Does HorseHide become buttery soft?

generalquarters · May 18, 2018

Hello!

Longtime lurker and beneficiary of all the wisdom on this forum.

I own a flat head leather jacket in shinki horsehide (first leather jacket). It's breaking in nicely but I am curious as I don't have much experience with leather.

But will horsehide ever break in till it becomes buttery soft like lamb or cowhide?

Edit: leather is vegetable tanned, and 1.3mm horsehide. I think that is considered midweight.

Monitor · May 18, 2018

generalquarters said:
Hello!

Longtime lurker and beneficiary of all the wisdom on this forum.

I own a flat head leather jacket in shinki horsehide (first leather jacket). It's breaking in nicely but I am curious as I don't have much experience with leather.

But will horsehide ever break in till it becomes buttery soft like lamb or cowhide?

Hi! Depends on how it was tanned.

generalquarters · May 18, 2018

Monitor said:
Hi! Depends on how it was tanned.

The leather is vegetable tanned, and 1.3mm horsehide. I think that is considered midweight.

It's also a brown core underneath and black on top. I noticed this as the jacket has broken in.

handymike · May 18, 2018

In my experience NO. Unless you order a Thedi. His is the only horsehide I've handled that I can call "soft."

Monitor · May 18, 2018

generalquarters said:
The leather is vegetable tanned, and 1.3mm horsehide. I think that is considered midweight.

It's also a brown core underneath and black on top. I noticed this as the jacket has broken in.

Well... Whether it's veg or chrome tanned doesn't really make a difference. Even between the two main methods, there are many, many ways to tan leather and tanneries can process it to become any way they want.

If the leather your jacket is made of is stiff then in all probability, no, it won't get particularly soft. Not all over, at least. It will become softer, especially at the arms, etc. but it won't ever be soft.

Guppy · May 18, 2018

generalquarters said:
Hello!

Longtime lurker and beneficiary of all the wisdom on this forum.

I own a flat head leather jacket in shinki horsehide (first leather jacket). It's breaking in nicely but I am curious as I don't have much experience with leather.

But will horsehide ever break in till it becomes buttery soft like lamb or cowhide?

Edit: leather is vegetable tanned, and 1.3mm horsehide. I think that is considered midweight.

It depends!

How you wear it.
How you treat it.
How it was tanned.

It may, but don't count on it.

A lot can change over the years, and you never know. I have several Cal Leather horsehide jackets, and most of them are still pretty stiff, but one is very soft and supple. Don't know why. Wasn't there the whole time.

Carlos840 · May 18, 2018

It also depends what "buttery soft" means to you.
To me Brown CXL FQHH is buttery soft after a couple months break in, still some people speak of it as if it was cardboard.
It's all relative...
One thing is certain, the more you wear it the more pliable it will get.

Fanch · May 18, 2018

Carlos840 said:
It also depends what "buttery soft" means to you.
To me Brown CXL FQHH is buttery soft after a couple months break in, still some people speak of it as if it was cardboard.
It's all relative...
One thing is certain, the more you wear it the more pliable it will get.

@Carlos840 as usual is spot on with his response. I would characterize my CXL brown FQHH Aero Teamster as now being buttery soft and pliable. I used to have an Aero Highwayman made from black vintage CXL FQHH that was stiff as a saddle and stayed that way. Both of my Vicenza (russet and black) Aero Sheenes were buttery soft and exceptionally pliable from day one. My brown Shinki Himel/Good Wear (Chapman) Californian Ventura was relatively stiff from day one and has not softened much. My seal (dark brown) jerky horsehide Aero Mulligan was stiff on day one but has softened but not to the extent of my heavier CXL brown FQHH Teamster.

Having given a few examples of my experience, you can discern there might be several factors at work, including significant variation in batches of the same leather. Simple question posed by @generalquarters with tortuous, complex answers.

Monitor · May 18, 2018

Carlos840 said:
It also depends what "buttery soft" means to you.
To me Brown CXL FQHH is buttery soft after a couple months break in, still some people speak of it as if it was cardboard.
It's all relative...
One thing is certain, the more you wear it the more pliable it will get.

Yep. My Aero HWM in horsehide was one of the softest jackets I've ever owned, even tho it was a really very heavy jacket. But it was virtually like lambskin.

But the first Aero I ever had, supposedly the same hide, was quite literally like cardboard. That jacket might've been made from plywood and it NEVER got any softer. And it was already well used when I got it. Ridiculous jacket, never saw anything like it since.

dubpynchon · May 18, 2018

I've found that getting caught in the rain softens the leather considerably. My Highwayman was stiff as a board when I bought it (I considered returning it) but after two Irish winters it's a different jacket. I've even deliberately gone for long walks in the pouring rain to soften the leather on new jackets, which isn't much fun. As Carlos said, it's all relative, for most people it would always seem stiff and heavy. I doubt it will ever be as soft as, for example, my Schott 118 in cowhide.

generalquarters · May 18, 2018

https://imgur.com/a/Xy0TrkE

Appreciate all the good responses here. Buttery soft is a difficult term to define, as you said it has different meanings and interpretations depending on the individual.

For me, buttery soft would just mean soft and pliable to the touch and it drapes nicely, having lost it's armour structure. The first day I got the jacket it was able to stand on its own!

Here are some pics:

Carlos840 · May 18, 2018

All you can do is try to speed things up.
What is do with every new jacket is an accelerated break in session.
First i go over the jacket once and spend a few minutes rolling over all the thick seams made of multiple layers (like either side of the zipper, collars, pockets etc). Just roll them on themselves to soften them. Then i roll the jacket in a ball and "punch" it for 15 minutes. Make sure you close it so the open zipper can't scratch the leather. Don't punch like a madman, more a heavy fist massage.
Then I spray it (outside only) with water using a spray bottle, rub it in and wear it until dry. Do it every morning before leaving home, do it at home when wearing the jacket in your living room, do it all the time. You can add a few random "ball up and massage" sessions back in.
Do that for two weeks and your jacket should be as soft as it will ever get.

Edit: just saw the pics, that looks great!

willyto · May 18, 2018

What do you mean by soft? I think you want to say flexible, pliable, with drape, etc.

Most leather jackets are soft to the touch even if they are stiff.

ProteinNerd · May 18, 2018

Nice looking jacket but damn that does look stiff!

I have a flat head cafe racer so I’d assume they use the same style Shinki on all of their jackets? It is a thicker leather compared to my other Shinki leather jacket.

The body is still quite stiff but the sleeves have really softened up nicely. I think it just needs to be worn a lot and it will definitely soften up a lot.

generalquarters · May 18, 2018

Yeah that was the day I received it. It's no longer like that. I believe they use the same style shinki for all their jackets.

Is yours teacore as in brown overdyed black? Mine is like that.

Yeah I have no issues wearing it to break it in. Not looking to speed up the process. I was just curious at how much it has softened since day 1 and was curious if it would become buttery soft in the end.

generalquarters · May 18, 2018

Carlos840 said:
All you can do is try to speed things up.
What is do with every new jacket is an accelerated break in session.
First i go over the jacket once and spend a few minutes rolling over all the thick seams made of multiple layers (like either side of the zipper, collars, pockets etc). Just roll them on themselves to soften them. Then i roll the jacket in a ball and "punch" it for 15 minutes. Make sure you close it so the open zipper can't scratch the leather. Don't punch like a madman, more a heavy fist massage.
Then I spray it (outside only) with water using a spray bottle, rub it in and wear it until dry. Do it every morning before leaving home, do it at home when wearing the jacket in your living room, do it all the time. You can add a few random "ball up and massage" sessions back in.
Do that for two weeks and your jacket should be as soft as it will ever get.

Edit: just saw the pics, that looks great!

That's hardcore! But I dig your methods

I'm not looking to speed up the process. I am wearing it every day as it is and it's broken in and not as stiff as it was on day 1. I was just wondering today if it would end up becoming buttery soft if I kept wearing it for the next 10 years. Because that's kind of my plan. One jacket for life!

ProteinNerd · May 18, 2018

generalquarters said:
Is yours teacore as in brown overdyed black? Mine is like that.

It has to be tea core, it’s wearing much faster than any of my other jackets.

generalquarters · May 18, 2018

ProteinNerd said:
It has to be tea core, it’s wearing much faster than any of my other jackets.

Beautiful! Mine looks just like that. could you share a picture of your whole jacket? It'll be cool to see what it looks like now.

Sloan1874 · May 18, 2018

It will soften and drape, but you're in the wrong game if you're hoping for 'buttery soft' leather. Reminds me of the Stones' manager Andrew Loog Oldham story of his utter obsession with finding the most comfortable shoes he could find. It ended with him owning a pair of moccasins that were so soft that he couldn't wear them outside his house.

Superfluous · May 19, 2018

Welcome GeneralQuarters (any relationship to the store in LA?).

Soft is relative and subjective.

The Shinki HH used by FH is generally thicker and stiffer than the Shinki used by RMC, Himel and GW.

Gorgeous jacket!

Does HorseHide become buttery soft?

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