Palm Beach Neckties

Gene · May 17, 2013

I've had about 4 or so ties go to Loungers here, between late 30's-early 50's...like to see them again!

herringbonekid · May 17, 2013

LuckyKat · May 17, 2013

I've long been a collector of Palm Beach ties and have seen many of labels...I tend to collect the pre-54 labels (no (R)) because of width & design, but I've also heard that Goodall-Sanford sold out in 1948 & then it became the Palm Beach Company. If thats true, then the ties that are marked "Goodall-Sanford" were only made from late '43 to 48, but I have no evidence to back that up.
I have well over 100 PB ties to back me up, plus about 12-15 NOS PB ties...I will get some pictures when I have a chance, but I was considering selling a handful of them because there are many that I have never worn because I just have so many ties in general. I only have 2 sets that are the same patterns, otherwise there are so many designs of PB ties, it blows my mind! Why isnt there more suits available in crazy colors like the ties? (I have 3 "colored" PB suits that aren't just plain white, & yet they advertised so many other options...where are they!?!)
I've seen early 30s PB ties, but nothing from the 20s...I have a late teens/early 20s PB suit with a white on white label that I had never seen before...apparently I dont have the label, but here's the suit:

The other thing that is rarely seen is the black label (I've never seen it on a tie, only a jacket)...& I find that they didnt use the black label past '43, although it could exist.
Here's a small guide from Spencer of Vintage Haberdashers...very general but a good idea lf labels:

The other thing, with tags is that orange is the most common, supported by the green or blue for the store, patent, or "by Beau Brummell", but yet below on Feraud's example of his cream tie with red, blue & gold stripes the word "Palm Beach" is in green...I've never seen that or heard of them doing that...I'd be very interested in owning that if you wanted to trade or sell it.

Feraud said:

esteban68 · May 17, 2013

some beauties on this thread, some look a bit 'washed out' is that the photo flash, have they faded or are they often pastel shades? I still like them though.

Dinerman · May 17, 2013

LuckyKat said:
Here's a small guide from Spencer of Vintage Haberdashers...very general but a good idea lf labels

If you haven't already, please take a look at this thread I put together:
http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?71744-The-Fedora-Lounge-Guide-to-Palm-Beach-Cloth, which gives a much, much more comprehensive look at Palm Beach cloth than the little one I did on my blog. Ties marked Goodall-Sanford were produced up until the demise of that company c.1955. That post discusses the evolution of the company, its sales, name changes, and the changes in the composition of the fabric more in depth than this one.

As Beau Brummell had the exclusive contract to produce Palm Beach neckties, and used entirely different labels than what was being put in the suits, the labels in that guide aren't very applicable to the neckties. For the label chronology on the ties, see post 10.

dhermann1 · May 17, 2013

Here are my three:

Looks like the first two are from the 1944 to 1950 period. The last one is obviously later, and not necessarily from actual Palm Beach cloth. I can't really tell, myself. But it has a smoother feel. The top two are 47 " long, the last one is 50 " long.

The red and yellow one has already gotten lots of compliments.

herringbonekid · May 17, 2013

esteban68 said:
some beauties on this thread, some look a bit 'washed out' is that the photo flash, have they faded or are they often pastel shades?

of the three i posted; the blue-red-pale yellow one is very vibrant. the other two i checked underneath in the folded construction and there's no evidence of sun fade, so they've either faded evenly from several washes, or were made in those slightly muted hues... i suspect a bit of both.

(edit: DH's first tie above is also a 'muted hue' example).

Feraud · May 17, 2013

I suspect my PB examples suffer from poor photography..

Feraud · May 17, 2013

Found this tucked away in my photobucket account-

Dinerman · May 17, 2013

That's interesting. The company reformulated their suiting Palm Beach cloth in '41. That's from 44 or newer, but still has the "original recipe".

I know Goodall (Sanford) mills made their tie material to different specs than their suiting, in different widths, different patterns/colors, an different compositions than the fabric they used in their suits. Palm Beach Cloth was not a singular material. It changed over time, for different applications, and even for different sales markets. Cool to see it illustrated that clearly.

Feraud · May 17, 2013

This one is narrow, no more than 2.5".

herringbonekid · May 17, 2013

these are from the 'loose labels' bag:

... unfortunately i can't remember which ties they were attached to !

"FROSTED WITH NYLON" !

yes, how can we make nylon sound cool ?

Dinerman · May 17, 2013

1940s composition: 53% mohair, 47% cotton

Early '50s composition, from your tag: 50% Rayon, 32% mohair, 13% cotton, 5% nylon.
I've seen another from that era marked 50% Rayon, 32% Mohair, 12% Cotton, 6% Nylon.

It looks like by the '50s "Wash and Wear" Palm Beach ties by Beau Brummel had been re-formulated again to be:
55% dacron polyester, 40% Rayon, and 5% Polyester. I'm seeing ads for those in the late 1950s. Oddly, the tags still say "woven only by Goodall Sanford", despite the name "Palm Beach" and the Goodall Sanford mills splitting ways around 1955. It was sort of a gradual split, '54-'56. In the early '50s, some of the fabric production had moved from Maine to Ohio. I wonder if that included the fabric used in their neckties?

By the '60s, Beau Brummell Palm Beach ties were 60% polyester, 40% rayon

Lots of changes in the fabric. Does anyone know of any other percentage variations?

herringbonekid · May 17, 2013

here's the interior of the above card tag when folded out.
really, the amount of info (and design charm) contained on a cardboard tag that measures 2.5" by 1.5" puts modern graphic designers to shame:

... AND you get a new tie if not satisfied !

Two Types · May 17, 2013

Feraud said:
I see this tie and immediately I think of the Truffala Trees from the Dr Seuss book 'The Lorax'

Feraud · May 18, 2013

Ha, yes it does have a Dr Seuss like whimsy.

Feraud · May 18, 2013

Here is another narrow one-

esteban68 · May 18, 2013

It's a nice tie but Dr Seuss stuff gives me the creeps!
The yellow, brown and white striped one is a beauty!

LuckyKat · May 18, 2013

I retract my previous statement about 2-tone labels...I found a few in my collection...

On another note...I snapped pictures of my collection of PB ties (minus the handful of PB bow ties)

My favorites:

Matchy Matchy:

LuckyKat · May 18, 2013

NEW OLD STOCK:

Palm Beach Neckties

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I'll Lock Up

I'll Lock Up

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