of course I wish I could buy a crushable fur felt some day... yeah, Akubra Traveler or International are quite interesting choice... I just wonder whether the legendary Fed is also crushable?

About Matt Deckard's example, I'm afraid it would be very hard to find the hat he meant. Getting a vintage at 7 3/8 at ebay is very difficult already...

 

[Fast]

Hat for the money

If money is the issue, why not look for a decent quality fur felt? Maybe there's a whole thread about inexpensive fur felt fedoras out there, but I don't know.

I've had both and prefer fur. I had staining and shrinking problems with the wool, but not the fur. They generally last longer and take harder use. That's why they command a higher price. This is not news.

Finding a vintage hat in the right size that hasn't shrunk or stretched or been shrunk or been stretched by god or a hatter or a wearer. . . I can't find the time, and in the end the hats I could and could not wear would cost me more than the new hat (we're talkin' ebay). I wouldn't buy what I couldn't try and send back if wrong.

Secondhand stores are hit and miss at best. The odds of some guy with exactly my head size and taste going broke, growing up, or dying on any given day are not that good. I have to work and cannot afford the time to cruise and stroll and try on and inspect, then send out for a rather expensive quality cleaning to get rid of the moth eggs from the secondhand store.

So I want fir and I want new. Decent quality fur felt hats can be gotten. Most come out of the Czech Republic. They get relabelled in the states. Stetson has issued them under their own label for sure, and I hear Salentinos are actually Czech hats. Village hattters calls their line Jaxon. They can be had reasonably.

The worst sort of snob points their self important, boorish finger at another human being and screams SNOB! Yuh. Good hunting.

Carpe Diem
Fast