EBay arghh!! ##$&&

OK....shoe on other foot. I bid on and won a Vanson jacket on May 5th, paid via PayPal the day I was notified I was the winner. Package was supposed to arrive at my shipping address between May 9 and 11 based on priority mail delivery stated on the sellers ad. May 11 came and passed and no response to my emails to seller inquiring about ship date. After no response to three emails on the 14th I sent a notification I would begin processing a dispute. Seller responded finally, stating he no longer had tracking number and that release of PayPal funds meant he thought jacket was in my possession, etc. Still have not received it.

Caveat Emptor. For a reason.

Dave

DavidTen said:

OK....shoe on other foot. I bid on and won a Vanson jacket on May 5th, paid via PayPal the day I was notified I was the winner. Package was supposed to arrive at my shipping address between May 9 and 11 based on priority mail delivery stated on the sellers ad. May 11 came and passed and no response to my emails to seller inquiring about ship date. After no response to three emails on the 14th I sent a notification I would begin processing a dispute. Seller responded finally, stating he no longer had tracking number and that release of PayPal funds meant he thought jacket was in my possession, etc. Still have not received it.

Caveat Emptor. For a reason.

Dave

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That’s painful of course and I hope you get your jacket soon but.... it’s not the same thing as being scammed as a seller. You are in a position where you either get the jacket or your money back for sure. In the worst scenario, you are back where you started from. A seller might as well lose the sale and get back something damaged. There are also dishonest sellers of course, not trying to deny that. All we are saying is that eBay doesn’t always feel like a fair game.


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As a rule I'm not a believerv that competition gurarantees quality of service, but in the case of eBay, their 'only real game in town' status makes a big difference. The albeit minimal protection you have as a seller is practically nil in most other contexts.

I well remember the bad old days when sellers could hold buyers to ransom by refusing to leave feedback until after thed buyer had - and 'rewarding' negative or sometimes even neutral feedback with a tit-for-tat negative feedback for the buyer. There were a lot of problems for the buyerf they did address, but unfortunately they did so at the expense of leaving the seller vulnerable. There are a lot of things I just give away now rather than attempt to eBay, as the hassle and fee-gouging isn'#t worth it. Alas, on higher-value items where it's the only real option, the price-gouge still hurts. For the days when it cost a few pence otl ist uyp front, but that was it - and they let you have a second go free if it didn't sell....

Mich486 said:

My recent eBay nightmare was a customer pretending a return and refund due to the item not being as described (he was claiming that I dyed the trousers I sold him of a different colour myself which was absolutely not true). eBay resolved the case in his favour but he never sent the item back so I believe he got refunded by eBay and kept the item too. I kept the payment as well as you lose it only when the returned good reaches you. Still an unnecessary hassle for £30. The buyer has all the power on eBay.

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My understanding is that if you send something back, it has to be acknowledged received before you get the refund. I returned a purchase last week and am still waiting for a refund (seller should have had it at least by Monday).

Thuggee said:

I had one not long ago buyer bought a dark blue peacoat from me was worth only a few $ he complained it was black I said walk outside it’s dark blue , he then said it’s the wrong material I replied what do you mean? It’s sold as per description and clear photos of labels describing the peacoat material, I said if your not happy send it back , never heard from them again

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Some buyers just want to push for a discount. I've complained twice recently. One, a Chinese company refunded me 50% of the cost of a fountain pen I'd bought but they sent me the wrong model; at half price, I decided to accept their offer of a partial refund and keep it. The one I'm waiting to be refunded for is a leather backpack I bought. Looked nice enough on the site, but when it arrived the strap that converted it from shoulder-bag to backpack was too dam short - I mean, only a child of ten or under could have practically used it on both shoulders. Thus it was pointless for me: no need for another shoulderbag. So I started a return procedure with a clear explanation why. They wasted my time by taking four days to offer a partial discount - and when I turned that down, I had to wait for eBay's deadline to automatically put it to the return stage. I'm not seeing anything on eBay where I can demand my money yet... Bottom line: never buy anything on eBay if you can't afford to lose what it costs. Sad, but there you are. I'm sure I'll get the money back eventually, but it's such a pain in the proverbial.

Ernest P Shackleton said:

Ebay, and Paypal, are so anti-seller it is ridiculous. I'd like to see some anti-trust regulations get involved and split their interests. It'll never happen, but it needs some serious alteration by an outside force.

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eBay sold off Paypal in 2015.

All a buyer has to do is change their mind, while sellers have to jump through hoops, many of which are impossible, to stake a rightful claim in the process. The post office is no better. You might as well not bother with special services or insurances. By the time they've ran you around a few times, they're well aware it isn't worth your time. They have attrition on their side. People who sell on ebay for a living work like dogs and are shown no respect by the main players in the process. I used to sell here and there, but I don't bother at all anymore. It isn't worth the headache or losing money to a fickle buyer.

Click to expand...

I have a bunch of stuff I will (reluctantly) sell on eBay overf the next few months, but it's a place I prefer only to use as a buyer - and at that, increasingly less often since it's conscious decision to move away from used items as the main focusa and on to hiogh colume / low unit value shifters. Still good for some things (like my collection of Chinese fountain pens, some of which are, ironically, easier to buy on eBay than here in Beijing), but definitely not what it once was.

DavidTen said:

OK....shoe on other foot. I bid on and won a Vanson jacket on May 5th, paid via PayPal the day I was notified I was the winner. Package was supposed to arrive at my shipping address between May 9 and 11 based on priority mail delivery stated on the sellers ad. May 11 came and passed and no response to my emails to seller inquiring about ship date. After no response to three emails on the 14th I sent a notification I would begin processing a dispute. Seller responded finally, stating he no longer had tracking number and that release of PayPal funds meant he thought jacket was in my possession, etc. Still have not received it.

Caveat Emptor. For a reason.

Dave

Click to expand...

I’ve experienced exactly same situation before. I’m pretty sure if you open a case you will win 10 out of 10 times. Not be able to provide a tracking number put the seller at a very vulnerable place.

I chose to wait and finally the package arrived and I enjoyed the jacket. It turned out that it’s just a very careless seller.

So in one way or another, you don’t have to worry at all.

He’s now filed a not as described complaint with EBay claiming it arrived broken he wants a 70pound refund or a return.

This person was harassing me from day one when the jacket didn’t teleport from the Australia to the UK instantly he started to bombard me with messages some with profanities.( was held in UK customs and tracking showed this )

All through the transaction I’ve kept my cool been nice / professional even when he blamed me for the VAT he had to pay ect.

When the jacket arrived he messaged me saying all was fine he was happy I thought that was the end of things.

Now this crap after 20 days he’s broken the zipper now claiming through EBay the jacket arrived with a stiff zipper yet was never mentioned not once in any previous communications , he’s also claiming I’m being aggressive in his complaint to EBay ? I replied to his message about the broken zipper zipper pointing out the jacket was sold as described you never mentioned any issues when it was received the damage must have occurred in your possession what do you expect from me? ( ok maybe I was being sarcastic slightly definitely not aggressive)

The business man in me says refund move on ( I’m out of pocket AU$100)keep emotions out of it.

What does everyone think refund move on ( will that finally be the end of it as the refund will be through EBay and all recorded) he can’t come back and harass me anymore?

Or tell him to pound sand EBay will probably side with him , I’ll
end up with a broken jacket come back with more than just a zipper issues and be out of pocket way more than AU$100 and time.

I’m leaning towards a refund at this point of time if $100 makes it go away and that’s finally the end of it that’s the direction I may go, I’ll think about it over the day.



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Brettafett said:

Do you have the pics you used for the ad? Do they show the zipper? Any other pics or close-ups? These will stand in your favour. Agree, to contact Ebay and PayPal and state your case.

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Yes probably not the clearest pics of the zipper though - when the buyer received the jacket he messaged me saying it was great was happy never once mentioned anything or any concerns about a stiff or broken zipper ( was nothing wrong with the zipper when in my possession)


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Thuggee said:

He’s now filed a not as described complaint with EBay claiming it arrived broken he wants a 70pound refund or a return.

This person was harassing me from day one when the jacket didn’t teleport from the Australia to the UK instantly he started to bombard me with messages some with profanities.( was held in UK customs and tracking showed this )

All through the transaction I’ve kept my cool been nice / professional even when he blamed me for the VAT he had to pay ect.

When the jacket arrived he messaged me saying all was fine he was happy I thought that was the end of things.

Now this crap after 20 days he’s broken the zipper now claiming through EBay the jacket arrived with a stiff zipper yet was never mentioned not once in any previous communications , he’s also claiming I’m being aggressive in his complaint to EBay ? I replied to his message about the broken zipper zipper pointing out the jacket was sold as described you never mentioned any issues when it was received the damage must have occurred in your possession what do you expect from me? ( ok maybe I was being sarcastic slightly definitely not aggressive)

The business man in me says refund move on ( I’m out of pocket AU$100)keep emotions out of it.

What does everyone think refund move on ( will that finally be the end of it as the refund will be through EBay and all recorded) he can’t come back and harass me anymore?

Or tell him to pound sand EBay will probably side with him , I’ll
end up with a broken jacket come back with more than just a zipper issues and be out of pocket way more than AU$100 and time.

I’m leaning towards a refund at this point of time if $100 makes it go away and that’s finally the end of it that’s the direction I may go, I’ll think about it over the day.



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Click to expand...

Go through the process with eBay. Point out the fact that positive feedback was left and the resulting zipper failure was a result of the buyers abuse. Encourage eBay to review your communications with the buyer. They will. Do NOT issue a refund. eBay May refund the buyer but it won’t come from you. They will eat the loss to keep this asshat buying on their site. You won’t be out anything. Let the process play out.

ton312 said:

Go through the process with eBay. Point out the fact that positive feedback was left and the resulting zipper failure was a result of the buyers abuse. Encourage eBay to review your communications with the buyer. They will. Do NOT issue a refund. eBay May refund the buyer but it won’t come from you. They will eat the loss to keep this asshat buying on their site. You won’t be out anything. Let the process play out.

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I have 5 days to reply the buyer is a real strange one without a doubt, claiming with EBay I’m being aggressive in my communications with him? I’ve alway been polite to the point/business like as I know EBay review these if needed, the buyer on the other hand has been aggressive some previous messages full of rants and swearing, what’s funny he messaged me the day the jacket arrive saying it was perfect and was very happy, not once was there ever a mention of a stiff or broken zipper or any other issues until 20 days later.


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Thuggee said:

the buyer on the other hand has been aggressive some previous messages full of rants and swearing, what’s funny he messaged me the day the jacket arrive saying it was perfect and was very happy, not once was there ever a mention of a stiff or broken zipper or any other issues until 20 days later.


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Click to expand...

This is precisely what puts the case in your favor. Respond pointing to this message. eBay will see it. Case closed.

Thuggee said:

He’s now filed a not as described complaint with EBay claiming it arrived broken he wants a 70pound refund or a return.

This person was harassing me from day one when the jacket didn’t teleport from the Australia to the UK instantly he started to bombard me with messages some with profanities.( was held in UK customs and tracking showed this )

All through the transaction I’ve kept my cool been nice / professional even when he blamed me for the VAT he had to pay ect.

When the jacket arrived he messaged me saying all was fine he was happy I thought that was the end of things.

Now this crap after 20 days he’s broken the zipper now claiming through EBay the jacket arrived with a stiff zipper yet was never mentioned not once in any previous communications , he’s also claiming I’m being aggressive in his complaint to EBay ? I replied to his message about the broken zipper zipper pointing out the jacket was sold as described you never mentioned any issues when it was received the damage must have occurred in your possession what do you expect from me? ( ok maybe I was being sarcastic slightly definitely not aggressive)

The business man in me says refund move on ( I’m out of pocket AU$100)keep emotions out of it.

What does everyone think refund move on ( will that finally be the end of it as the refund will be through EBay and all recorded) he can’t come back and harass me anymore?

Or tell him to pound sand EBay will probably side with him , I’ll
end up with a broken jacket come back with more than just a zipper issues and be out of pocket way more than AU$100 and time.

I’m leaning towards a refund at this point of time if $100 makes it go away and that’s finally the end of it that’s the direction I may go, I’ll think about it over the day.



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Click to expand...

You'll be fine. The communications support your story. The problem happened after they accepted it. Stand your ground, politely restate your case and concede absolutely nothing, and make it about the facts and the item, not the buyer. . You will be fine. If ebay doesn't rule in your favor, appeal.

Thuggee said:

He’s now filed a not as described complaint with EBay claiming it arrived broken he wants a 70pound refund or a return.

This person was harassing me from day one when the jacket didn’t teleport from the Australia to the UK instantly he started to bombard me with messages some with profanities.( was held in UK customs and tracking showed this )

All through the transaction I’ve kept my cool been nice / professional even when he blamed me for the VAT he had to pay ect.

When the jacket arrived he messaged me saying all was fine he was happy I thought that was the end of things.

Now this crap after 20 days he’s broken the zipper now claiming through EBay the jacket arrived with a stiff zipper yet was never mentioned not once in any previous communications , he’s also claiming I’m being aggressive in his complaint to EBay ? I replied to his message about the broken zipper zipper pointing out the jacket was sold as described you never mentioned any issues when it was received the damage must have occurred in your possession what do you expect from me? ( ok maybe I was being sarcastic slightly definitely not aggressive)

The business man in me says refund move on ( I’m out of pocket AU$100)keep emotions out of it.

What does everyone think refund move on ( will that finally be the end of it as the refund will be through EBay and all recorded) he can’t come back and harass me anymore?

Or tell him to pound sand EBay will probably side with him , I’ll
end up with a broken jacket come back with more than just a zipper issues and be out of pocket way more than AU$100 and time.

I’m leaning towards a refund at this point of time if $100 makes it go away and that’s finally the end of it that’s the direction I may go, I’ll think about it over the day.

Click to expand...

I certainly wouldn't pay a penny. Stick to your guns & let eBay sort it out now. Ignore the buyer's messages from now on & try to put this incident out of your mind. There is no certitude that eBay will side with the buyer if they have to judicate, especially if you have good ratings & they read the messages.
Even if you do 'refund' him, you'll have no guarantee that he won't be back demanding more money if anything else goes wrong with the jacket.

Lean'n'mean said:

I certainly wouldn't pay a penny. Stick to your guns & let eBay sort it out now. Ignore the buyer's messages from now on & try to put this incident out of your mind. There is no certitude that eBay will side with the buyer if they have to judicate, especially if you have good ratings & they read the messages.
Even if you do 'refund' him, you'll have no guarantee that he won't be back demanding more money if anything else goes wrong with the jacket.

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This buyers a low baller dead beat for sure, this partial refund bullshit is a well documented eBay scam, I’m weighing up my options, do I want to run the eBay/PayPal gauntlet or give him a partial refund and cut my losses taking the low risk route.

As eBay can’t force a partial refund, I’m currently leaning towards the gauntlet at the moment, if I lose it burns but not life ending, the buyer has to navigate sending the jacket back to get a full refund, the eBay system doesn’t accomodate free return postage for international sellers so he’s out of luck there no free prepaid postage label, the buyer then has to attempt to get his VAT/Customs duty refunded, and no full refund until the jackets\ tracked and delivered back to me here in Australia.

I should add I’ve been selling on eBay for close to 20 years close to a 3000, 100% rating will be very disappointed if EBay side with this buyer will keep the thread updated.

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I did once get ( and deserve !) a partial refund , of 100 pounds sterling no less.

It was on a GROSSLY mis-described Aero Highwayman. Description was "barely used".

ebay seller in the UK , a female , had quite a few "high end" jackets listed at the time.

Grainy low res' photos , too hard to really see any faults. EXPENSIVE post cost to Perth Western Australia ex-UK.

When the jacket got here "flogged out" would have been a better description. I acted instantly, ebay dispute 100%.

After a struggle , me posting the Aero back to the UK was a no brainer of course !

Why ? , well then I would have PAID for the jacket , PAID for the post and PAID for the return post.

How silly would that have been ? NO jacket and NO money. My worst eBay experience actually.

I "restored" that jacket , and with the 100 quid refund then sold it to a guy from Melbourne and "washed my face".

The partial refund was OFFERED by the seller , not asked for by me !

I advertised it truthfully , and the Melbourne fellow sent his adult son , a Perth WA resident , no inspect and buy.

So all is well that ends well , and nearly every ebay purchase before or since has been 100% AOK.

Downunder G Man said:

I did once get ( and deserve !) a partial refund , of 100 pounds sterling no less.

It was on a GROSSLY mis-described Aero Highwayman. Description was "barely used".

ebay seller in the UK , a female , had quite a few "high end" jackets listed at the time.

Grainy low res' photos , too hard to really see any faults. EXPENSIVE post cost to Perth Western Australia ex-UK.

When the jacket got here "flogged out" would have been a better description. I acted instantly, ebay dispute 100%.

After a struggle , me posting the Aero back to the UK was a no brainer of course !

Why ? , well then I would have PAID for the jacket , PAID for the post and PAID for the return post.

How silly would that have been ? NO jacket and NO money. My worst eBay experience actually.

I "restored" that jacket , and with the 100 quid refund then sold it to a guy from Melbourne and "washed my face".

The partial refund was OFFERED by the seller , not asked for by me !

I advertised it truthfully , and the Melbourne fellow sent his adult son , a Perth WA resident , no inspect and buy.

So all is well that ends well , and nearly every ebay purchase before or since has been 100% AOK.

Click to expand...

Can relate to that receive something out of the box from day 1 not as described make a complaint who wouldn’t - if you received a $1000 jacket would you wait 20 days to complain about a zipper , keeping in mind when the buyer received the jacket from day 1 it he was happy had obviously checked it over and it was received as sold/described and left good feedback , he then proceeded to I assume wear it for 20 days buggered the zipper now wants me to pay for the repair claiming it was faulty from day 1.


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I hear you Thugee. This Aero I mentioned was a 300 pounds sterling jacket at the time , 500/600 $AUD ( plus post !)

After all the back and forth , "restoration" in Perth WA , I only just got my "300 quid plus post" back.

100 quid from the UK seller , the other 250 Quid equivalent AUD fro the guy in Melbourne.

I swore at the time "never again" and of course I have..( as you do !)

I bought 2 jackets out of Russia , on this forum, (Thanks Alex Lutov) ,and things were 100 % AOK

If you give him partial refunds outside the eBay box, you risk him continuing the case and if he for whatever reasons wins, he may get a full refund and keep that partial refund on top of it. Besides, if you pay a partial refund now, who says he won't ask for another 100 bucks next week. Go through with the case, no half measures.

It's important you appear as the rightful and reasonable towards eBay. I'm not saying you are not, but you know, when being wronged, we sometimes are unfocused and get personal. Don't allow that to happen. Whoever at eBay is handling this case is a human being and will be inclined to make it right for the one they feel are the "good guy here".

Also, don't reply to him in pms anymore; communication through the case only. Point out the jacket is intact on pictures, he didn't complain when receiving the jacket and left positive feedback therefore the zipper must have been working fine when he received the jacket. Point out zippers on vtg and repro jackets need to be treated gently and with due diligence always and that he may have been too rough on it by these standards. I see no way you don't win that.

I also would call eBay and discuss the case with someone. Good chance that after speaking with you they close any BS case right then and there. That’s been my experience. You are clearly on the right side on this. Talk to someone about it before this guy does and clouds the issue with BS.

To make matters worse there are dodgy sellers on ebay as well.

Recently bought a toy for my little boy (only cheap thank god). I didn't check the delivery time but it was over a month...then the day it was finally due according to the delivery timeframe, the seller messaged me, said there was an issue and he would have to resend it. Begged me not to leave negative feedback. So I said no problem and waited again...sure enough a few weeks later some plastic piece of rubbish not at all related to what I had bought turned up but when I tried to enter negative feedback, the option to leave feedback was gone.....I'm assuming its some delay scam they run so you can't warn other buyers?

@Thuggee if you give him a partial refund there is nothing stopping him taking that then demanding a full refund on top of that. The scam they then use is to return something else to you as the refund is paid by ebay on confirmation of a delivery.....they can't tell what was delivered only something was. So the scammer gets the partial refund you paid to try and make them go away, the full refund through ebay AND they keep the jacket because they sent you something else.

...not bad for a deadbeats days work

I’m confused as to how the positive feedback score doesn’t lock the transaction. It should. That should be the final handshake in the deal and I suspect it is. @JMax is right. Get on the horn and I bet dollars to doughnuts it gets closed then and there.