Engineer Boots, Harness Boots...

bretron said:

anyone have a pair of Nomads with a soft toe and leather soles?

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I would love a soft toe, strap color in two tone option changed and the rivet gone. I'd order now!! another by the time they arrived...hahah...

I hate to hijack this thread slightly, but here goes anyway.
(besides I didn't want to start a new thread for a simple Nomad question)
I'm about to order a pair of Nomads.
I have very flat feet, so I asked Kyle at Baker's if he thought reducing the heel by 1/4" was a good idea.
He said yes, so I'm very inclined to order them this way.
I just wanted to see if anybody else did the same thing.
Or, conversely, did anybody with flat feet order the Nomads with the standard height heel.
Thanks all.
Lenny

that is the idea lenny, I have very tall arches and went with added heel height. If your arches are flatter, reduce the heel height. I am happy with the results by the way.

Lenny, I have semi-flat feet and bought a stock pair of smokejumpers with the standard heel height. They do beat your feet up pretty bad. At first they hurt quite badly, but I've been able to slowly wear them for longer and longer time periods. It's been 6 months or so of non daily wear and now I can wear them for an entire work day on my feet and only have mildly sore arches at night. Oddly enough, they tend to hurt more when I'm off my feet throughout the day. It's like my foot wants to relax but can't because I have what feels like a baseball bat under my arch.

But, It can't be too painful because I just ordered a custom pair of Bounty Hunters from bakers, but, with the heel lowered 1/4". I cant let you know in a month or two if the lowered heel is truth or fiction. If I had truly flat feet I would not by White's. They have an incredibly high arch. Maybe Wesco's have less.

Thanks gents.
I think I'll go with the lower heel.
Lenny

Most engineers that I have seen have a straight shaft. I don't think Wescos have a lot of extra room in their shaft. In fact you should measure your calf and lower leg and make certain there will be enough. One of my buddies wears tight jeans and those fit pretty tight over his boots, so they latest style in jeans may not fit well for your boots. Most of us are over 25 and my boot cut jeans have plenty of room. Injunjack I can understand your mailing concerns, but if you measure well you should be fine. It is always best to be a little on the larger size and wear thicker socks than be too small. My multiple Wescos are thick and heavy and will last forever, but I do agree that the price is out of control. Whether this is family greed or not, but I too am looking at the White Nomads. Go Cards!-- John

Jimmer I know you went over this but what is the half sole on your original Wescos? On your original Nomads is that a Vibram 100 sole or the Vibram half sole. Got confused looking at all the pretty pictures! Next question: you have worn the Nomads 6 months; what is the most comfortable the original Nomad sole or the original Wesco sole? Go Cards! --John

In my opinion, the price has to do with quality of materials, American manufacturing, and the boots being rebuildable.

I have owned the less expensive American made brands. Chippewa makes a good boot for the price. American made Fryes can be nice, but I am less impressed with the leather on the Mexican made boots. Red Wing was hit or miss with me - I am really impressed with my Red Wing heritage lace ups, but the "copper rough and tough" leather on the 2971 Engineers I bought seemed soft and relatively thin. I ended up returning them. Red Wings in general are not that much less expensive than White's or Wescos - Chippewas tend to be around $150-$200 while Red Wing Engineers tend to start around $300 and go to $400 and up for the original 2968's (Europe and Japan only, BTW). For $400, I am not impressed with the leather on the current RW 2968's. The leather on my Wesco's was the thickest, but teh White's have the nicest color and surface finish. Both my White's and Wescos have used leather that was stiff at first, but aged gracefully and became thick yet supple.

White's and Wescos are a big step up in overall build quality and materials, hence the jump in price. They start around $400 if you go through a dealer and not direct through the manufacturers. Wesco options add up quickly, and many are overpriced in my opinion. White's doesn't offer as many options, although I am really hoping this will change as the Nomad Engineers gain popularity.

Finally, there is the issue of fit. In my expereince, Wesco would like to fit you into a stock shoe size. When I drove up the factory, I expected to be measured, but the guy just scrounged up a pair of boots in a 13 and had me try them on. Then he asked me how they felt. That was the extent of it. On the other hand, if you visit White's, they will measure your foot and calf in 3-4 different places to ensure a good fit. I am of the opinion that this is crucial when one is spending $400+ on a pair of handmade boots. That doesn't mean that it will be perfect every time, but it certainly removes much of the margin for error. Nick's measures you the exact same way.

The heel counters of my Wescos do not taper at all at the top - they are straight walled. This can cause more heel slip, particularly when the boots are new, or if you have double midsoles like me. Mine have broken in, and the heel slip is much less noticeable, but I will probably try to have them perform a "heel pinch" next time I can get up there. White's have a more shaped heel counter that cups your heel, but I am still experiencing heel slip with my double midsoled boots. However, these are not even remotely broken in yet, so this assessment is not really fair.

White's "Open Road" model start at $249....pretty good value. I don't own a pair, but I have White's semi-dress and they are fantastic.

My Wescos, couple of weeks use...

I'm wearing IH 634S which have 8,8" hem


How this narrow shaft can be too wide...??

Here's some Sancho's for 99 Euro's, click their special offers to see em.

http://www.sanchotrading.es/

injunjack said:

My Wescos, couple of weeks use...

I'm wearing IH 634S which have 8,8" hem

How this narrow shaft can be too wide...??

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Good looking boots and the jeans look fine. Go Cards!

I just ordered a custom-made harness boot from a local cobbler here in the Philippines.

They've been in business for a very long time and I trust the quality of their work. You'd be surprised how "cheap" a custom shoe here can be. And they have a lifetime warranty.

I've had 2 cowboy boots made by them waaaayyyy waaaaaayyyyyyy back. Never had a problem with them. One I left at my ex's place and one I gave to a friend who assures me the boots are still alive... except for the fact it wouldn't fit us anymore (that was around 14yrs ago).

The boot I ordered will be finished by the end of the month.

OneEyeMan said:

Thanks gents.
I think I'll go with the lower heel.
Lenny

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Lenny - are you still getting the Double midsoles, Vibram half soles, etc? I ask because with these specs, my new boots feel like the heel has already been lowered about 1/4" (one lift). The Quabaug heels that they use with the half soles are significantly thinner than the Vibram Lug heels taht come with the Vibram 100 lug soles. Sorry to muddy the waters!

- Jim

kyboots said:

Jimmer I know you went over this but what is the half sole on your original Wescos? On your original Nomads is that a Vibram 100 sole or the Vibram half sole. Got confused looking at all the pretty pictures! Next question: you have worn the Nomads 6 months; what is the most comfortable the original Nomad sole or the original Wesco sole? Go Cards! --John

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KY -

1. My Wesco's use a Vibram 705 Half Sole - these are made by Vibram exactly as you see them. Here is an image of them when they were brand new:





2. My original White's Nomad's used a single midsole and a Vibram 100 Lug Sole. Here is a picture of the same sole on a different boot and the boots when they were new:




3. You didn't ask for this, but just for comparison, here are my new distressed White's Nomads with Vibram Half Soles. These boots use a Vibram 700 Full length composition sole that has been cut down to half sole length. The 700 soles are essentially the same look and material as a Vibram 705, but they are made as a full length sole:





4. Finally, comfort. Honestly, I find the comfort of all three of these boots to be comparable. I think the White's with the Vibram 100 lug soles are the most comfortable by a slight margin. I believe this is mainly because the lug soles give just a little more "squish" and because the single midsole makes them flex more naturally as you walk. These have very little heel slip after break-in.

The Wesco's have double midsoles and a flatter arch, although I could swear the arches feel more pronounced after a year of regular wear. This is most likely due to the leather footbed conforming to my feet over time. These use a Vibram 700 heel which is fairly thick (6/8") and as a result, the heels are fairly tall on these. The double midsoles were quite stiff at first, but broke in nicely over time.

The new distressed Nomads have double midsoles and Vibram Half soles. Thus far they have been comfortable, though the brand new double midsoles are pretty stiff, and the heel slip is significantly worse than my original Nomads with lug soles and single midsole. Thankfully, this will break in with time. I ahve noted that the Quabaug Heels on these new Nomads are significantly thinner than the Vibram 700 heels on the Wescos - 0.45" thick vs. 0.75" thick. The leather portion as abit thicker but they still feel like they need another lift in the heel to be the correct height. The heels feel a little low to me - it's not terrible, but I can feel it when I stand still on an even surface. Walking around, it is not noticeable.

Sorry for the flurry of posts, but I forgot to mention one important thing - I got the new Distressed Nomads back from White's last week, and they were able to correct the fit. They simple glued in a leather insole - it looks to be about 7 ounce leather. It was just enough to snug the boots up, and I really like the way it feels. White's was very helpful and professional from the start and I am very impressed.

Maybe we should be ordering our boots from the Philippines! Send some pictures when ready.

Hey! thanks for the help. My biggest decision to make on the next pair is ? which soles to order. I like the clean lines of the Wescos and the second Nomads, but I also believe there is a slight comfort issue with the Vibram 100 lug sole, even though not as attractive as the other soles. I did note the thicker heel on your Wescos. Still leaning toward trying the Nomads in a two tone brown or brown and now about to decide on the sole. thanks

jimmer_5 said:

Lenny - are you still getting the Double midsoles, Vibram half soles, etc? I ask because with these specs, my new boots feel like the heel has already been lowered about 1/4" (one lift). The Quabaug heels that they use with the half soles are significantly thinner than the Vibram Lug heels taht come with the Vibram 100 lug soles. Sorry to muddy the waters!

- Jim

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No, single midsoles and full Vibram 100 soles with the 1/4" lower heel.
These should be comfy and slightly easier on my flat feet.
Lenny

Anyone have experience with Vibergo stock 83s? I'm considering a modified verson of the stock model (r/t the full blown custom jobs), which primarily means I live with the black oil tanned leather.Is it worth the $120+ for CXL?