Simply about leathers

Justhandguns · Jun 5, 2014

I found this article about the current scene of the leather industry. I cannot say how accurate some of the figures and analysis are in the article, NOR I am a tree hugger or vegetarian of some sort. BUT! Next time when you buy a leather jacket, think about all the hard work behind the making of it and the impacts it is making on some other sides of the world.

http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2014/06/how-leather-is-slowly-killing-the-people-and-places-that-make-it/

Have a read and see what you think.

Big J · Jun 5, 2014

Wow, just wow.
I would love to say, having read that, that my leather days are over.
But I can't, because;
1) it's all about market forces and labor costs.
2) the planet won't be able to support the populations of India and China if they had a standard of living comparable to the West.

So, I feel no guilt what-so-ever about buying more leather. After all, they wanted our manufacturing jobs, didn't they?

Sloan1874 · Jun 5, 2014

I guess the moral is: if you're concerned about this sort of thing (and why shouldn't you be?), then be aware of where your jackets are being made and be willing to go that extra mile in cost and effort to make sure their production isn't harming others or the environment. I would imagine that the majority of jackets on here are not made from hides produced in sweat shop conditions - most seem to come from Italian, American or Japanese tanneries, which you'd hope would be properly regulated.

zhz · Jun 5, 2014

As far as I know, in China, the leather manufacture causes serious air/water pollution, but the Chinese gov just published a new regulation about leather industry.

As for labor, most leather factories are located in one of the China's richest area, the workers do make good money by working there.

Worf · Jun 5, 2014

Really makes one think... I knew there were/are costs, I just had no idea how high the costs were.

Worf

gwold · Jun 6, 2014

I had a hard time reading beyond the opening sentence. This author's bias is off-putting.

Ordy · Jun 6, 2014

It's just like any mass produced item. Heavily industrialized in the third world with the costs passed onto the environment.

Justhandguns · Jun 6, 2014

gwold said:
I had a hard time reading beyond the opening sentence. This author's bias is off-putting.

Obviously the article is not aiming for lots of use around here, that is why I said you really have to judge the case on your own.
The good thing is that, most of leather jackets here are made from hides from reputable tanneries.

On the other hand, we should be glad that we are living in a some what more civilised world. There are things that are still beyond our imaginations in places like Pakistan and China. In Pakistan, women get murdered by their families just because they try to marry someone that they love rather than someone who are arranged by the parents, and the problem of 'inbreeding' is still haunting lots of their local communities with genetical defects running along families. In China, money is god, end of story.

So, is veggie tan more environmental friendly than chrome tan?

Fastuni · Jun 6, 2014

On the other hand, we should be glad that we are living in a some what more civilised world.

Glad the civilized Western world is immune and firmly set against violence and money-grubbing./sarcasm

Back to the topic of manufacturing in "third world" countries... Western consumers want more and cheaper crap, Western companies seek more profit at ever cheaper costs. Western leaders also push for ever more trade liberalization. Money is god.

Yes, the world can't support this kind of consumption for billions humans as increasingly this "modern consumption culture" is being emulated by the middle and upper classes in Asia.
But instead of expecting Chinese and Indians i.e. to waive this "living standard", so the post-industrial countries can continue to indulge in their wasteful way of life, everyone should get used to a more modest and considerate lifestyle.
Consumption that values quality and long-lasting goods instead of disposable crap is also a step in the right direction.
Lesser, lasting, better needs to be the demand, not more, cheaper and crappier.

Big J · Jun 6, 2014

You don't have to worry about China. The recently finished 'one child policy' means they now have a demographic time-bomb: social welfare costs are about to sky-rocket, whilst tax paying workers start to dwindle. China will get old before it can get rich.

Fastuni · Jun 6, 2014

Sounds like one should worry (particularly in Asia). Such a development in China won't pass in a tranquil way.

Sir Jacket · Jun 6, 2014

I've been to the Fez tannery. Incredible sight. And, yes, the leather-workers do look like slaves. Morocco was famed for its leather goods centuries ago but quality these days is generally unexceptional. Nice slippers, though.

Justhandguns · Jun 6, 2014

Big J said:
You don't have to worry about China. The recently finished 'one child policy' means they now have a demographic time-bomb: social welfare costs are about to sky-rocket, whilst tax paying workers start to dwindle. China will get old before it can get rich.

As far as I understand, 'one child policy' is still in place. It's just that plenty of Chinese people try to give birth of their 2nd (or subsequent) child outside of the country. Richer people can also circumvent the case just simply by paying. But in poorer areas, forced abortion is still the way to go. While we question how long their bubble is going to burst, we should also be aware that things are already spilling towards the outside world of China. Hong Kong is currently under huge pressure from China regarding to this issue. In terms of the world economy, the potential downfall of China is dangerous to everyone of us. Just think about how empty your department store would be without things which are made there.

Big J · Jun 6, 2014

Justhandguns said:
As far as I understand, 'one child policy' is still in place. It's just that plenty of Chinese people try to give birth of their 2nd (or subsequent) child outside of the country. Richer people can also circumvent the case just simply by paying. But in poorer areas, forced abortion is still the way to go. While we question how long their bubble is going to burst, we should also be aware that things are already spilling towards the outside world of China. Hong Kong is currently under huge pressure from China regarding to this issue. In terms of the world economy, the potential downfall of China is dangerous to everyone of us. Just think about how empty your department store would be without things which are made there.

One child policy was cancelled about a month ago.

Justhandguns · Jun 6, 2014

Big J said:
One child policy was cancelled about a month ago.

Well, to be exact, "allowing couples to have two children if either parent is an only child."

Big J · Jun 6, 2014

Justhandguns said:
Well, to be exact, "allowing couples to have two children if either parent is an only child."

Which of course, anyone aged 35 or younger will be, since they were born during the one child policy.

zhz · Jun 6, 2014

Yes, this is right. Also, you can have two children if one of the parents is minority nationalities regardless of your are the only child or not.

Justhandguns said:
Well, to be exact, "allowing couples to have two children if either parent is an only child."

In China, people actually have more children in poorer area. Forced abortion you guys read on papers are extreme cases which not normally happens.

Edward · Jun 6, 2014

The one-child policy has been a two-chil policy for a long time in some of the much more rural areas. Be interesting to see how it all develops... Personall,y I'm of the opinion that it would be no bad thing if there was a radical drop in human breeding over the next century.

Big J · Jun 7, 2014

Edward said:
The one-child policy has been a two-chil policy for a long time in some of the much more rural areas. Be interesting to see how it all develops... Personall,y I'm of the opinion that it would be no bad thing if there was a radical drop in human breeding over the next century.

Yeah, I agree. Global population needs to drop for the sake of the environment, but when the 'one child' generation can't pay enough tax to look after all the aged in China, their economy will pop, and that will be a huge slap for the global economy. Due to preference for male heirs during the 'one child policy', there are estimated to be about 20 million more single men than women in China- you don't need to be a rocket scientist to work out that that basic discrepancy will cause a big social problem.

regius · May 12, 2019

As much as I love Sunderland’s deerskin & bison, concerns about health & pollution is not looking good for the tannery industry

This is an old article but it can’t be getting better

https://www.timesunion.com/news/article/Gloversville-tanneries-fade-away-but-illness-8343901.php

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