Akubra Fed IV vs Biltmore Taylor Fedora?

I'm considering getting a black version of either the Akubra Federation IV/Deluxe (http://www.hatsdirect.com/federation/) or the Biltmore Taylor (http://hats-plus.com/p-732-biltmore-taylor-ark-fedora-hat.aspx) hats for my first fedora. From my perspective, here's the benefits to one versus the other:

Fed IV:
-Cheaper if I don't get the deluxe version
-Made of a slightly better material if I DO go with the more expensive deluxe version
-Has a slightly bigger brim; a plus in my books

Biltmore Taylor:
-While it has a slightly smaller brim, it also has a slightly shorter crown, so that kind of makes up for it
-The gray ribbon on black hat design is a lot nicer then the black on black of the Fed IV
-Pre-bashed and less Indy-ish; saves me some effort.

---
The thing is, from what I can tell they're both fine qualty hats made from respectable brands, so while there may be certain 'benefits' to one versus the other, it's hard to tell which is the more solid buy. If any of you have experience with either or both hats, I'd appreciate it if you could give me an opinion on them, and what'd make one a more solid buy (more flexible brim? personal taste? whatever the case may be) versus the other; it'd really help me to decide on which one to go for. Thanks in advance to any posters, and I look forward to reading your replies

GentlemanGamer--Welcome to the Lounge. You will find a wealth of hat knowledge in these pages. I may be wrong, but I believe I read on this forum last year that the Biltmore brand was purchased by Hatco, the Texas manufacturer that owns the branding rights for Stetson and other formerly great and now nonexistent hat manufacturers. The Biltmore you reference looks to be along the same lines as other Hatco products of moderate to low quality. Most on this forum would opt for an open crown hat if they were choosing from production hats. Given the choice between the Fed IV and other Akubra models or some of the Hatco products (except for the new Premiere "Stetson" models), I would choose the Fed in a heartbeat; better quality felt and dyeing, better quality sweatband and overall workmanship, a taller open crown that you can shape the way you like, etc. Also, if you want a different color ribbon on the Fed IV, you could have it replaced to suit your liking.

I second g.d.'s comments. I have two old stock Canadian made Biltmores from just before they were taken over, and even the better one isn't as well made as the Akubra Feds. I've not tried the new Hatco owned Biltmores, but unless they're significantly better than the standard Hatco felts of recent years I'd opt for the Fed every time.

Of the two, I'd take the fed.

If I may be so bold as to present option C, none of the above, however, if I had to do it all over again, I'd go straight to vintage via ebay. The only caveat being headsize. This isn't a practical suggestion for everyone. If you have a head towards the smaller end of the spectrum, say 6 7/8-7 1/8, you can get some very reasonable deals on a postwar hat that in all likelihood will have better felt.

Now, that having been put out there, I really like the Fed. I don't have any personal experience with a Biltmore lid, but any time there's a good amount of rain in the forecast, I reach for my Fed. It looks good in a variety of creases. Mine is a sort of looser version of the "Raiders" hat. The standard fed is a nice hat, and Akubra felt is well known for it ls durability.

One possible downside is the dimensional brim. I don't dislike the dimensional brim, but personally, I don't always want to have it. This may or may not be a concern for you.

If you choose to replace the ribbon, my suggestion would be to sent it to a hatter. Unless you feel confident with a needle and thread. I don't myself, but again, YMMV.

The real question is what are your trying to achieve. Are you after period fedora... a generic mid 20th century hat...? If you're after quality alone the Fed is it. And it's lovely to think of it not being used as an Indy hat. Tell us why you want a black one.

Oh, yes, that's another thing to consider. Black is not the most versatile color choice, especially as a first hat. I've been wearing my black Stetson Premiere Stratoliner as of late myself though.

Thanks everyone for your thoughts so far

g.durand- Good points all around I certainly wouldn't want to go for a Biltmore -much less for that amount of money I'd be paying. I like the design... but to me, it's not QUITE worth the risk. And the Fed IV certainly seems like one of Akubra's best hats, and like you said, it wouldn't be TOO difficult to replace the ribbon, so that's a couple of advantages lost by the Biltmore right there.

ManofKent- Yeah, from what I've seen on TFL through my limited trawlings, it seems like a fair few people reccomend opting for a hat other then the Stetson or other HatCo products; apparently they're not great quality for the price. While I don't know if they're all THAT bad, I'd certainly rather go for a different fedora if it serves me better in the long run.

jlee562- Yeah... I have a big noggin; 63 cm, around 7 3/4- 7 7/8. As much as I would LIKE to do vintage, I doubt I'd be able to find one I like for that pricing and that size on eBay, though I guess I'll give it a look. Also, what is a dimensional brim? A rookie question I know, but I don't have any experienc in fedoras Also, ribbon replacement shouldn't be TOO much of a problem; my mom and grandma are both great seamstresses, so as long as they're confident enough, it shouldn't be a problem I think.

Seb Lucas- For me, I'm aiming for a 'classic' look, as it were; a respectably sized crown (between 3 and 5 inches... or something like that), a somewhat lengthy (between 2 1/2 inches and 3 1/2 inches, preferably a length in between in the middle) and a raw (I think that's what you call a thin, somewhat wavy brim, right?) or dimensional (assuming it is what I think it is )brim, and a durable felt that will keep the hat in good condition for quite some time. Rather specific I know, but after multiple searches online, that's what I've come up with

Thanks. The fedora appeals to me as a hat not because of Indy, but because it's simply a nice hat; it has versatility (it works as dressy OR casual), durability, and a charming timeless style

As for why I want a black one, to me, it just looks sharp. It would look nice with a suit, my trench coat, some of my clothing (I imagine; obviously, I can't check until I actually own a fedora), and I simply feel partial to the color. While certainly the other colors- either the moonstone or carbon grey, in particular- are also nice and are slightly less intimidating, I'm just liking black, and that aside it'd be the ONLY black hat (among flat caps, spitfires, ascot, fisherman and ball caps) I own. It's simply preference I suppose



Oh, and on an unrelated side note, if I do decide to go for the Federation IV (which is the hat I'm leaning towards at this point) then should I get the Regular or the Deluxe? They both sound like great hats, it's jsut one is $40 more; is the quality of the deluxe worth the price difference?

I like black hats, too, and I have the Fed IV. I like it, but be warned that it has a dimensional brim, which was rare during the classic era. I don't like that aspect of it, being a traditional kinda guy myself. I now have a black fedora on order with Black Sheep, that will rectify that problem.

Personally I think the Biltmore is the better looking of the two. And the brim should be the same measurement all the way around, not dimensional like the Fed.

GentlemanGamer said:

... Also, what is a dimensional brim? ...

Click to expand...

Dimensional is when the front & back of the brim are different widths than the sides.
Regular brims are same width all the way around.
The Indiana Jones hat was dimensional with the front & back slight wider than the sides.
HTH

Raw brim is unbound.

If you want a bound brim hat with a shorter, and non-dimensional brim then you could look at the Akubra Stylemaster: http://www.everythingaustralian.com.au/shopexd.asp?id=535

Personally I like the Fed's dimensional brim - it allows a nice 'swoop':

ManofKent said:

Raw brim is unbound.

If you want a bound brim hat with a shorter, and non-dimensional brim then you could look at the Akubra Stylemaster: http://www.everythingaustralian.com.au/shopexd.asp?id=535

Personally I like the Fed's dimensional brim - it allows a nice 'swoop':

Click to expand...

You know, I think I agree. I like the look of the stylemaster and it's raw brim, but I think the dimensional brim nicer, actually. I like the look of the 'swoop' and it's flexible-ish brim would allow you to bend it or move it to your liking The Biltmore certainly looks nice, but I don't have any pictures of that (on someone's head) and apparently it might be lower quality compared to the Fed IV, which I have found several pictures of and which looks pretty good on you btw. At this point, I think all that is left is for me to wait till there's room in the ol' budget and I'll likely then go for the Fed Thanks for the opinion, information and picture; it certainly helped

Actually the Stylemaster has a bound brim. My Stylemaster has the most front to back taper of any of my felt hats. With so many hats with less taper sadly it hasn't been worn in a couple of years. It is a quality modern hat but I prefer the Fed IV and I don't even notice the dementional brim and I don't think most people would either.

Sent from my XT1049 using Tapatalk

The Fed IV is a great basic hat. Enough crown (5 1/2) to do just about any crease and enough brim (which you could trim to be even all the way around but it's barely noticeable and quite nice).

I owned a Fed IV only briefly (loved it, but lost it in a cab), and I was certain I'd not like the dimensional brim. I was convinced I would want to have it trimmed to be even all the way around, but once I got the hat, I never thought of it again. It's really not noticeable.

Don't be so certain that the ribbon on that Biltmore is gray. I bought the Camden Ark 214 from the same place you're looking at. It's basically the Stewart with a 2¼" brim. That black ribbon you see in the pictures of the gray Biltmore fedoras? It's gray, and very close to the same shade as the felt. I don't know if it's the way Hats Plus is taking their pictures, or something to do with the ribbon that Biltmore uses, but it seems to photographs weird.

Greyryder said:

Don't be so certain that the ribbon on that Biltmore is gray. I bought the Camden Ark 214 from the same place you're looking at. It's basically the Stewart with a 2¼" brim. That black ribbon you see in the pictures of the gray Biltmore fedoras? It's gray, and very close to the same shade as the felt. I don't know if it's the way Hats Plus is taking their pictures, or something to do with the ribbon that Biltmore uses, but it seems to photographs weird.

Click to expand...

Yeah, I e-mailed Hats-Plus just to confirm and they said pretty much the same thing; that the ribbon was the same color of the felt, or close to. I don't know what's up with those pictures and why the ribbons look weird, but whatever; it doesn't make a huge difference to me. If anything, this only pushes me towards the Fed IV even more, which seems to be the more popular hat here; while I'm sure the Biltmore is still good, I'd rather go with something that more people KNOW is quality then take a risk on something that may not be to my taste.

Hello. To date my Husband does not have any Akubra brand hats, but it has been something discussed and from all the feedback and reviews, Akubra seems to make a hat that is very well made, can take a beating and still look nice. There is however, nothing wrong with either of your selections of hats.

A major change may however come upon you after you do buy and own even one "fedora". Some call it "bitten by the hat bug". Like some unknown force, a drive, dreams even, of the very next hat to own and covet. Eventually, your shelf in the closet will have to be "cleared" to make way for the next purchase. You may even look back in time and wonder, why have I not owned hats like this already? Where will I be able to find another "mile stone" hat that you would be looking for? Now there is no "set in stone" rule that this is what would be your course in life, but, it most likely will happen. It Happened to my Husband and to me, to cruise the internet and look for deals.

Your hat size is rather large, which indeed will make it not so easy for finding clean vintage hats, but, they are there ever so often. You just have to be on the look out for them. I suspect you will be doing so soon. LOL!

Good luck on what ever choices you make on your first Fedora. Enjoy being here as well!
Cindy

LoveMyHats2 said:

Hello. To date my Husband does not have any Akubra brand hats, but it has been something discussed and from all the feedback and reviews, Akubra seems to make a hat that is very well made, can take a beating and still look nice. There is however, nothing wrong with either of your selections of hats.

A major change may however come upon you after you do buy and own even one "fedora". Some call it "bitten by the hat bug". Like some unknown force, a drive, dreams even, of the very next hat to own and covet. Eventually, your shelf in the closet will have to be "cleared" to make way for the next purchase. You may even look back in time and wonder, why have I not owned hats like this already? Where will I be able to find another "mile stone" hat that you would be looking for? Now there is no "set in stone" rule that this is what would be your course in life, but, it most likely will happen. It Happened to my Husband and to me, to cruise the internet and look for deals.

Your hat size is rather large, which indeed will make it not so easy for finding clean vintage hats, but, they are there ever so often. You just have to be on the look out for them. I suspect you will be doing so soon. LOL!

Good luck on what ever choices you make on your first Fedora. Enjoy being here as well!
Cindy

Click to expand...

I don't doubt it; I love hats and own about 4 already (a flat cap, a spitfire, an ascot and a baseball cap), so once I'm started I doubt I'll stop Thanks for the warning and the welcome; both are most appreciated

GentlemanGamer, I sense a misunderstanding of the term dimensional as it applies to hats. A dimensional brim (when looking at the top from the top set on a table) is wider at the front and back and narrower on the sides. This has nothing to do with whether or not it's edge is raw. A raw edge brim simply doesn't have any edge binding (a ribbon stitched around the outside edge of the brim to finish it). A brim could be both dimensional as well as raw or neither.

Hope that helped,
Will