They Just Don't Make Em' Like They Used To!

Dapper Dan · Jan 25, 2007

GOK- thank you! That is very kind of you to say.

And Haversack, you are right. Tastes do indeed change, but I think once enough time has passed, people begin to appreciate the "out-of-date" style more. I know that's clumsily worded, but what I mean is that in 1912, the Victorian look was hopelessly out of date and pass?©, sort of the equivalent of Vanilla Ice today. Victorian decoration was no longer in style. But I think today we can look at Victorian style and appreciate it from a removed standpoint. We can appreciate it on its own terms instead of liking it because it's modern or disliking it because it's out of style. Vanilla Ice, though, should never be afforded this privilege.

Orgetorix · Jan 25, 2007

Certainly, many items were better made in the past than they are today.

However, to inject a small amount of reality to this discussion, that certainly wasn't the case with everything. In large measure, the reason things from a bygone era seem better made is that only the better made items survived to the present. Things that were inherently more fragile or more consumable--because of technological limitations, shoddy work, or inferior materials--fell apart and got used up and thrown out. In another 70 years, our grandchildren will probably think things were made so much better in our time, simply because only the well-made stuff will still be around. The rest will be sitting in landfills, just as cheap stuff from the Golden Era is now.

Grnidwitch · Jan 25, 2007

I think Dapper Dan said it all. It's all about the "all mighty dollar". Back in the day (you define) things were made to last. They had to. To buy what would be considered the same quality of the past would cost a current fortune. It's a shame really.

jamespowers · Jan 25, 2007

Orgetorix said:
Certainly, many items were better made in the past than they are today.

However, to inject a small amount of reality to this discussion, that certainly wasn't the case with everything. In large measure, the reason things from a bygone era seem better made is that only the better made items survived to the present. Things that were inherently more fragile or more consumable--because of technological limitations, shoddy work, or inferior materials--fell apart and got used up and thrown out. In another 70 years, our grandchildren will probably think things were made so much better in our time, simply because only the well-made stuff will still be around. The rest will be sitting in landfills, just as cheap stuff from the Golden Era is now.

I am not quite convinced that that is the case. Look at something made 60 years ago closely and you might think a little differently.
Clothing: Let's face it, the material used was superior. It was a heavier weight, made with a higher quality thread and put together by people who knew their craft. Today clothing is thrown together by machines as much as possible. Volume is king not quality.
Appliances: They lasted longer because a) they don't have a bunch of frills and complications that make wearing out within a year possible---i.e. freezers were not frost less so you have to defost them once in a while. The mechanics used for that in today's fridge fails quite quickly. [huh] b) the materials used (again) were more durable. Plastic gears?! I don't think so. They were steel and they lasted longer--let's face it.

Everything else: Plastic may have been the new thing but it was not everywhere in everything. Today, I defy you to find something that isn't. Plastic is great and all but it has a very noticeable short coming---UV rays cause it to deteriorate. That's right, the sun ruins it. Heat will also ruin it. Putting items together out of plastic that are meant to be used for a while is just silly. Its not going to last. Car dashes crack like crazy. So do steering wheels, those stupid plastic chairs and now they make clothing out of it too. :eusa_doh: Ask yourself this question: when is the last time I have seen a 1980 something car around?
Just some things to think about.

Regards,

J

jitterbugdoll · Jan 25, 2007

It is true that tastes change, though in some cases a person's taste is all in their mouth, as my mother likes to say. For example, in the case of a 1920s bungalow with gorgeous, original hardwood floors that sold for almost $1 million dollars (a pretty sizeable amount out here) a few months ago. The new owners ripped said flooring out, and installed Pergo in its place

Dapper Dan · Jan 25, 2007

I would agree that, to a certain extent, the stuff of low quaity gets weeded out and we're left with the best. But, on the other hand, look at how long people used to keep appliances and cars etc. without replacing them. Ask people who lived through the time about it.

jamespowers · Jan 25, 2007

Dapper Dan said:
But, on the other hand, look at how long people used to keep appliances and cars etc. without replacing them. Ask people who lived through the time about it.

Good point. They actually used up the useful life of the product and that was a long time.
Clothing went through various phases for instance. First it started out as new and was worn as it was intended. As it wore it got demoted to lounging around wear and then to gardening and work clothing. Ripped pants could change into shorts or pants for the children. Clothing that was beyond use as clothing might have been used for a rag rug or cut up for a quilt. So you go from a whole item down to a rag or decoration.

Regards,

J

Cabinetman · Jan 26, 2007

jitterbugdoll said:
The new owners ripped said flooring out, and installed Pergo in its place

...

...and...

LizzieMaine · Jan 26, 2007

jamespowers said:
Good point. They actually used up the useful life of the product and that was a long time.
Clothing went through various phases for instance. First it started out as new and was worn as it was intended. As it wore it got demoted to lounging around wear and then to gardening and work clothing. Ripped pants could change into shorts or pants for the children. Clothing that was beyond use as clothing might have been used for a rag rug or cut up for a quilt. So you go from a whole item down to a rag or decoration.

Or as my grandmother used to say, "Use it up, wear it out, make it do -- or do without." She was definitely one to put that into practice -- she'd turn shirt collars and cuffs, cut full size sheets down to twins, cut her clothes down to hand-me-downs for the grandkids, and just generally do everything she could think of to get the last possible bit of wear out of an item. She had survived the Depression, and learned its lessons well.

I've inherited this attitude myself -- the thought of wasting anything, of simply throwing something out for the sake of having something new, is incomprehensible to me. My sister, on the other hand, is the kind of person who wants a new living room set because someone sat on the old one -- I dunno what went wrong there...

Daisy Buchanan · Jan 26, 2007

LizzieMaine said:
Or as my grandmother used to say, "Use it up, wear it out, make it do -- or do without." She was definitely one to put that into practice -- she'd turn shirt collars and cuffs, cut full size sheets down to twins, cut her clothes down to hand-me-downs for the grandkids, and just generally do everything she could think of to get the last possible bit of wear out of an item. She had survived the Depression, and learned its lessons well.

I've inherited this attitude myself -- the thought of wasting anything, of simply throwing something out for the sake of having something new, is incomprehensible to me. My sister, on the other hand, is the kind of person who wants a new living room set because someone sat on the old one -- I dunno what went wrong there...

Your grandmother sounds like a great lady. My Granny survived the depression too. Now, in her older years, she's been buying new things for herself. But, for years, she would do the same thing as your Grandmother. My Granny is also a saver. She won't throw anything away, she thinks that everything has a use, even if it's been sitting in the closet for fifty years! A couple of years ago we moved her from a pretty big, 3 story house with lots of closets, to a one and a half bedroom apartment. OH MY! We probably should have helped her try to weed through some of her stuff, but she kept on saying she didn't have a lot to pack. We arrived at the apartment just as the movers were dropping off the last box. All the rooms were full, floor to ceiling boxes, I'm talking no place for people to fit anywhere. Well, we finally managed to unpack her. I've never seen so much stuff, and she's a stubborn woman, she absolutely refused to get rid of anything, even though we would have given it to a good cause.
Well, I guess that comes from growing up in the depression. Either way, the older stuff that she's got is really well made...

Daisy Buchanan · Jan 26, 2007

jitterbugdoll said:
It is true that tastes change, though in some cases a person's taste is all in their mouth, as my mother likes to say. For example, in the case of a 1920s bungalow with gorgeous, original hardwood floors that sold for almost $1 million dollars (a pretty sizeable amount out here) a few months ago. The new owners ripped said flooring out, and installed Pergo in its place

That's an atrocity!!!
I think that before sales like this go through, the owner's should be interviewed to see what it is they will or will not do to a historic house. Damn Shame I tell you, damn shame.....

Ben · Jan 26, 2007

Daisy, in some places buyers of old homes are interviewed. In Chicago there is an initiative to revitalize historic bungalows that were build in the early 20th century. The exteriors must be historically accurate. (There are some cases where the bungalows have been so altered over the years that they really can't be considered historic any more.)

At the same time, there are examples of these bungalows where they have modernized them on the inside in realy interesting and exciting ways. For example, I've seen shredded denim from old blue jeans used as insulation in the attics. So, it is the best of both worlds for a lot of people -- a nice vintage look and a modern interior that suits different tastes, with some energy saving touches. Some of the interiors are also restored in a vintage way.

Have a look at this site if you are interested.

http://www.chicagobungalow.org/finance/esgrant.shtml

Daisy Buchanan · Jan 26, 2007

That's a great site Ben, thanks.

I'm all for updating older homes, especially to make them more energy efficient. But, I'm also for trying to keep certain "old" things in place. Like flooring, crowne moulding, and other accouterments. I actually think there's almost nothing cooler than mixing the old with the new. For example, I love old built in's but I really like stainless steel appliances. I just wish that these houses weren't torn apart,

I know in Boston we have an initiative to save historical homes. We actually have one across the street from us that was just sold. They are doing million's of dollars worth of work on it, but the structure of the home must stay the same. I guess the guy needed to lay a new foundation, so he had the house lifted and moved, a new foundation built, and then moved the house back. And this is a big four story home. Anyway, I'm glad to see the person who bought it working so hard to keep it's original qualities.

Ruby Slippers · Jan 26, 2007

My Design professor mentioned something along these lines yesterday. He spoke about Frank Lloyd Wright, in particular Mr. Wright's speech at an auditorium which began with (I'm paraphrasing, of course) the fact that some of the audience members were too far back to hear as well as the audience in front, that the auditorium had a draft in it, and about half the audience was less comfortable than the rest. He went on to say that the reason for this was because he did not design and build this auditorium.

He was not only a great architect, but a great engineer. Buildings of his have survived catastrophic earthquakes, where all others tumbled to the ground around them. He paid explicit attention to detail, and its no question that he would have taken all of these things into account if he had been the architect behind that auditorium.

Documentaries on his work are always fascinating because they pay so much attention to the details he took care of in his work. Its unfortunate that this care isn't as valued in many things today, because of budgets and time constraints and the like.

Jovan · Jan 26, 2007

Many are nicer than the new JCrew suits that I have, and I'm sure will outlast most of the modern clothes that I have.

I think if more people bought suits and dresses in better made, thicker materials it would be much better. They last longer and can be handed down for decades, and I definitely want that to happen with my children should I have any in the future. It's a great long term investment when you do the math.

Daisy Buchanan · Jan 26, 2007

Jovan said:
I think if more people bought suits and dresses in better made, thicker materials it would be much better. They last longer and can be handed down for decades, and I definitely want that to happen with my children should I have any in the future. It's a great long term investment when you do the math.

You're so correct Jovan...
Believe it or not, I have a suit from H&M that has outlasted all of my expensive modern suits, and it cost probably less than 1/4 the price. But, since then, I have yet to find anything made well from that store, must have been a fluke...
I'm beginning to be glad that in my profession I wear scrubs. They are meant to be disposable, so I know what I'm getting and don't get bothered by tossing a pair. Besides, I don't have to worry about figuring out what to wear

Jovan · Jan 26, 2007

You work in the ER?

I haven't heard very flattering things about H&M's quality as of late. It seems a lot of companies that were once well known for their quality have gone down the pipes, figuratively speaking. Companies like Florsheim, Johnston and Murphy, Burton, etc. seem to concentrate more on just selling a bunch of product rather than making them of good quality. I think part of that may be due to the change in leadership over time, as well as the availability of cheaper but not very good materials such as polyester, corrected grain leather, and so on. It's an unfortunate thing. Thankfully there are still companies that make quality goods, but they're few and far in between now and a bit expensive for many people. Another unfortunate thing is that there are so many "name" and "designer" brands that are shilling out low quality stuff for unjustifiably high prices, getting people who want quality thinking if they're that much, they must be of good quality. More examples! Armani, Dior, Gucci, Dolce & Gabbana come to mind. The thing is, you really have to be informed and research around to see what is actually worth its asking price.

Sorry if I got a little

fftopic:.

jamespowers · Jan 26, 2007

LizzieMaine said:
Or as my grandmother used to say, "Use it up, wear it out, make it do -- or do without." She was definitely one to put that into practice -- she'd turn shirt collars and cuffs, cut full size sheets down to twins, cut her clothes down to hand-me-downs for the grandkids, and just generally do everything she could think of to get the last possible bit of wear out of an item. She had survived the Depression, and learned its lessons well.

I've inherited this attitude myself -- the thought of wasting anything, of simply throwing something out for the sake of having something new, is incomprehensible to me. My sister, on the other hand, is the kind of person who wants a new living room set because someone sat on the old one -- I dunno what went wrong there...

I see your grandmother was like my mother's mother.

When she passed away it took weeks to go through everything.

Regards,

J

jamespowers · Jan 26, 2007

Jovan said:
You work in the ER?

I haven't heard very flattering things about H&M's quality as of late. It seems a lot of companies that were once well known for their quality have gone down the pipes, figuratively speaking. Companies like Florsheim, Johnston and Murphy, Burton, etc. seem to concentrate more on just selling a bunch of product rather than making them of good quality. I think part of that may be due to the change in leadership over time, as well as the availability of cheaper but not very good materials such as polyester, corrected grain leather, and so on. It's an unfortunate thing. Thankfully there are still companies that make quality goods, but they're few and far in between now and a bit expensive for many people.

I can tell you for sure that Johnston Murphy's aren't what they used to be. A pair of their boots didn't last me a year! I don't mean resole and keep going either. The sides and welts around the sole completely fell apart. You couldn't resole them if you wanted to. I really hate that when you consider that you are paying nearly $300 for a pair of the darned things.

That being said, I am giving them a second chance---with someone else's gift card money

. Ordered a pair of Dawson boots in black. We'll see if these are any better. [huh] First impression---nah furgettaboutit. :eusa_doh:

Regards,

J

Jovan · Jan 26, 2007

For that money, I'd be more willing to try out Indy's shoes and boots. I can see myself getting a pair if someone here would elaborate on the construction and leather quality.

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