Thurston Italian Vicenza Horsehide Full Grain Veg.-Tanned Horsehide for Aero Jackets

Hey a little self discipline here guys- this thread is about insurrection's new full grain veg tanned leather- period. It ain't about the nuances of this leather being or not being the 'best all time effin leather ever!' Such discussions have been handled elsewhere, as has been suggested.

I agree with both the posts above. I am eagerly awaiting a garment made of that very leather and would of loved this thread to stay on track but I also agree that this whole back handed attack, disguised as debate, on the competition by the Bill Kelso crowd is distasteful and puts me personally off from ever buying what might actually be quality product. I'll take the 'inferior' product from the makers with a polite and professional attitude.

Now back to Thurston's quite lovely Vicenza horsehide.

Ps: After reading my post, a friend e-mailed me that he closely examined his Shinki jacket and he could not see hair follicles. In response, I looked at a GW Shinki jacket under 5x magnification (with a light -- thank you iPhone app) and I could not see any hair follicles. Perhaps the hair follicles are there and neither of us can see them, but that punctuates just how irrelevant the possibly existent hair follicles are.

devilish said:

I agree with both the posts above. I am eagerly awaiting a garment made of that very leather and would of loved this thread to stay on track but I also agree that this whole back handed attack, disguised as debate, on the competition by the Bill Kelso crowd is distasteful and puts me personally off from ever buying what might actually be quality product. I'll take the 'inferior' product from the makers with a polite and professional attitude.

Now back to Thurston's quite lovely Vicenza horsehide.

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I agree on all points and will stand down.

As I posted earlier, I think the new Vicenza leather is fantastic! I look forward to seeing all the new Vicenza garments in the pipeline.

Nothing new here. This has been BK's approach since their very beginning several years ago. I caught some flack from others about noticing early on that their rep was posting over the top statements on the VLJ as well as the customer service rep here(or what ever he is)...and their early 'best in the world' eBay listings. However ..as I've stated before..they remain oblivious to just what they type on a keyboard or how it comes across to others...or say on personal messages behind the scenes. Very odd..but it continues...[huh]
HD

Well said Superflous. For what's it's worth, I think most people recognize this Andy fella for the huckster that he is. I'd certainly never do business with the guy.

devilish said:

I agree with both the posts above. I am eagerly awaiting a garment made of that very leather and would of loved this thread to stay on track but I also agree that this whole back handed attack, disguised as debate, on the competition by the Bill Kelso crowd is distasteful and puts me personally off from ever buying what might actually be quality product. I'll take the 'inferior' product from the makers with a polite and professional attitude.

Now back to Thurston's quite lovely Vicenza horsehide.

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+1 - being fairly new here this was my first experience with his posts but just his manner of the multi-quote "you're wrong" left me with a sour taste. Some of his previous posts blaming his suppliers for delayed delivery times were equally cringe worthy. I'm not going to start debating what I feel are his in-accuracies but rather turn back to my short wait for my full grain russet Vincenza Sheene.

Plumb ... totally get your point re: differing leathers and loyalty to makers/suppliers, but you might want to go back and read the comments re: Chapman, Himell and others for, paraphrasing here, choosing to go the "popular in Japan" route to gain instant credibility in that market, as opposed to going the quality route. Those and other similar remarks are what leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.

I think BK's guy ought to shut up about his competition, period. Perhaps he ought to go to his own BK affiliate thread and make these comments, too, but for some reason that thread is locked. Wonder why.

Hope you're close to jacket weather in the UK, my friend!

jlanderson said:

Hope you're close to jacket weather in the UK, my friend!

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We are indeed ..... was wearing my AL AN6552 earlier today .... and have rotated quite a few over the last few weeks .......


Carrie ... did you get my PM about the Vanson Model A ??????

Be cool, guys

Plumbline said:

We are indeed ..... was wearing my AL AN6552 earlier today .... and have rotated quite a few over the last few weeks .......


Carrie ... did you get my PM about the Vanson Model A ??????

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Hi Plumbline,

Sorry that I didn't get back to you...however, we can't size for customers going directly though Vanson. If you'd like to purchase through us, we offer a fit guarantee and free worldwide shipping on Vanson products. We have Model As (Black) available in sizes 40-48. We also have Dark Brown Model As available in sizes 38-48. If you'd like custom, we can get you going on a Custom Model A...they're quite nice!

You might also want to think about the Model B, as it's a great jacket without the full action back...

Sloan1874 said:

lol

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+1, but hurling that ball and seeing the resulting splash just felt soooooo good!

On topic: That Vincenza stuff looks superb, from the pics it looks to have a wonderful depth of colour to the hides.

Off topic: There's a reason why I've ended up choosing to go with GW for a high-end A-2 and it's not just purely because of the jackets. To quote old Elsie de Wolfe, "Be pretty if you can, be witty if you must, but be gracious if it kills you."

GregO said:

I haven't been here in a while...stopped in to take a peek to see if there are more Vicenza Aero pics up. Instead, I had to wade through pages of Falzon crap. Ugh.

Carrie - any pics of a jacket in the dark seal Vicenza? I've seen the sample pics - they look great. Would love to see an actual pic of a jacket.

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Hi GregO,

We don't have any jacket pics right now, but we'll have jacket photos from the next batch of the Vicenza (it's due to arrive at Aero in the next two weeks). The dark seal was an addition to the color offerings after we received our first batch of leather, so we didn't have any finished Aero jackets to show in this color...

Dark Seal Italian veg-tanned FQHH

Monitor,

I completely agree that an open and candid discussion of leather qualities benefits everyone, and I have never sought to curtail or impede such a discussion. I have also commended Andy when he provides such information, both here and privately (Andy and I have been communicating offline for several months). Andy has educated me and I am grateful for that. Moreover, the informational components of Andy's posts have prompted me to ask more questions, both here and directly to jacket vendors, in order to further educate myself. Thus, I genuinely appreciate the FACTS and OBJECTIVE INFORMATION that Andy brings to this forum.

I also agree that Andy is free to compare and contrast BK's leather with leather used by other manufacturers. This is a common form of marketing in all industries. IMHO, Andy sometimes takes this approach a bit too far, but that is a subjective opinion. I personally believe that subtlety is a better approach (e.g., you don't see Ferrari proclaiming its superiority over Porsche). Again, Andy and I have discussed this issue at length. Nevertheless, Andy is well within his rights to abandon subtlety and, instead, proclaim the superiority of his product.

My gripe is when Andy goes beyond information and objective facts, and resorts to denigrating his competitors and/or attributing disparaging/false motives to his competitors. You do not believe Andy has engaged in such conduct. I respectfully disagree. Andy clearly stated that Chapman and Himel selected Shinki because it was less expensive, they didn't have access to better leather, and they were jumping on the Japanese bandwagon. These statements have exactly nothing to do with the relative qualities of the varying leathers. Moreover, these are not statements proclaiming the superiority of BK's product. Rather, these are subjective -- and demonstrably false -- statements impugning Chapman's and Himel's motives and business practices. In reality, Chapman and Himel do have access to other leathers, including those used by BK, but they elect to pay more for Shinki because they believe in the virtues of Shinki leather. More importantly, Andy should not be attributing disparaging motives to his competitors. IMHO, that goes beyond proclaiming the superiority of his product, and crosses over into unprofessional business practices. Of course, this is just my opinion, and you are free to disagree. Please note that I am not the one who introduced the specter of civil litigation, nor did I call for Andy's banishment. Rather, I merely shared my opinion that Andy's tactics crossed the line.

To be clear, I thank and commend Andy for his sharing of OBJECTIVE FACTS and INFORMATION that broaden our horizons and enable us to make better choices regarding future jacket purchases. That said, I think BK would be better served if Andy refrained from delving into the subjective motives of his competitors.

Carrie @ Thurston Bros. said:

Hi GregO,

We don't have any jacket pics right now, but we'll have jacket photos from the next batch of the Vicenza (it's due to arrive at Aero in the next two weeks). The dark seal was an addition to the color offerings after we received our first batch of leather, so we didn't have any finished Aero jackets to show in this color...

Dark Seal Italian veg-tanned FQHH

View attachment 17487

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Carrie, that dark seal is gorgeous!!! I wish I had selected dark seal rather than regular seal. I may need to buy another Vincenza jacket in dark seal.

Sloan1874 said:

Actually, if I was Thurston, I would be pretty hacked off that a vendor/affiliate was using the thread that I pay for to yak away, regardless of what they were saying...

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Quelle surprise. And what would you do about it Sloane, I wonder. Whine to the moderators that your thread is for advertising only?

Sloan1874 said:

Actually, if I was Thurston, I would be pretty hacked off that a vendor/affiliate was using the thread that I pay for to yak away, regardless of what they were saying...

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schitzo said:

Quelle surprise. And what would you do about it Sloane, I wonder. Whine to the moderators that your thread is for advertising only?

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Gentlemen, this is NOT a "vendor/affiliate" thread, nor an advertisement thread, and Insurrection is not paying for this thread. To the contrary, I started this thread almost four months. It is the rare instance that a TFL thread does not wonder from its initial purpose. Nevertheless, I have endeavored to move the general discussion regarding full/top grain leather to a more appropriate thread.

Superfluous said:

Gentlemen, this is NOT a "vendor/affiliate" thread, nor an advertisement thread, and Insurrection is not paying for this thread. To the contrary, I started this thread almost four months. It is the rare instance that a TFL thread does not wonder from its initial purpose. Nevertheless, I have endeavored to move the general discussion regarding full/top grain leather to a more appropriate thread.

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See how wrong you are Sloane!?

I can admit, I thought I was on the other thread too

I think it's time for a big group hug and cokes all around.......