Five Star Leather Jackets

TooManyHatsOnlyOneHead · Dec 9, 2020

Fits you like a hefty bag...

That's a pretty spot on fit. The knits though on the bottom hem, is that a particular design that had the wider knits? Don't think I've seen anything like that (unless you count the collar they tried to send me

)

Being new to the A and G styles, something I made a mistake on was not accounting for where I wanted the leather to measure. I just used typical back and sleeve length. Looking back I probably would have added an inch to the sleeves so the knits tucked in a little more. The back I got lucky because I went a little longer than usual and it worked out. But it's a good PSA for anyone else trying for the first time. Account for the knit length when giving the measurements.

Carlos840 · Dec 9, 2020

Marc mndt said:
If 5* were making BK jackets (which most of them are hh), I'd expect 5* to offer hh as well.

Not necessarily, they could be making BK jackets with leather exclusive to BK, just like Vanson has Horween that is exclusive to Left field.

Marc mndt said:
Also, BK currently has lead times of over 6 months.
Imagine 5* delivering a BK branded jacket to the UK within one week, and then BK keeping it in stock for half a year before sending it to their customer.

Why not? If people have to wait longer your product is more exclusive.
Look at GW!

I'm not saying i am right and you are wrong, just that we don't know, and that something sounding weird doesn't make it untrue or impossible.

dannyk · Dec 9, 2020

Carlos840 said:
Not necessarily, they could be making BK jackets with leather exclusive to BK, just like Vanson has Horween that is exclusive to Left field.

Why not? If people have to wait longer your product is more exclusive.
Look at GW!

I'm not saying i am right and you are wrong, just that we don't know, and that something sounding weird doesn't make it untrue.

I agree not impossible. In the sense there were how many Japanese makers all working out of the same warehouse and sharing machinery etc..but were their own brands with own designs and leathers. Which companies they were I can’t recall I know others here will. It’s completely possible Shawn runs the place that makes the jackets and decided to branch out on his own and can’t afford all the “good” stuff right out of the gates. Or has an agreement with BK to cover this part of the market and not encroach on BKs turf. Is it likely? I don’t know. Impossible? Definitely not.

Carlos840 · Dec 9, 2020

dannyk said:
I agree not impossible. In the sense there were how many Japanese makers all working out of the same warehouse and sharing machinery etc..but were their own brands with own designs and leathers. Which companies they were I can’t recall I know others here will. It’s completely possible Shawn runs the place that makes the jackets and decided to branch out on his own and can’t afford all the “good” stuff right out of the gates. Or has an agreement with BK to cover this part of the market and not encroach on BKs turf. Is it likely? I don’t know. Impossible? Definitely not.

Exactly my point.
For all we know BK could just be doing what @ton312 did but on a much larger scale and using brand exclusive hardwear and leather.
Someone orders, they make an order sheet similar to Tony's one but using their specific sizing and patterns, place an order in Pakistan, receive the jacket in Greece, pack it in a fancy box, send it to the client.

Or 5 Star just copied a label they happened to see on a BK jacket.

Both sound possible to me. I don't have any proof either way, i just thought the labels were a weird coincidence knowing the "BK are made in Pakistan" rumours.

dannyk · Dec 9, 2020

Carlos840 said:
Exactly my point.
For all we know BK could just be doing what @ton312 did but on a much larger scale and using brand exclusive hardwear and leather.
Someone orders, they make an order sheet similar to Tony's one but using their specific sizing and patterns, place an order in Pakistan, receive the jacket in Greece, pack it in a fancy box, send it to the client.

Or 5 Star just copied a label they happened to see on a BK jacket.

Both sound possible to me. I don't have any proof either way, i just thought the labels were a weird coincidence knowing the "BK are made in Pakistan" rumours.

Yup totally agree. Any of those scenarios are completely possible. And really it’s BK/Andy’s own fault if none of that’s true for being so secretive and angry. I mean a lot of the brands even old Stu who’s site is stuck in 97 has had pics in his shop and shown off his space. A lot of people are way more open about their process and how they work. Brian the bookmaker has videos of himself working. Thedi has tons of shots of his shop and workspace. Schott does. Shawn himself has takes sour his entire damn process here.

dannyk · Dec 9, 2020

And without going down this rabbit hole too far or bringing up sore subjects I’ll add it really is a shame because BK do make some wicked designs and almost everyone who’s owned one says they are great.

VolkswagenNerd · Dec 9, 2020

Carlos840 said:
Exactly my point.
For all we know BK could just be doing what @ton312 did but on a much larger scale and using brand exclusive hardwear and leather.
Someone orders, they make an order sheet similar to Tony's one but using their specific sizing and patterns, place an order in Pakistan, receive the jacket in Greece, pack it in a fancy box, send it to the client.

Or 5 Star just copied a label they happened to see on a BK jacket.

Both sound possible to me. I don't have any proof either way, i just thought the labels were a weird coincidence knowing the "BK are made in Pakistan" rumours.

They just copied the label. I saw this on a thread from 2009.

Carlos840 · Dec 9, 2020

VolkswagenNerd said:
They just copied the label. I saw this on a thread from 2009.

View attachment 288017

Well that somewhat clears it, thank you.

Marc mndt · Dec 9, 2020

Carlos840 said:
Why not? If people have to wait longer your product is more exclusive.
Look at GW!

Artificial scarcity

That's exactly what high end luxury brands like Hermès do with their Birkin bags.

I think it's actually a pretty good business model, produce at low-cost and sell as premium.

Look at ralph lauren with their RRL brandline.

This is a RRL cossack from their summer '20 collection. The build quality was mediocre but the leather and hardware were really crappy.

I haven't handled a 5* but judging from all of your photo's, I'd say this RRL was below 5* quality. They were produced in India, probably made a hundred of them which brings down production costs even more. Let's say these were $100 to produce. Ralph Lauren sold these for $2250.

Why wouldn't Bill Kelso do something similar? I'd say it's definitely plausible.

Bahabp100 · Dec 9, 2020

Marc mndt said:
Artificial scarcity That's exactly what high end luxury brands like Hermès do with their Birkin bags.

I think it's actually a pretty good business model, produce at low-cost and sell as premium.

Look at ralph lauren with their RRL brandline.
View attachment 288025 View attachment 288024 This is a RRL cossack from their summer '20 collection. The build quality was mediocre but the leather and hardware were really crappy.
View attachment 288028

I haven't handled a 5* but judging from all of your photo's, I'd say this RRL was below 5* quality. They were produced in India, probably made a hundred of them which brings down production costs even more. Let's say these were $100 to produce. Ralph Lauren sold these for $2250.

Why wouldn't Bill Kelso do something similar? I'd say it's definitely plausible.

Compared to 5* build and leather ?

warrior-poet · Dec 9, 2020

Marc mndt said:
It also depends on which screen you're looking at. I recently got an Iphone 12 which shows much warmer colors than my previous Iphone X which's screen is much more blue.

Digital monitors can be calibrated (and should be, if you're concerned about such things). But there are still a multitude of variables involved in photographing objects like this--what type of light source is used (and was it direct, indirect, diffused, or bounced using reflectors), the color and light-absorbing nature of the material and the surrounding background, the aperture setting and exposure, and on and on. Professional photographers sweat these details, but as ton312 demonstrated, lighting has a dramatic effect on color rendering. Then of course the final photo can be wildly manipulated (hello, Photoshop!). The only real way to know what you're getting is to request a sample swatch for approval. Measurements are a different kettle of fish. I can only say that the more photo details and measuring data you can provide, the better.

Superfluous · Dec 9, 2020

VolkswagenNerd said:
My jacket arrived late yesterday, it only took 4 days to make it from Pakistan to the West Coast of the USA. Crazy. I like the jacket in general, it's well constructed and the leather seems to be high quality. I expected the 1.4mm goatskin to be more substantial than it is, but I really don't know anything about goatskin weight vs thickness. The quilted lining is nice, I can tell the difference in warmth from a stock G1 I had previously. The lining is fused instead of stitched, we'll see how it holds up.

The measurements are for the most part the same as I ordered except the back length is a 1/2 inch shorter, and the wrist measurement is 1/4" to 1/2" larger. When I look at the back measurement photo Sean sent me I can see the measuring tape looks a bit slack, like they saw it was a bit off and moved the tape to make it look right. I understand how tolerances work, 1/4" is to be expected, but 1/2" or more and sending a photo that doesn't show reality doesn't seem right to me.

This is my first time doing made to measure, there are definitely some size tweaks I would make if I was doing this again. Tell me what you think of the fit. I snapped some selfies in the grocery store.

For some reason the gallery thinks my photos are rotated wrong. They look correct if you click the image name instead of opening the gallery.

I admittedly know about as much about G-1 specs as I know about iguana mating rituals. That said, the bottom knit appears rather large.

Berto · Dec 9, 2020

Marc mndt said:
Artificial scarcity That's exactly what high end luxury brands like Hermès do with their Birkin bags.

I think it's actually a pretty good business model, produce at low-cost and sell as premium.

Look at ralph lauren with their RRL brandline.
View attachment 288025 View attachment 288024 This is a RRL cossack from their summer '20 collection. The build quality was mediocre but the leather and hardware were really crappy.
View attachment 288028

I haven't handled a 5* but judging from all of your photo's, I'd say this RRL was below 5* quality. They were produced in India, probably made a hundred of them which brings down production costs even more. Let's say these were $100 to produce. Ralph Lauren sold these for $2250.

Why wouldn't Bill Kelso do something similar? I'd say it's definitely plausible.

At the end of the day it's about doing big money.

I have no doubt BK is doing big money producing in Pakistan. Very big money.

VolkswagenNerd · Dec 9, 2020

Superfluous said:
I admittedly know about as much about G-1 specs as I know about iguana mating rituals. That said, the bottom knit appears rather large.

It is, although it looks like some contracts of the earlier G1 models have tall waist knits. 4" vs the standard 3".

Seb Lucas · Dec 9, 2020

Berto said:
At the end of the day it's about doing big money.

I have no doubt BK is doing big money producing in Pakistan. Very big money.

This hasn't been established as a fact yet, so perhaps not.

My money is on Turkey, where many leather garments are made on to spec for 'manufacturers.'

Marc mndt · Dec 9, 2020

Seb Lucas said:
This hasn't been established as a fact yet, so perhaps not. My money is on Turkey, where many leather garments are made on to spec for 'manufacturers.'

I was checking the Bk website to find out what they say about their production facilities.

FAQ:

This is quite funny, to put this on your own website.

El Marro · Dec 9, 2020

you would have to be a first rate douchebag to write something like that about yourself. These guys make Stuart of LW look humble by comparison.

ton312 · Dec 10, 2020

It’s been awhile since we had a good old fashioned BK dust up. Have to say, I’m enjoying it.
I will say the BK jackets I’ve seen have all looked really well put together, so I suppose it’s certainly possible 5 Star is doing the work

Wait for it....

HoosierDaddy · Dec 10, 2020

Yeah, I too still think the waist knit looks very wide/long....and the leather bottom hem seems to start abnormally high above the waist.....

4e7e4d16-e693-4015-9b4b-ffea1b11fd9b-jpeg.287976

earl · Dec 10, 2020

Marc mndt said:
Artificial scarcity That's exactly what high end luxury brands like Hermès do with their Birkin bags.

I think it's actually a pretty good business model, produce at low-cost and sell as premium.

Look at ralph lauren with their RRL brandline.
View attachment 288025 View attachment 288024 This is a RRL cossack from their summer '20 collection. The build quality was mediocre but the leather and hardware were really crappy.
View attachment 288028

I haven't handled a 5* but judging from all of your photo's, I'd say this RRL was below 5* quality. They were produced in India, probably made a hundred of them which brings down production costs even more. Let's say these were $100 to produce. Ralph Lauren sold these for $2250.

Why wouldn't Bill Kelso do something similar? I'd say it's definitely plausible.

I've long watched the RRL thread at SF. Never owned any RRL. While I like many RRL designs, the discussions by owners on that thread suggests that many RRL pieces are substandard in terms of construction and/or quality of materials relative to price.

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