24 Rules For Gentlemen in 2014

LizzieMaine said:

You can boil all this "gentleman" stuff down to one thing. It's got nothing to do with tipping your hat or holding doors or knowing how to use a finger bowl.

A *real* gentleman always puts the toilet seat down after he's done.

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Aww, geeze, don't get me started about the toilet seat,,,,,,,after many ,many fights over this, the only fair solution is that the seat AND lid goes down, for both. Both should have to bend over and pick something up and set it back down.

The book mentioned earlier is "Self-Made Man: One Woman's Year Disguised as a Man" by Norah Vincent.
I read it, its an interesting read to me as I can understand some things she went through in her year. While Norah didnt id as a transgender it related what a lot of those in the transgendered community go through, specially female to male when they transition.

I dont agree with a lot of Paglia's older stuff, I havent read her newer stuff.

As for those rules, all I can say is that I do not agree with it. For me, I think Guttersnipe summed it up best.. "I know from personal experience, that in their early 20s, essentially all people, male and female, are complete and utter morons as far as relationships go"
Except for me it was early 20's to early 30's.

cpdv said:

Madame, just because someone is young does not mean that they do not at my young age have to be a fool about life. I would have to delve into my personal life which I have no desire to do here to illuminate why I look at the world as I do. Also I am actually quite the pleasant person to be around even if synical and blasé... its all part of being a dandy. As for the lower orders I am frequently in the company of such people though I do not indulge in their behavior and nor am I wanting for girls of quality I know and socialize with quite a few. Apologize,I know my bloodline and while I hold no lands and live paycheck to paycheck myself I attempt to hold myself to a higher standard than the average bar goer in my social group. And if someone wishes to act rude, crude boisterous and vile in public then I shall call them a peasant. As for on here I don't see anyone who could meet that description that I am aware of.

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I could meet that description. I dare anyone to demonstrate lower standards than I had when I was your age.

cpdv said:

It is rather a dogfight, like a scene out of hells angels. For the record I treat people who deserve respect (in my opinion) with respect and until proven otherwise it goes without saying that one should treat woman with respect. I have no use for unintelligent easy girls the rest of the guys are welcome to them. I much prefer a goofy semi nerd a much better choice I think.

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Who says nerdy girls aren't easy?

EliasRDA said:

As for those rules, all I can say is that I do not agree with it. For me, I think Guttersnipe summed it up best.. "I know from personal experience, that in their early 20s, essentially all people, male and female, are complete and utter morons as far as relationships go"
Except for me it was early 20's to early 30's.

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The sad truth is, most continue those traits all thru their life.

ButteMT61 said:

Advice for 20-something "men" and a 30/40/50/60 year old are not the same, mainly because 20/30/40/50/60 women are not the same. I think that's what was meant in the "offending" post.

Now, I like the list below as it should cover all the groups above, but let's not pretend that being a "gentleman" works with young women - it often doesn't. Lizzie would say "is that the kind of "woman" you want to be with? Well, I know that in my 20's, I had way-different criteria than later in life.
Actually, most of what 20-somethings do should be a Mulligan until you show you've moved on and upward. lol

A *real* gentleman always puts the toilet seat down after he's done. Or, sits

A *real* gentleman doesn't hold up the ticket line complaining that he wants a better seat. True, he buys tickets early to avoid being embarrassed and an ass.

A *real* gentleman shovels out his own sidewalk. Actually, he shovels his own sidewalk and any neighbors that might need help too.

A *real* gentleman never takes the last roll in the basket. Right. He goes to the kitchen and makes more.

A *real* gentleman always pulls ahead to the furthest gas pump. Can't improve upon that one.

A *real* gentleman knows he isn't the center of the universe. A real gentleman marries someone to remind him of that

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Excellent butte :eusa_clap

A *real* gentleman knows he isn't the center of the universe. A real gentleman marries someone to remind him of that

Thank's Butte my wife read your quote and now is in love with you.

gear-guy said:

A *real* gentleman knows he isn't the center of the universe. A real gentleman marries someone to remind him of that

Thank's Butte my wife read your quote and now is in love with you.

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She's a woman of impeccable taste :rofl:

I know this is going to come off as a troll but bear with me this also may come off as a rant. As an aside, I spent last night stranded on a major highway with a flat tire. Finally got a tow truck to get me out of there. (Salt stains on shoes, the one part white vinegar to two parts water got the stains out for the most part.) So this post will not be my best.

Notice there are hardly any lists such as 11 rules to be a lady. Why? Granted that the list could apply to anyone but why are men signaled out to follow the rules? In this day and age. There is no place for such rules. IMO.

Just to try and clarify some terms:
Men going their own way (MGTOW): means men no longer having any relationships with women (think dating, marriage) because society has created a dangerous environment for men. I'm talking lifetime alimony, alimony in general, men generally receiving harsher sentences than men for the same crimes, etc. I don't think men hate women, it is that the environment is so caustic so dangerous that the risk is too great.

Adding an additional term that I picked up within the last year:
Pick up artists (PUA): Basically, men who seduce women based on "science" and female nature. Very interesting commentary and it pretty much goes back to the comments I quoted in my first post. PUA's divide men's behavior into "Alpha", "beta", and "omega." Men want to be alpha's or at least mimic alpha behavior in order to seduce women. Beta is pretty much your average nice guy, who to the PUA's will end up married and later divorced with his woman having all the property. Omega would be considered are sexless losers.

My stance on all this:
Difficult to say. I want to believe in the rules posted by Scotrace, but in my experience those rules seem as outdated as the typewriter. I think PUA's ultimately recognize that it is a woman's world and this is the behavior you have to do to be successful in it. The majority belief being that the more sex you have the more of a man you are. I don't necessarily believe that but I'd wager eight to five that a majority of your average day men would.

Have a good day everyone.

(P.S. for whatever reason, I had to copy and paste my post because it took me awhile to write it and the site logged me out. Anyone else have a problem like this)?

P.P. S. I like Butte and this isn't an attack on him or gear-guy. I'm glad you have a happy marriage. I just want to point out that in today's world, the chances of a man finding a "good woman" is not like finding a needle in a hay stack it is like finding micro bacteria in a hay stack (to quote a MGTOWer). It is just that the rules have changed, in my opinion so much today, that it is almost impossible to find such a thing. Not saying any of you are wrong or that you don't have good women. I like Butte's posts so everyone keep up the good discussion.

Much as the discussion/thread is interesting, I can't say I've ever noticed a particular attraction of young women to men who treat them badly, be it in the US or in the UK. Though there are no doubt those situations, of course, from which for whatever reason the abused half of the relationship (whichever gender, but usually the woman) can't seem to extricate themselves.

We must remember that underneath the bluster of the public persona of the "bad boy" - all of this to strut at the other males in the herd, rather circuitously attracting women by appearing to be the silverback - there is very often a rather nice chap, which often only the girlfriends and the mother get to see/interact with. His behaviour often overlays a very troubled and needy personality, which also taps into the famed "mothering instinct", and strengthens the bond between him and the girl, and possibly establishes a pattern whereby that woman will ever seek the bad boy to tame/mother, and will enter the cycles of abuse that are so common (while he may be a nice chap, maintaining the bad boy public persona requires that he treats the woman like shit).

Conversely, under all the "gentlemanly" behaviour of many so-called gentlemen, often resides a nastier character that again only the girlfriend gets to see. You never can tell with people, is the point - the balance of id and super-ego varies from person to person - the public façade is essentially irrelevant and only in personal situations do we get at the true nature of the person. Of all the people I've met through FLounge, there are only a few that I have any idea of their true nature … those few that I have interacted with on a more personal basis over a longer period of time. They all, for the most part, act like what some would call "gentlemen".

This is why I hate talk of "gentlemen". It's all about façade; nothing about the person. Don't make too many judgements about people based on how they look!

Son_of_Atropos,
i don't recognise the world you're describing (women having all the power) but then i don't live in the US so perhaps i'm simply naive of the present day situation there.

if men view women as some sort of enemy to be outmanoeuvred using psychology they'll never have a meaningful relationship with a woman. the woman will always be an unknowable 'other'.
there's also a disturbing element of misogynistic revenge in all of that 'science of picking up women' thinking; it appeals to the embittered male who feels he's been hard done by. not only does this increase the divide between the sexes, but its guaranteed to lead to those men further resenting and hating women.

Baron Kurtz said:

the public façade is essentially irrelevant and only in personal situations do we get at the true nature of the person.

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Baron, i know this is something of a pet theme of yours. if we take it as a given that the public facade reveals nothing of the 'true nature' of a person, the question is; would you rather have a society of well dressed, well mannered unknowables, or a society of slobbishly dressed, obnoxious unknowables ?

The former, of course.

Those who put up a façade of a**hole are morons. As you say very well, they will struggle to have meaningful relationships with anyone, not only with the opposite sex, primarily because they will struggle to initiate such relationships. They will also struggle to advance in all but a very few businesses and leisure endeavours - no-one likes an a**hole! But, however well designed the façade of the well mannered unknowables, individuals who are fundamentally not nice will also struggle in this way.

Baron Kurtz said:

But, however well designed the façade of the well mannered unknowables, individuals who are fundamentally not nice will also struggle in this way.

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hmm, i can think of a few business endeavours in which being not nice is a prerequisite to success.

Exactly. "All but a very few", as I said.

Son_of_Atropos said:

(P.S. for whatever reason, I had to copy and paste my post because it took me awhile to write it and the site logged me out. Anyone else have a problem like this)?

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yes, I have the same problem( which means others do as well), even tho I click,"keep me on". So everything i post, I have to automatically 'copy' before I hit 'send'.

P.P. S. I like Butte and this isn't an attack on him or gear-guy. I'm glad you have a happy marriage. I just want to point out that in today's world, the chances of a man finding a "good woman" is not like finding a needle in a hay stack it is like finding micro bacteria in a hay stack (to quote a MGTOWer). It is just that the rules have changed, in my opinion so much today, that it is almost impossible to find such a thing. Not saying any of you are wrong or that you don't have good women. I like Butte's posts so everyone keep up the good discussion.

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Imo, the rules haven't changed. I can vouch that back in 1978, as young Marine, traveling the Country and world, it was the same way. You had to "get up and dance" to even have a chance( disco was the craze). IMO, it's still the basic biological female looking for a suitable mate. AFA the guys who get all the girls, then that's testament to their ability to "be that one" women find to be a suitable mate.



Afa the needle vs bacteria, well, like the song, you're looking for love in all the wrong places. Today is easier than ever with the dating sites such as match.com, eharmony, okcupid, etc. The key is being honest about yourself, whcih dictates knowing yourself. For a good example, go to OKcupid ad look up cchgn01.

One thing I have learned as I have aged is that the 'nice guys finish last' phenomenon is indeed more often a certain type of young man's issue because said young nice guy will indeed finish first when he finds that right girl because he hasn't been looking for conquests, but a real person to value.

Age and maturity are very good teachers.

cchgn said:

yes, I have the same problem( which means others do as well), even tho I click,"keep me on". So everything i post, I have to automatically 'copy' before I hit 'send'.




Imo, the rules haven't changed. I can vouch that back in 1978, as young Marine, traveling the Country and world, it was the same way. You had to "get up and dance" to even have a chance( disco was the craze). IMO, it's still the basic biological female looking for a suitable mate. AFA the guys who get all the girls, then that's testament to their ability to "be that one" women find to be a suitable mate.



Afa the needle vs bacteria, well, like the song, you're looking for love in all the wrong places. Today is easier than ever with the dating sites such as match.com, eharmony, okcupid, etc. The key is being honest about yourself, whcih dictates knowing yourself. For a good example, go to OKcupid ad look up cchgn01.

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Dating sites. It is easier for women than men. http://jonmillward.com/blog/attraction-dating/cupid-on-trial-a-4-month-online-dating-experiment/

Son_of_Atropos said:

Dating sites. It is easier for women than men. http://jonmillward.com/blog/attraction-dating/cupid-on-trial-a-4-month-online-dating-experiment/

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well, that's always been true, since the beginning of humans. A girl can walk into a bar ( or grocery store, library or anywhere) and say,"let's go" and just about every man will go. They've always had that advantage. So what? That's not the point. I've been on the dating sites for a year and get messaged every day. Once a week, a woman lists me as her favorite. I could date every day of the week, if I wanted to, but I'd go broke,,lol. I have to be honest, I'm only looking for "that one". Dysfunction is a big thing with me and I haven't met a woman who's worked thru hers like I have, but I'm here to tell you that if it's just dates you want, they're out there, but you have to be honest with yourself, do you take care of yourself? Do you work at making yourself attractive? Do you know yourself? Do you know what is right for you?

One thing I learned a LONG time ago, if you constantly compare yourself to others, you'll always be disappointed. My favorite line is,"I do alright for myself". There will always be folks who'll do better than I do and folks who won't. So what? I don't focus on that. I focus on what I can do and that's it. The only person that I try to impress is myself. I'm a good, positive person, have integrity, do random acts of kindness and try to make folks feel good about themselves. I eat right and exersize, I do alright for myself.

@SoA. I don't see anything that was pointed at me... I'm having fun here.