Spiking Up the Collar on an A-2 jacket

USAAFAcePilot · Dec 21, 2009

I've seen a couple of fellas do it "Thirty Seconds over Tokyo" (1944) and I've also come across this picture:

http://cache4.asset-cache.net/xc/77...4AD9FDB9CF193B13C65DA735B6EF3DD6C45A0835E65C9

of Harrison Ford wearing the collar spiked up.

How do I do this? Would it look good?

Fletch · Dec 21, 2009

Spiked up?

No one looks good in a spiked collar unless they are a dog.

3-rows-leather-spiked-dog-collar-best-spiked-collar_lrg.jpg

But if you want to wear it flipped up, popped, etc., hey, I say go for it. It was done right from the beginning.

Lieut. Charles Howard, CO 11th Bomb Sq., ca. 1932

cptjeff · Dec 21, 2009

Not unless you're actually doing it to keep the wind off your neck. Putting the collar up is a functional thing, and if you do it just for the look you will send off a message that you really don't want to send.

If it's actually related to the weather, go right ahead.

USAAFAcePilot · Dec 21, 2009

thanks guys
So I should only do it if I'm walking somewhere and it's either extremely windy, or cold, or both.

tonypaj · Dec 21, 2009

cptjeff said:
Not unless you're actually doing it to keep the wind off your neck. Putting the collar up is a functional thing, and if you do it just for the look you will send off a message that you really don't want to send.

If it's actually related to the weather, go right ahead.

What exactly is this message?

Chad · Dec 21, 2009

tonypaj said:
What exactly is this message?

The same message that's conveyed by wearing your Ray Ban Wayfarers when walking around at night or in a dimly lit room. "I'm just too cool. Do you know how cool I am? Too cool."

And rarely does it ever work. Unless you're John Bender.

Edit: along with people who wear wool coats in the middle of summer.

tonypaj · Dec 21, 2009

Chad said:
The same message that's conveyed by wearing your Ray Ban Wayfarers when walking around at night or in a dimly lit room. "I'm just too cool. Do you know how cool I am? Too cool."

And rarely does it ever work. Unless you're John Bender.

Edit: along with people who wear wool coats in the middle of summer.

Interesting. I could not care less how people wear their leather jackets, or if they wear shades at night, that's their business. And I wear mine the way I feel like, depending on the day.

Chad · Dec 21, 2009

tonypaj said:
Interesting. I could not care less how people wear their leather jackets, or if they wear shades at night, that's their business. And I wear mine the way I feel like, depending on the day.

Everyone makes judgments. It's human nature. Letting them bother you is another thing entirely, but you can't deny that we all judge based on appearances. Anything else is either hypocrisy or a blatant lie.

Dudleydoright · Dec 21, 2009

Having a collar up never bothered James Dean or Brando or a thousand and one other people.

I don't think a collar up of itself says anything. You might also argue that people who have everything just so are a little too retentive of the bottom regions and take more time over their appearance than the one they accuse of being contrived. Let's not go there.

This is a website for people who like to be a bit contrived over their appearance and if that includes a collar up, then so what ?

We should all try to be a little more tolerant of other people. Who cares anyways ?

Dave

tonypaj · Dec 21, 2009

Chad said:
Everyone makes judgments. It's human nature. Letting them bother you is another thing entirely, but you can't deny that we all judge based on appearances. Anything else is either hypocrisy or a blatant lie.

In that case I am either a hypocrite or lying. How people wear their clothes is their business, as far as I am concerned.

In my working life I have come across Nobel price winners wearing shorts in the middle of winter, refugees wearing nothing as they had nothing to wear, billionaires wearing the finest tailor made stuff, and a lot in between. None of that changed the fact that interesting people were interesting, once you got talking to them.

We're all human, yes, but that also means that we have an option of changing the way we approach situations and the way we think. Besides, all judgement would be purely situational, what you may think in your part of the US differs most definitely from what people think in my part of France. Thus I try not to generalize or judge, I leave that to others.

Chad · Dec 21, 2009

tonypaj said:
In that case I am either a hypocrite or lying. How people wear their clothes is their business, as far as I am concerned.

In my working life I have come across Nobel price winners wearing shorts in the middle of winter, refugees wearing nothing as they had nothing to wear, billionaires wearing the finest tailor made stuff, and a lot in between. None of that changed the fact that interesting people were interesting, once you got talking to them.

We're all human, yes, but that also means that we have an option of changing the way we approach situations and the way we think. Besides, all judgement would be purely situational, what you may think in your part of the US differs most definitely from what people think in my part of France. Thus I try not to generalize or judge, I leave that to others.

You may try, but to say that you do not, never have, nor ever will is just a complete error. It's human nature, and anything else is an aberration.

I would be twice as leery of those who do not judge others. It's freakish and inhuman.

Edit: but, I digress. This is just a tangent that is polluting the thread.

tonypaj · Dec 21, 2009

Chad said:
You may try, but to say that you do not, never have, nor ever will is just a complete error. It's human nature, and anything else is an aberration.

I would be twice as leery of those who do not judge others. It's freakish and inhuman.

Edit: but, I digress. This is just a tangent that is polluting the thread.

You are labeling people freakish, inhuman, lying hypocrite aberrations. All because someone may not care if a guy wears his leather jacket collar turned up or not. A bit over the top, don't you think...

I agree, a pointless tangent, I will never agree with you or your strawman arguments. I hope that the OP does exactly what he wants to and wears the jacket exactly the way it feels right to him.

Creeping Past · Dec 21, 2009

USAAFAcePilot said:
I've seen a couple of fellas do it "Thirty Seconds over Tokyo" (1944) and I've also come across this picture:

http://cache4.asset-cache.net/xc/77...4AD9FDB9CF193B13C65DA735B6EF3DD6C45A0835E65C9

of Harrison Ford wearing the collar spiked up.

How do I do this? Would it look good?

I can't quite see how Ford's done it. The collar seems to be pulled up a bit at the rear. I think the look you're going for is the careless look. So probably best not to try to hard to get it right...

Don't mind the begrudgers, as the Irish saying (almost) goes.

Dixon Cannon · Dec 21, 2009

When I wear my authentic reproduction of my A-2, should I keep the zipper 2/3 of the way down or just 1/2 the way down. I don't want to look like I'm an extra in Spielberg's '1941', I'd rather look like a co-star in Leacock's 'The War Lover'. What do you suggest! Please help soon it's getting cold in Phoenix! :eusa_doh:

Come on, will ya!!.... When I put on my hat or my coat, I put it on any which way I want to and wear it with confidence - cocked right, left or back, collar up, down, zipped or unzipped.... it doesn't matter! Nobody else cares either! Anybody that's making a judgement on my attitude or attire is spending too much time looking at me to begin with!

Hey Gents, we're all adults aren't we - just put on your gear and get out the door - leave your insecurities on the doorstep! This is not brain surgery!!

-dixon 'confident' cannon

Lone_Ranger · Dec 21, 2009

Let's put it this way.

The original A-2 does not have "side entry hand warmer pockets," because the jacket was military issue. It was not keeping with proper "military bearing," to have your hands in your pockets. However, in the field, the standards relax a bit. You can get away with stuff you wouldn't do in garrison.

A military pilot, would be able to get away with the flipped up collar, while flying. At the local pub, he would be told to put the collar down, by the first person he came across that outranked him, or by any zealous MP.

So, my answer to the OP's question is, it depends (on where you are, at the time).

Dixon's answer, is probably the best advise, so far.

Dixon Cannon said:
Hey Gents, we're all adults aren't we - just put on your gear and get out the door - leave your insecurities on the doorstep! This is not brain surgery!!

-dixon 'confident' cannon

rgraham · Dec 21, 2009

I wore my A-2 the other day to take the dog for a walk. Part way through, a cold wind started to blow. I just had a haircut, so my neck was more sensitive than usual to the nip. And yes, I turned the collar up, and it did the trick. However, I did notice how it kept rubbing the back of my head.

Do you ever notice in some photos from the past, when the pilot does have his collar turned up, it's kind of in a way seen in the photo above, and those below. Kind of a wave effect where the collar gets flipped up half way down the collar. I've always wondered why they did this, and I think I found out why the other day. It keeps the collar from rubbing up against the neck.

"Skeet" McD · Dec 21, 2009

rgraham said:
I wore my A-2 the other day to take the dog for a walk. Part way through, a cold wind started to blow. I just had a haircut, so my neck was more sensitive than usual to the nip. And yes, I turned the collar up, and it did the trick. However, I did notice how it kept rubbing the back of my head.

Do you ever notice in some photos from the past, when the pilot does have his collar turned up, it's kind of in a way seen in the photo above, and those below. Kind of a wave effect where the collar gets flipped up half way down the collar. I've always wondered why they did this, and I think I found out why the other day. It keeps the collar from rubbing up against the neck.

This is a GREAT observation...and I expect you are absolutely right...at least part of the time! Fashion---and the clannish, tribal culture of the military sprouts fashion as much as any other group in society--doesn't have to be logical or practical...but I think you're on to something!

"Skeet"

Dudleydoright · Dec 21, 2009

I can see that flyers who wore Mae Wests would have the collar up to stop the hard rubber fabric chafing their necks. Practical, eh ?

As to judging people visually and without regard to knowing them and context ...... ? Predjudices like that lead to Fascism, racism and a whole lot of other -isms ! Live and let live people !

I tend to find the most predjudiced people are normally the ones who have travelled and read the least and it's just low esteem and a lack of confidence that makes them so fixed in their opinions. Doesn't always work like that but as a general rule-of-thumb it works for me.

As to Paj, I know the guy as in face to face and he is the least judgemental person I've met. Well travelled, well read and very modest. A top bloke. He is not a liar.

Dave

Fletch · Dec 21, 2009

Dudleydoright said:
I can see that flyers who wore Mae Wests would have the collar up to stop the hard rubber fabric chafing their necks. Practical, eh ?

Of course a leather collar can chafe necks too - thus silk scarves, or the fur collar retrofit authorized in the CBI.

As to judging people visually and without regard to knowing them and context ...... ? Predjudices like that lead to Fascism, racism and a whole lot of other -isms ! Live and let live people !

I tend to find the most predjudiced people are normally the ones who have travelled and read the least and it's just low esteem and a lack of confidence that makes them so fixed in their opinions. Doesn't always work like that but as a general rule-of-thumb it works for me.

It troubles me that my countrymen - and I, too, sometimes! - tend to draw hard lines on the "meanings" of clothing and style more often than Loungers across the pond.

Call it frankness and being direct - it is - but it also comes from a heritage of judging people on their style choices. In our culture, they stand in for a lot of things we don't like to critique openly.

Treetopflyer · Dec 21, 2009

The guy in back

The guy in the back row of the second picture seems to be looking at the guy in front of him and thinking “that guys collar is all sorts of messed up”. My opinion is that it’s your jacket; you own it and you should be able to wear it any way you see fit. If you are current military, that is a different story. Believe it or not we still wear our leather jackets in the cockpit, after all it’s an issued piece of flight gear. If you wore it outside of the cockpit with the collar “popped” your fellow aviators would give you so much grief.

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