Questions About the United States Navy Peacoat

Peacoat · Jan 9, 2020

Actually, this site has the easiest format for uploading pics that I have found. I just uploaded the below pic to ensure that it was as easy as I remember. It had been so long, I had forgotten how to do it. Just click on "Upload A File,"and pick which picture from your hardrive you want to upload. That's all there is to it. Before you choose a pic, you need to place your cursor at the place in the message where you want the picture to appear. The default location is at the top of the message. Then click on "Upload A File." It may be that one needs a minimum number of posts before this feature is available.

Pictures may also be loaded from a third party server. Just click on the "image" icon at the top of the message and go from there. That's the way we used to do it. Then the Photobucket images started disappearing when that company started charging an exorbitant amount for members to keep their photos.* All of my peacoat pics in the Peacoat Guide were originally loaded with links to Photobucket. When I saw the writing on the wall, I downloaded all of the pics to my hard drive, then went back, deleted all the pics with links to Photobucket and uploaded from my hard drive. And there they will be until the end of time, or until TPTB delete the guide.

Your current issue coat is a 1986 coat, and the vintage one is a 1949 coat. The difference between the two shells is noticeable. In comparing them, I think you will see what I have been talking about over the years.
________
* Photobucket has since changed its pricing structure because it was losing members. Even so, I will never go back as the company has lost my trust.

Scrapping The Boards

Peacoat · Jan 9, 2020

AbbaDatDeHat said:
View attachment 204933
Thank you Peacoat, i couldn’t agree more about the CG wool finish. It’s nicer than many hats i’ve seen.
The daughter’s era is close, i believe, but not a CG. It appears equal if not identical to both my CGs. All 3 exceptional. We are both very happy with them.
The pic is of the daughter’s label.
Be well. Bowen

That label was used in coats from WWII up until about 1947. If your daughter's coat has 8 buttons showing on the front, it is a WWII peacoat. If it has 6 buttons showing, it is post WWII, about 1946 or 1947.

Spoonbelly · Jan 9, 2020

AbbaDatDeHat said:
View attachment 204871 View attachment 204872 View attachment 204873 Greetings All:
Today....was wearing this so i thought i’d pop it in here. Coast Guard pea coat that is a marvelous wool. I was so impressed i bought another one for me then the Navy version for my Daughter. Gave me great joy to see her reaction when i gave it to her and told her how sought after this issue was. Hell, she goo goo’d and gaa gaa’d more than when i gave her a vintage Langlitz cross zip. Smart kid!! Lol
Be well. Bowen

A few years ago I had both a '49 and a WWII Coast Guard coat. Both were a tinch small so I resold them on eBay. Both of those coats were exceptional. The wool was just beautiful. What size is your newly acquired '49? If it is a size 46 that is very rare for a '49 coat.

eastvandan · Jan 10, 2020

So I found this forum/thread very late last night after a Google search of "Modern Garments, Inc". I then proceeded to fall into a wormhole of many years of posts, which held more info about peacoats than I ever imagined was a thing. I've had this peacoat in my possession for nearly 10 years now, handed down from a friend who purchased from a thrift shop, but was too big for him. I've always wondered the age and if it was an authentic USN coat due to the only tag inside:

Now, utilizing the info on this forum, and according to this tag, the coat should be a 1975 40L Kersey coat. The ptp measurement however, is 22.5", so possibly it is mislabeled? I'm usually a 44R in a blazer/overcoat but surprisingly, I can fit myself into this '40L' peacoat although it is very snug in the chest with just a tshirt underneath. However, if I wear a sweater of any sort of thickness, I cannot button the coat but the shoulders still fit perfectly. I believe it to be a genuine Long coat, as the sleeves are much too long for me (I'm 5'9") but still wearable and the overall coat length measures 33"(?) and hits me about mid-thigh. I would describe the overall fit as quite "slim tailored", which I rather enjoy. As you can see, it has the black plastic buttons, but they've definitely been replaced/resown (poorly) through the liner and the bottom two buttons are sown through the pockets. Pocket bags are white and one is ripped open along the entire bottom. Coat is very dark blue, almost black. The liner stitching has come undone in a couple of places and the collar shows some wear (dirt?) along it's top fold but otherwise, for a 45 year old coat, it's in great condition, seems to be very high quality wool and has garnered many a compliment.

Due to the sizing difference, I still have some doubts as to the authenticity of this being an actual Kersey coat and whether or not I should invest some money into bringing it fully back to life? I'd like to dry clean it, get the necessary stitching redone on the liner and pocket, shorten the sleeves, re position the buttons to allow a bit more room and although it is not period correct, I'd like to change the buttons to anchor buttons as I prefer the aesthetic. Also, should all of the buttons be moved to maintain the correct distances or just the one side? Any input or comments from the community would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

Birddog1911 · Jan 10, 2020

Spoonbelly said:
A few years ago I had both a '49 and a WWII Coast Guard coat. Both were a tinch small so I resold them on eBay. Both of those coats were exceptional. The wool was just beautiful. What size is your newly acquired '49? If it is a size 46 that is very rare for a '49 coat.

I thought that I got lucky finding mine in a 46. If Abba got that lucky, that would be something. I imagine that a size 46, '49 USCG peacoat would be VERY rare.

Peacoat · Jan 10, 2020

eastvandan said:
So I found this forum/thread very late last night after a Google search of "Modern Garments, Inc". I then proceeded to fall into a wormhole of many years of posts, which held more info about peacoats than I ever imagined was a thing. I've had this peacoat in my possession for nearly 10 years now, handed down from a friend who purchased from a thrift shop, but was too big for him. I've always wondered the age and if it was an authentic USN coat due to the only tag inside:
View attachment 205073
Now, utilizing the info on this forum, and according to this tag, the coat should be a 1975 40L Kersey coat. The ptp measurement however, is 22.5", so possibly it is mislabeled? I'm usually a 44R in a blazer/overcoat but surprisingly, I can fit myself into this '40L' peacoat although it is very snug in the chest with just a tshirt underneath. However, if I wear a sweater of any sort of thickness, I cannot button the coat but the shoulders still fit perfectly. I believe it to be a genuine Long coat, as the sleeves are much too long for me (I'm 5'9") but still wearable and the overall coat length measures 33"(?) and hits me about mid-thigh. I would describe the overall fit as quite "slim tailored", which I rather enjoy. As you can see, it has the black plastic buttons, but they've definitely been replaced/resown (poorly) through the liner and the bottom two buttons are sown through the pockets. Pocket bags are white and one is ripped open along the entire bottom. Coat is very dark blue, almost black. The liner stitching has come undone in a couple of places and the collar shows some wear (dirt?) along it's top fold but otherwise, for a 45 year old coat, it's in great condition, seems to be very high quality wool and has garnered many a compliment.
View attachment 205075
Due to the sizing difference, I still have some doubts as to the authenticity of this being an actual Kersey coat and whether or not I should invest some money into bringing it fully back to life? I'd like to dry clean it, get the necessary stitching redone on the liner and pocket, shorten the sleeves, re position the buttons to allow a bit more room and although it is not period correct, I'd like to change the buttons to anchor buttons as I prefer the aesthetic. Also, should all of the buttons be moved to maintain the correct distances or just the one side? Any input or comments from the community would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

Yes, this is a genuine US Navy peacoat. The chest size is actually a 42 and not the labeled size of 40. A very few just don't have the proper size on the label, as member @Cooperson found out and brought it to my attention. You can move the buttons about an inch without altering the appearance of the coat. If you have the sleeves shortened, please ask the tailor to save the excess material inside the cuff if possible. That way if someone with long arms should buy the jacket in the future, the sleeves can be let out.

I would, however, suggest that you not have the coat altered, but to sell it and get one that fits you properly. If the coat hits you mid thigh, that is much too long. The hem of the coat should end about an inch below your butt. A long size is just too much for you. You just need to get a peacoat that properly fits you. They aren't that expensive, and it will now be easy to get a properly fitted coat.

With an actual 44" chest, you can wear a size 42 for a trim fit and no sweater underneath. A size 44 will be a bit loose without a sweater, but can be layered with a sweater or a vest.

It sounds as if you have read my dating guide, but if you have not, the link is below.

Welcome to the Lounge.

https://www.thefedoralounge.com/thr...-dating-the-united-states-navy-peacoat.72058/

never_behind · Jan 10, 2020

eastvandan said:
So I found this forum/thread very late last night after a Google search of "Modern Garments, Inc". I then proceeded to fall into a wormhole of many years of posts, which held more info about peacoats than I ever imagined was a thing. I've had this peacoat in my possession for nearly 10 years now, handed down from a friend who purchased from a thrift shop, but was too big for him. I've always wondered the age and if it was an authentic USN coat due to the only tag inside:
View attachment 205073
Now, utilizing the info on this forum, and according to this tag, the coat should be a 1975 40L Kersey coat. The ptp measurement however, is 22.5", so possibly it is mislabeled? I'm usually a 44R in a blazer/overcoat but surprisingly, I can fit myself into this '40L' peacoat although it is very snug in the chest with just a tshirt underneath. However, if I wear a sweater of any sort of thickness, I cannot button the coat but the shoulders still fit perfectly. I believe it to be a genuine Long coat, as the sleeves are much too long for me (I'm 5'9") but still wearable and the overall coat length measures 33"(?) and hits me about mid-thigh. I would describe the overall fit as quite "slim tailored", which I rather enjoy. As you can see, it has the black plastic buttons, but they've definitely been replaced/resown (poorly) through the liner and the bottom two buttons are sown through the pockets. Pocket bags are white and one is ripped open along the entire bottom. Coat is very dark blue, almost black. The liner stitching has come undone in a couple of places and the collar shows some wear (dirt?) along it's top fold but otherwise, for a 45 year old coat, it's in great condition, seems to be very high quality wool and has garnered many a compliment.
View attachment 205075
Due to the sizing difference, I still have some doubts as to the authenticity of this being an actual Kersey coat and whether or not I should invest some money into bringing it fully back to life? I'd like to dry clean it, get the necessary stitching redone on the liner and pocket, shorten the sleeves, re position the buttons to allow a bit more room and although it is not period correct, I'd like to change the buttons to anchor buttons as I prefer the aesthetic. Also, should all of the buttons be moved to maintain the correct distances or just the one side? Any input or comments from the community would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

I am 5’9” as well and needed a short to fit properly on the length.

eastvandan · Jan 11, 2020

Peacoat said:
Yes, this is a genuine US Navy peacoat. The chest size is actually a 42 and not the labeled size of 40. A very few just don't have the proper size on the label, as member @Cooperson found out and brought it to my attention. You can move the buttons about an inch without altering the appearance of the coat. If you have the sleeves shortened, please ask the tailor to save the excess material inside the cuff if possible. That way if someone with long arms should buy the jacket in the future, the sleeves can be let out.

I would, however, suggest that you not have the coat altered, but to sell it and get one that fits you properly. If the coat hits you mid thigh, that is much too long. The hem of the coat should end about an inch below your butt. A long size is just too much for you. You just need to get a peacoat that properly fits you. They aren't that expensive, and it will now be easy to get a properly fitted coat.

With an actual 44" chest, you can wear a size 42 for a trim fit and no sweater underneath. A size 44 will be a bit loose without a sweater, but can be layered with a sweater or a vest.

It sounds as if you have read my dating guide, but if you have not, the link is below.

Welcome to the Lounge.

https://www.thefedoralounge.com/thr...-dating-the-united-states-navy-peacoat.72058/

Thank you for the reply Peacoat! Your input is greatly appreciated and I'm glad to know that I have a quality, vintage piece. And I did already read your dating guide; quite an impressive collection of information indeed, well done.

Given that my actual, bare chest measurement is 46" I believe a 44R, or even a 44S as @never_behind kindly suggested, would fit best to my liking. Following your suggestion to not alter my current coat, I've scanned ebay for vintage kersey coats over the last couple of hours, to no avail. If I'm correct in remembering previous conversations I read in this thread, a 44R is something of a rare find? I'm thinking a 44S, near impossible... Perhaps I will just need to exercise patience!

Also, after seeing many examples on ebay, I think I may have sold the condition of my current coat short. Besides the few, somewhat minor details I mentioned previously, I'd have to say my coat is in pristine, nearly new condition by most comparisons. There are no marks, moth spots or flaws of any kind, present anywhere on the outer shell. And although I was already quite aware that the length of my coat was wrong, I've never personally minded it, the times I've worn it (except for the sleeve length). Mid-thigh was a bit of an over-estimate, and using your benchmark, it sits about 3" below my butt. This makes for a tough decision, but if I do decide to alter it, I'll keep your suggestions in mind.

Also, I'd like to mention, that this all really started with me thinking about purchasing a new Schott 720N... but, thanks to you, now that I know I have an authentic USN vintage coat, made of the best kersey wool... well, nothing else will do for a possible replacement, except the real thing. Thanks again!

Doctor Damage · Jan 11, 2020

I think someone posted recently about the peacoat being discontinued, based on an article from a few years back. Here's an article dated last month which mentions the peacoat (about halfway through) so they're obviously still in use.

https://www.military.com/daily-news...o-piece-swimsuits-gold-star-lapel-button.html

Blackadder · Jan 20, 2020

Pre WW2

SailorJerry · Feb 12, 2020

Hello everyone, first time posting here but I've been scouring these forums for a while, learning all I could about the mighty USN Peacoat LOL My quest originally began when a girlfriend gave me a cheapo crappy Old Navy knockoff peacoat, but I didn't know any better at the time and loved it. Even a piece of cheap Chinese or Vietnamese-made junk like that was still warm and got lots of comments and compliments, especially from old vets who didn't realize it was just a crappy replica. I wore it basically to death even so, and eventually donated it to the local Mission, so hopefully it's still keeping somebody warm.

Ever since I got rid of it 10+ years ago tho, I've wanted to get a "real" peacoat. A couple of years ago I discovered Sterlingwear was the current contract supplier to the Navy, but the cost of a new one from them ($300+!!) made me procrastinate getting one until a few months ago, when I learned that they are essentially out of business now anyway. So I took to the web and wound up accidentally educating myself regarding all things Kersey and Melton as I looked for a suitable specimen, hitting the information mother-lode when I found TFL and all you nice folks. It didn't take long poring over the conversations here before I came to the inevitable conclusion that a new Sterlingwear or a Schott wasn't what I wanted anyway, and so the eBay and Etsy scouring began lol

Finally today, I managed to seal the deal on what I believe is a '49 Kersey 42R coat in primo shape! $180 plus WA state sales tax (which I haaaaaate!) But even still, I think I got a pretty damned good deal. And the cherry on top - I bought it from the daughter of the original sailor that it was first issued to!

Here's the pix from the eBay listing - can you guys confirm this is the '49 tag?

AbbaDatDeHat · Feb 13, 2020

SailorJerry said:
Hello everyone, first time posting here but I've been scouring these forums for a while, learning all I could about the mighty USN Peacoat LOL My quest originally began when a girlfriend gave me a cheapo crappy Old Navy knockoff peacoat, but I didn't know any better at the time and loved it. Even a piece of cheap Chinese or Vietnamese-made junk like that was still warm and got lots of comments and compliments, especially from old vets who didn't realize it was just a crappy replica. I wore it basically to death even so, and eventually donated it to the local Mission, so hopefully it's still keeping somebody warm.

Ever since I got rid of it 10+ years ago tho, I've wanted to get a "real" peacoat. A couple of years ago I discovered Sterlingwear was the current contract supplier to the Navy, but the cost of a new one from them ($300+!!) made me procrastinate getting one until a few months ago, when I learned that they are essentially out of business now anyway. So I took to the web and wound up accidentally educating myself regarding all things Kersey and Melton as I looked for a suitable specimen, hitting the information mother-lode when I found TFL and all you nice folks. It didn't take long poring over the conversations here before I came to the inevitable conclusion that a new Sterlingwear or a Schott wasn't what I wanted anyway, and so the eBay and Etsy scouring began lol

Finally today, I managed to seal the deal on what I believe is a '49 Kersey 42R coat in primo shape! $180 plus WA state sales tax (which I haaaaaate!) But even still, I think I got a pretty damned good deal. And the cherry on top - I bought it from the daughter of the original sailor that it was first issued to!

Here's the pix from the eBay listing - can you guys confirm this is the '49 tag? View attachment 212715 View attachment 212716 View attachment 212718 View attachment 212719 View attachment 212720 View attachment 212721

Welcome to the lounge Jerry. You got one of the good ones imho. It appears to be pristine and the history of it makes it all the more sweet. Most excellent. Fit pics would be nice.
Be well. Bowen

SailorJerry · Feb 13, 2020

AbbaDatDeHat said:
Welcome to the lounge Jerry. You got one of the good ones imho. It appears to be pristine and the history of it makes it all the more sweet. Most excellent. Fit pics would be nice.
Be well. Bowen

I definitely will as soon as that gem shows up at my door! LOL

Birddog1911 · Feb 13, 2020

That does look really good.

I got lucky and found a size 44 1949 peacoat, after getting my sz 46 1949! Fits just a little bit better than the sz46, so I'm parting with that one.

Peacoat · Feb 13, 2020

Yes, that is a 1949 coat. Looks as thought it had little wear during its career. Congratulations on a good score.

As you knew the proper date of your tag, you have probably already read my dating guide. But as you didn't mention it in your post, here it is:
https://www.thefedoralounge.com/thr...-dating-the-united-states-navy-peacoat.72058/

Welcome to the Lounge.

@Birddog1911 There are a couple of members here who would like to have your size 46 peacoat. Hopefully, one will see your post and contact you.

SailorJerry · Feb 13, 2020

Peacoat said:
Yes, that is a 1949 coat. Looks as thought it had little wear during its career. Congratulations on a good score.

As you knew the proper date of your tag, you have probably already read my dating guide. But as you didn't mention it in your post, here it is:
https://www.thefedoralounge.com/thr...-dating-the-united-states-navy-peacoat.72058/

Welcome to the Lounge.

@Birddog1911 There are a couple of members here who would like to have your size 46 peacoat. Hopefully, one will see your post and contact you.

Thanks PC. Is the '49 the only year with the fouled-anchors/Clothing Depot tag?

On a side-note, I saw a very nice WWII example (as dated using the info in your guide which I have indeed read, many times LOL) for sale yesterday for DIRT CHEAP (let's just say under $50 - including shipping!) The given measurements of 25" sleeve, 19" shoulders and 33" back length, but no p2p msrmt and the original main tag appears to be missing. There is the secondary tag at the hang loop and the other name/rate tag on the exterior of the inner pocket. But the coat has the throat latch and 8 buttons showing, so it is clearly a WWII coat. I advised the seller that the coat is worth much more than the price they were asking, but yet I see today that the price hasn't changed. I am very tempted to buy it, with a clear conscience having already advised the seller.

Peacoat · Feb 13, 2020

@SailorJerry I look at the tag in its entirety. The 1949 tag is the only one I have found to have all of the characteristics of that tag. I'm not saying those tags weren't placed on 1948 contract coats, but I haven't run across one.

I found myself in your situation with a WWI coat. I wanted the coat, but I didn't want to steal it from the seller. It was her father's coat from 1936. I told her she should save it for her grandchildren, and if she ever wanted to sell it in the future to contact me. Back then we could share email addresses, and I gave her mine. Haven't heard from her, and probably never will. What I wish I had done was to tell her the coat was much more valuable than she thought, and I would be willing to pay her $XX for the coat. But I didn't. Wish now I had.

Go ahead and bid on the coat with a clear conscience.

Gene Allen · Feb 14, 2020

Does anyone have loose Zumwalt pea coat buttons for sale?
One of mine fell off.
Thanks
Gene
504-220-9310

O'DubhGhaill · Feb 14, 2020

Buttons. I have noticed differences in USN issue peacoat buttons. The WWII era buttons are thinner than later buttons, that look like they were manufactured like a type of sandwich construction? Later ones have a faint whitish layer running the center circumference of the button edge. The WWII buttons do not and are thinner?

Peacoat · Feb 15, 2020

@Gene Allen I looked on ebay (first 4 pages) without seeing any of them. A cursory search of Amazon didn't turn up anything. You probably ought to do a full ebay search, as I think that is the best bet. There should be thousands of them in circulation as all were replaced in 1984.

@O'DubhGhail Good eye. I had never noticed that before. But, yes, the WWII buttons do appear to be a bit slimmer.

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