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Am I the crazy one? customer service experience with Wested

Metatron

One Too Many
Messages
1,535
Location
United Kingdom
How a simple size query resulted in me being told to get lost.

Actual conversation with Wested. For context, the standard Skyfall jacket has a generic size chart, S, M, L, while the custom allows you to choose chest size, but has no size chart for specific chest size sizing. Note how my questions are repeatedly ignored and answered with generic replies.

Actually I was aware FiveStar makes higher quality jackets, but wanted to support a local business. This is how I am greeted by a local business... shame. Anyway, maybe this will provide you with some entertainment:


Me: if ordering a custom skyfall jacket do you recommend a size 40 or a 42 for someone who has a size 41 chest?
Wested: Hi best to read our how to measure yourself guide as that will answer all your questions.
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Me: I read it but I would like your opinion

Wested: There is a size chart on the standard jacket but you said custom made
As stated in the guide we never advise to go down
Look at the pit to pit as explained in the guide and that will tell
You how much room there is in the jackets

Me: I am unclear as to what the pit to pit of this particular jacket is-as the standard version is sized S(38-40) and M(42): that is two szes. but custom you can choose 38, 40, 42. That is three different sizes. So I have to assume the measurements are a bit different

Wested: We don’t make a 41 so you either go 40” or 42”

Me: That's why I am here asking you for advice

Wested: I thought you wanted a custom made jacket

Me: I did

Wested: Then you just add your chest size
There is no chart for a custom made jacket as you are going to choose your size and lengths
I have no idea without measuring you which I can’t do that’s why we say never go down

Me: I am a size 41, I know how to measure myself
so you are saying go for a 42?

Wested: And we don’t make a 41”
So you need to choose

Me: OK so if I understand you correctly a 42 would be a better choice?

Wested: We can not tell you what size to buy. All this info is in the measuring guide and the faqs

Me: It doesn't say anywhere on the website what the pit to pit measurement of a size 40 and 42 skyfall is. that's why I am contacting you asking for advice...

Wested: Look in faqs it tells you exactly what pit 2 pit is and it’s the same on any jacket from any supplier
It’s quiet easy double the pit to pit remove your chest size and that will tell you how much room there is in the jacket for you to move and breath.

Me: I understand this very well
but there are no measurements for a size 40 or 42 skyfall jacket.
Only a standard S(38-40) and M(42). i Have to assume a custom '40' is not the same as a standard 'S(38-40)'

Wested: A 40” chest is a 40” chest

Me: But a size 40 jacket varies from design to design.
that is why you have different size charts for different jackets.

Wested: But the chest is the chest that never changes only the pit to pit will change

Me: I don't know what the pit to pit of a size 40 and a size 42 skyfall is, that is why we are having this conversation
maybe if you could provide those, I can make an informed desicion.

Wested: Look on the size chart for the standard pit to pit is on there

Me:Ok. Looking at it right now. it says S(38-40) 22 inches pit to pit.
what happens if I order a 40 custom. will it have this measurement?
Wested: I would probably order it from another supplier who can explain how to measure the pit to pit.
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Madness. Utter madness. 'The pit to pit is the same for every manufacturer' I mean, what a line! Who is this guy they have replying to emails anyway? Please don't tell me it is the owner.
 
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Blackadder

My Mail is Forwarded Here
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China
Weird that a seller would refuse to give a simple word of advice. Even though I think I understand what he is saying and I think the site did provide the answer but him giving you the run around in stead of his simple honest opinion is so bizarre.
 

Metatron

One Too Many
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1,535
Location
United Kingdom
Actually I read that guide, but it says 'refer to the size chart of the jacket you are interested in' the size chart for that jacket features basic S, M, L sizing, for example S(38-40). But if you order custom, you can order either 38 or 40. That is what I was trying, and failing to find out.
 

Blackadder

My Mail is Forwarded Here
Messages
3,255
Location
China
Actually I read that guide, but it says 'refer to the size chart of the jacket you are interested in' the size chart for that jacket features basic S, M, L sizing, for example S(38-40). But if you order custom, you can order either 38 or 40. That is what I was trying, and failing to find out.
My understanding is the small is actually a size 40. The pit-to-pit figures in the size chart pretty much confirms that it is a 40 (4 inch leeway in every size). Besides, it is common for casual jacket to be featured in S/M/L etc in which case small is usually 36-38 while in fact it is a 38 because it has to fit a 38 person. So in Wested's case the Skyfall small is actually a 40.
In any case, your size is 40-42 so the measurement of a custom size 38 is besides the point. They do have the measurement of size 40 (small) and 42 (medium).
Nevertheless, as said before, I have never seen actual maker refusing to give advice. If it was an online dealer say a department store then I may understand because the CS would likely not be familiar with every single product therefore cannot give honest advice. At the very least, their advice may confirm what the customer understand from their size chart etc.
 

Metatron

One Too Many
Messages
1,535
Location
United Kingdom
Interestingly the size chart has been changed on the website since our conversation, so S is a 40. It used to be 38-40.
My understanding is the small is actually a size 40. The pit-to-pit figures in the size chart pretty much confirms that it is a 40 (4 inch leeway in every size). Besides, it is common for casual jacket to be featured in S/M/L etc in which case small is usually 36-38 while in fact it is a 38 because it has to fit a 38 person. So in Wested's case the Skyfall small is actually a 40.
In any case, your size is 40-42 so the measurement of a custom size 38 is besides the point. They do have the measurement of size 40 (small) and 42 (medium).
Nevertheless, as said before, I have never seen actual maker refusing to give advice. If it was an online dealer say a department store then I may understand because the CS would likely not be familiar with every single product therefore cannot give honest advice. At the very least, their advice may confirm what the customer understand from their size chart etc.
 

Blackadder

My Mail is Forwarded Here
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3,255
Location
China
Interestingly the size chart has been changed on the website since our conversation, so S is a 40. It used to be 38-40.
I guess you made them aware how confusing it can be to others.
Some military outerwear like A-2 deck jackets comes in 34-36, 38-40 etc. The 38-40 must certainly fit a size 40 which must mean it is a size 40 and not actually 38.
It is still weird for them not to give a straight answer. As I said, their size chart shows a 4 inch leeway for every size, the small has a pit-to-pit of 44, the medium has a pit-to-pit of 46. So they could have easily answered your question, that a size 40 would have a 44 ptp while a size 42 has a ptp of 46.
 
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TREEMAN

Call Me a Cab
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2,021
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USA
Weird that a seller would refuse to give a simple word of advice. Even though I think I understand what he is saying and I think the site did provide the answer but him giving you the run around in stead of his simple honest opinion is so bizarre.
What is he saying and what was the answer the site provided ?
 

Metatron

One Too Many
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United Kingdom
He was saying that my answers all all addressed in the FAQ section-but the issue was that I wasn't clear if the S(38-40) in the standard jacket size chart was equivalent to the size 40 in the custom jacket. 'S' covers two chest sizes while for the custom you can select a specific chest size, so I wanted this clarified. This question was repeatedly ignored or not understood. After I was told to get lost, the size chart was changed so that S=size 40.
 

Blackadder

My Mail is Forwarded Here
Messages
3,255
Location
China
What is he saying and what was the answer the site provided ?
He referred Metatron to the size chart and FAQ of the site.
1) Size chart provided the PTP measurement of stock jacket which shows the Skyfall having a 4 inch leeway on each size, size small (38-40) has 44 PTP, size medium (42) has a PTP of 46 and so on. Base on that, one can deduce that the small even though stated as 38-40 is more like size 40 which makes sense.

FAQ provided sizing advice based on tolerance
"If you are ordering a standard jacket then take a look at the measurement chart attached to that style and look at the difference between the chest and pit to pit .

For example

Style A 38 chest, pit to pit 22 (doubled 44)

Tolerance of jacket is 6 inches so a 39 chest would still have a 5-inch tolerance. So, we would recommend you make sure this is enough room for you and then make your dessision from there.

Style B chest 38, pit to pit 21 (doubled 42)

Tolerance would be 4 inches but for a 39 chest only 3-inch tolerance. So we would recommend that would be too small so order a 40"

2) FAQ says Options for custom orders are as follows
"Sleeve length
Back length
Hardware options
Skin choice
Lining choice
Any additional requirements would be classed as bespoke."
i.e. altering PTP is not an option, so PTP would be the same as stock jacket but one may go bespoke. A custom size 42 would have the same PTP as a stock medium 42. That is how I read it.

A stock small which is 38-40 has 44 PTP and that would give Metatron only 3 inch tolerance, they would recommend sizing up to medium size 42 which has a 46 PTP.

As said, it is truly bizarre because why didn't they just give Metatron the PTP is the same because they won't alter it on custom jacket or just tell him to go for a Medium 42.
 
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Metatron

One Too Many
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United Kingdom
Why didn't he give me a straight answer? The way I see it is It's passive aggressive power play 'I am going to constantly refer the customer to the FAQ to make him feel stupid rather than answering a simple question' but weirdly he also kept insinuating I did not understand what pit to pit means-which shows that in his arrogance he didn't bother to properly read my messages.

You're probably right, Ton. While I was aware of Wested's limitations I was looking forward to getting a bargain while also supporting a local business-but not after this.

My next choices were Five Star or Simmons Bilt. I had considered SCHOTT but I am going to be absolutely slaughtered by the shipping and customs fees.
 

zebedee

One Too Many
Messages
1,585
Location
Shanghai
Why didn't he give me a straight answer? The way I see it is It's passive aggressive power play 'I am going to constantly refer the customer to the FAQ to make him feel stupid rather than answering a simple question' but weirdly he also kept insinuating I did not understand what pit to pit means-which shows that in his arrogance he didn't bother to properly read my messages.

You're probably right, Ton. While I was aware of Wested's limitations I was looking forward to getting a bargain while also supporting a local business-but not after this.

My next choices were Five Star or Simmons Bilt. I had considered SCHOTT but I am going to be absolutely slaughtered by the shipping and customs fees.
Simmons Bilt - whatever their sins and the long shadows they might cast - will do you an excellent custom jacket. It'll set you back about 900 quid, though.
 
Messages
15,120
Why didn't he give me a straight answer? The way I see it is It's passive aggressive power play 'I am going to constantly refer the customer to the FAQ to make him feel stupid rather than answering a simple question' but weirdly he also kept insinuating I did not understand what pit to pit means-which shows that in his arrogance he didn't bother to properly read my messages.

Yeah, that's exactly the thing I do not understand in the entire exchange; Why couldn't they have just given you the exact set of measurements they work with for the sizes you wanted to know about?

I had the exact same experience with Lost Worlds a year ago & also couldn't get a straight answer on the same dilemma I had. Verbal Olympics the owner was performing not to provide a direct answer was not unlike your conversation with Wested, though other people had better luck so it could have been the language barrier in my case. . .
 
Messages
14,421
Location
Chicago
Yeah, that's exactly the thing I do not understand in the entire exchange; Why couldn't they have just given you the exact set of measurements they work with for the sizes you wanted to know about?

I had the exact same experience with Lost Worlds a year ago & also couldn't get a straight answer on the same dilemma I had. Verbal Olympics the owner was performing not to provide a direct answer was not unlike your conversation with Wested, though other people had better luck so it could have been the language barrier in my case. . .
Stu only provides measurements when listing jackets on eBay under the “grapemoby” moniker. So no language barrier at all and of course your English is perfectly perfect.
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