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Inspiration for my bespoke leather jacket

Jin431

Call Me a Cab
Messages
2,918
Location
Bay Area CA
Hi everybody,
first of all, thank you all for your replies, every one of them is really helpful to me.
You indicated me some points:
- it seems I don't know what I want: you are absolutely right! :) But I think that also with your help I will understand where to go
- types of leather used: I initially thought that "horsehide leather is the top choice, so I want it". Now I realize that I have to understand IF I like it, or not. The fact that "fashion brands" use supple lambskin worries me, because (maybe for you it's obvious) my thought that "horsehide is the top leather in the world" maybe was a bit stupid... I mean, it all depends on taste, and I actually haven't touched or seen that leather yet. I think that I must look and touch a horsehide and a lambskin jacket before spend a lot of money.
- these days I bought 7-8 leather jackets from a famous (in Italy at least) online shop, Yoox; I wanted to try pretty everything available in my size XS; I needed to touch by person something to understand something more of what I like. First ad all I noticed that none of them is ok for me.
I want to highlight and discuss with you about two of them:
The first one actually is pretty well with size and fit (maybe the best), this one:
https://www.yoox.com/it/41993910FU/item#sts=orders&cod10=41993910FU&sizeId=1&sizeName=44
From the description, it is made of calf leather. I don't know the thickness (how can I measure it here at home?), but my first impression is that it is heavy and rigid. I'm not sure I like these characteristics. Maybe it is the limit for me (I don't want something more rigid, or heavier).
The second one is this (very cheap I know):
https://www.yoox.com/it/16014822WM/item#sts=orders&cod10=16014822WM&sizeId=&sizeName=
The description says that it is made by lambskin. Actually it is very soft. I don't like the style: the collar is ugly, the jacket is...characterless, but maybe, this the type of leather I'm looking for. At least for softness and suppleness. For you it could be a little boring, it surely has "less character", but if I find something better in fit, maybe MTM, with a better style, but with a leather with these characteristics, I think it could be my first choice.
I attach 3 photos of them.

The first one, in size XS, weigh 1.4 kg -> 31 lb. It's a lot! Horsehide leather would be pretty the same? Better of worse? Even more rigid?

Lamb skin is very soft but that's what the general public would wear with your fashion/mall jackets, I'm not saying it's not good but it's not very good either.

Shinki is very good, it's up there with the best leather you can buy for leather goods and garments. The horse hide that Greg uses is stiff but not that heavy for some. You might feel weird wearing a horse hide jacket at first but it's not that bad. Although its stiff for some people, others who have handled/breaked in a heavier/stiffer hide will find the jacket midweight.

I think the padded jacket is something Greg is not familiar with since Aero does not have a jacket with that design element. The jacket with the collar is something he will be able to do for your and he will do so handsomely.
 

Marc mndt

I'll Lock Up
Messages
4,723
Hi everybody,
first of all, thank you all for your replies, every one of them is really helpful to me.
You indicated me some points:
- it seems I don't know what I want: you are absolutely right! :) But I think that also with your help I will understand where to go
- types of leather used: I initially thought that "horsehide leather is the top choice, so I want it". Now I realize that I have to understand IF I like it, or not. The fact that "fashion brands" use supple lambskin worries me, because (maybe for you it's obvious) my thought that "horsehide is the top leather in the world" maybe was a bit stupid... I mean, it all depends on taste, and I actually haven't touched or seen that leather yet. I think that I must look and touch a horsehide and a lambskin jacket before spend a lot of money.
- these days I bought 7-8 leather jackets from a famous (in Italy at least) online shop, Yoox; I wanted to try pretty everything available in my size XS; I needed to touch by person something to understand something more of what I like. First ad all I noticed that none of them is ok for me.
I want to highlight and discuss with you about two of them:
The first one actually is pretty well with size and fit (maybe the best), this one:
https://www.yoox.com/it/41993910FU/item#sts=orders&cod10=41993910FU&sizeId=1&sizeName=44
From the description, it is made of calf leather. I don't know the thickness (how can I measure it here at home?), but my first impression is that it is heavy and rigid. I'm not sure I like these characteristics. Maybe it is the limit for me (I don't want something more rigid, or heavier).
The second one is this (very cheap I know):
https://www.yoox.com/it/16014822WM/item#sts=orders&cod10=16014822WM&sizeId=&sizeName=
The description says that it is made by lambskin. Actually it is very soft. I don't like the style: the collar is ugly, the jacket is...characterless, but maybe, this the type of leather I'm looking for. At least for softness and suppleness. For you it could be a little boring, it surely has "less character", but if I find something better in fit, maybe MTM, with a better style, but with a leather with these characteristics, I think it could be my first choice.
I attach 3 photos of them.

The first one, in size XS, weigh 1.4 kg -> 31 lb. It's a lot! Horsehide leather would be pretty the same? Better of worse? Even more rigid?
A lot of these yoox jacket's look like copies of well known motorcycle jacket designs. The first one ( with quilted / padded shoulders and elbows) looks a lot like a Lewis Leathers. I'm not sure Greg is willing to do something like that because it might be too far apart from his current design line-up.

I just bought a vintage Lewis leathers which is too small for me. It's probably a small or extra small. I already offered it to a fellow TFL member who might be interested if the sizing is right for him. If not, maybe this Lewis Leathers would be interesting for you? Not sure whether you're into vintage jackets. This one looks to be in mint condition.

E935E573-3044-44D9-B191-074E5BFDCCCC.jpeg




Edit: they also sell a copy of this particular model, the phantom, on yoox :)

https://www.yoox.com/it/16015710CN/item#dept=men&sts=sr_men80&cod10=16015710CN&sizeId=&sizeName=

7CD9433E-BC9F-47B1-8360-A2835CA98932.jpeg
 
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giasty

New in Town
Messages
13
... However with thick leather cow horse etc, you will feel initial stiffness, just like heavy jeans, but it also give the jacket more shape or able to maintain its own shape better for a very long time, if you like the silhouette of certain jacket then if you have it in stiff heavy hide its initial shape is going to last, while if you have it in lamb, or anything that is soft, flexible, stretchy, it will be copying your body after a month or two or the first time you get in the rain wearing it, will look like a little bit shinier hoodie, will look effortless very fast, you can roll the sleeve and thing, depending what you like.


Lamb skin is very soft but that's what the general public would wear with your fashion/mall jackets, I'm not saying it's not good but it's not very good either....

I think that now my problem is exactly to understand if FOR ME horsehide is too stiff and/or too heavy :-(
Maybe I'm in the group of what "general public would wear".

Or better: maybe I can like a stiff jacket if it is something like this, in burgundy: https://www.archibaldlondon.com/be/...ualjackets-size=xs&color=horween-cxl-number-8
It seemes a jacket I would use as elegant, and stiffness could be a plus. But not in a everyday black jacket...

Now that I touch a calf leather jacket, it doesn't seem what I had in my mind.
Is impossible to make a comparison between calf and horse leather? I'm aware that I didn't write to you the thickness of the leather used in the jacket I have in my hands, I'm not sure how to measure it... For sure I don't like the weight of 31 lb.

I can imagine that the pair calf vs horse is more similar respect to a situation calf vs lamb?

A lot of these yoox jacket's look like copies of well known motorcycle jacket designs. The first one ( with quilted / padded shoulders and elbows) looks a lot like a Lewis Leathers. I'm not sure Greg is willing to do something like that because it might be too far apart from his current design line-up.

I just bought a vintage Lewis leathers which is too small for me. It's probably a small or extra small. I already offered it to a fellow TFL member who might be interested if the sizing is right for him. If not, maybe this Lewis Leathers would be interesting for you? Not sure whether you're into vintage jackets. This one looks to be in mint condition.
Hi Marc, thank you for the proposal, I didn't wrote well, but I actually don't like this type of jackets, as much as I don't like the type of jacket I showed in the previous post. Actually I liked the size (it was almost the only one nearly ok for me), but I don't like motorcycle's details... I actually made that order at Yoox only to "try something". It can sounds a little weird but, here in my region in Italy we are in a semi lock-down, clothing shops are closed and I needed to have something in my hands, only from photos it's difficult to understand what I like.
(I like so much your HD lightweight jacket for example!!!!) Or I start to understand that... I like lambskin "fashion" jacket :-O
 

Marc mndt

I'll Lock Up
Messages
4,723
I think that now my problem is exactly to understand if FOR ME horsehide is too stiff and/or too heavy :-(
Maybe I'm in the group of what "general public would wear".

I wouldn't be too worried. FL's pigment dyed shinki hh is supple and relatively lightweight.
 

giasty

New in Town
Messages
13
Hi everybody, in the last days I continued my searches/readings and now I'm quite convinced that what I really want is a "fashion" lambskin jacket.

It's years I've been trying to buy a leather jacket... I'm so tired of the difficulty to find something with my size, so that now I would also accept the price of a Celine/Saint Laurent piece. I bought online and received yesterday a Celine jacket, size 44 (XS), but it is still a bit big and I will need to ask for refund. Now I will also try something from Saint Laurent, maybe trying to ask for a XXS size if they do it (it doesn't exist on website, but I will try calling them).

My question for you is: if I will not be satisfied with size, where should I go to have my leather jacket? Is there somebody who can make it on my measures, lambskin, with a fashion style (maybe copying a model I can indicate of the previous labels?). I'm not sure I can ask Greg to do such a work, if you a name to suggest it would be very appreciate...
 

MrProper

Call Me a Cab
Messages
2,403
Location
Europe
Hi everybody, in the last days I continued my searches/readings and now I'm quite convinced that what I really want is a "fashion" lambskin jacket.

It's years I've been trying to buy a leather jacket... I'm so tired of the difficulty to find something with my size, so that now I would also accept the price of a Celine/Saint Laurent piece. I bought online and received yesterday a Celine jacket, size 44 (XS), but it is still a bit big and I will need to ask for refund. Now I will also try something from Saint Laurent, maybe trying to ask for a XXS size if they do it (it doesn't exist on website, but I will try calling them).

My question for you is: if I will not be satisfied with size, where should I go to have my leather jacket? Is there somebody who can make it on my measures, lambskin, with a fashion style (maybe copying a model I can indicate of the previous labels?). I'm not sure I can ask Greg to do such a work, if you a name to suggest it would be very appreciate...

Shawn, Fivestarleather.
He can make whatever you want for you. However, you have to be extremely precise with the requirements.
 

oskar

One of the Regulars
Messages
154
I know your feeling. There are just way too many options. The more options there are the more you think / worry about it.

Do the following and you will be happy:

1. Go with field leathers

2. If you are skinny/muscular go with the Route 66 with normal pockets (straight)

3. If you are a big guy pick the Idaho model the way it is.

4. You want an all black jacket or patina? Pick the pigment for patina. The full aniline for all black.


5. Close you internet browser and wait. You will be happy. Promised

6. I am serious. Close it. Stop worring about it.

You will get a leather jacket that will never go out of style. Will fit you very well and is made out of the best materials. What else are you asking for?

If you want a 1 piece collection a black cafe racer (route 66) or half belt ( the idaho) is the perfect way to go.

If you want to build a huge collection a black cafe racer or half belt is the perfect starting point.
 
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giasty

New in Town
Messages
13
Hi oskar, thank you very much for your post.

Actually in these last days I understood that what I want now is a lambskin jacket, very light and soft. I tried some jackets bought online and, when I tried a calf leather, I found it too heavy, too rigid, far from what I look for.
I tried also a Celine jacket and it was a bit too large for me even in the smallest size, 44 (XS). But, apart from this, everything was as I want (except price which is of course...crazy).

I would love to have a made-to-measure jacket from Greg because I'm sure that it would be my best option to have something fitting very good on me. But I don't think he would agree to to lambskin for me, and maybe it's not wise asking him to do a work which is "out of his regular work".

Maybe I'm able to find this one in size 42 (XXS), it will cost a fortune, but I think it could be a piece I can love
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/6f/6d/d46f6d0da3107d84971e6e10a18f5e5c.jpg

Otherwise I think to ask Shawn (Fivestarleather) a quote for reproducing one of those fashion models (actually I have no idea of how much he could ask, and I know that fit could be worse than Greg's one, but...)
 

MrProper

Call Me a Cab
Messages
2,403
Location
Europe
Maybe I'm able to find this one in size 42 (XXS), it will cost a fortune, but I think it could be a piece I can love
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/6f/6d/d46f6d0da3107d84971e6e10a18f5e5c.jpg
it's similar to mine (of course a completely different segment (YSL vs. 5* lol))
mine is made of goatskin and is absolutely comfortable to wear.
what I can well imagine for you is deerskin from 5 *. Thin, light, super soft. Deerskin jackets have cost $ 350 including shipping and made2measure so far.
I have a "capeskin" vest, which is actually lambskin and I don't like it that much.

CA74D4F6-A340-43D7-A63E-09C26F7D0878.jpeg
 

Jasonindenver

Familiar Face
Messages
72
Location
Denver
I would NOT spend big money on a designer lambskin jacket. When lambskin wears, it looks shabby IMHO. At least those jackets I have had.

I do agree that you would be better served buying a "fashion" jacket for your first leather jacket. This will help you decide what you do and do not want in a future custom jacket.

I have lightweight horsehide jacket in Aero's vicenza horsehide that is half of the weight of a Schott cowhide jacket. Now I really do not like wearing the cowhide.
 

oskar

One of the Regulars
Messages
154
Hey Giasty,

I think you are making a mistake. The shinki horsehide is one of the most valued hides in this community and there is a reason for it.

You can not just try a random cow hide jacket and say that a mid wheight premium horsehide is not for you. Shinki is super soft after some wear.

Please, ask a quality maker for some leather samples and hold it next to a fashion jacket. Then ask some friends what they prefer. Its like day and night.

All the members here tested fashion jackets and premium jackets. All of them are telling you to get the premium jacket. From time to time I go to the mall to try on fashion jackets and I am surpriesed how people can wear these (Sorry for beeing a little snoobish here).

I am only so persistent beacause I dont want you to make a costly mistake.
 
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Jin431

Call Me a Cab
Messages
2,918
Location
Bay Area CA
agreed that the 5* deerskin is super light to wear, wears like a denim jacket to me

FullSizeRender.jpg


Another option you can do if you still want Greg to make you a made to order jacket with shinki horsehide is for him to have the leather thinned
 

giasty

New in Town
Messages
13
Thanks everybody for your answers!!!!!

it's similar to mine (of course a completely different segment (YSL vs. 5* lol))
mine is made of goatskin and is absolutely comfortable to wear.
what I can well imagine for you is deerskin from 5 *. Thin, light, super soft.
....
I can try... The price is acceptable... The photo you posted is a jacket made of deerskin? It seems very good!


I would NOT spend big money on a designer lambskin jacket. When lambskin wears, it looks shabby IMHO. At least those jackets I have had.

I do agree that you would be better served buying a "fashion" jacket for your first leather jacket. This will help you decide what you do and do not want in a future custom jacket.

I have lightweight horsehide jacket in Aero's vicenza horsehide that is half of the weight of a Schott cowhide jacket. Now I really do not like wearing the cowhide.

I'm happy I'm not the only one who don't like to wear heavy jackets :-D

Hey Giasty,
...
You can not just try a random cow hide jacket and say that a mid wheight premium horsehide is not for you. Shinki is super soft after some wear.
...
I am only so persistent beacause I dont want you to make a costly mistake.
Actually you are non persistent at all, you are very kind :)
One of the problems I have is to understand how horsehide is, respect to a random jacket (calf leather) I tried. You are absolutely right.
My question (also) for you is: do you know if there is a product I can buy online, maybe with the possibility of refund, in order to try a premium horsehide jacket (I'm from Italy, if the product is sold here in Europe I think it would be easier)? I'm not sure I can understand well with a leather sample, but I can buy a jacket, try and touch it, and ask for refund if I don't like it (and meanwhile I can touch by hands a finished product in that leather and understand how it is different from the calf leather I tried)!

agreed that the 5* deerskin is super light to wear, wears like a denim jacket to me

Another option you can do if you still want Greg to make you a made to order jacket with shinki horsehide is for him to have the leather thinned
It seems Deerskin is something I need to evaluate!!!! And price in ok also for a "test". I will try! Your is very beautiful.
Thinned leather is a processing techniques? Greg can do it? It means that final leather could be, for example, not 1.1-1.3mm but less? Will it be softer and lighter?
 

oskar

One of the Regulars
Messages
154
You can ask jacket makers to send you a leather sample. It is a 5cm x 5cm piece of leather. It is usually free and you can get a feel for it.
 
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Jin431

Call Me a Cab
Messages
2,918
Location
Bay Area CA
Thanks everybody for your answers!!!!!

It seems Deerskin is something I need to evaluate!!!! And price in ok also for a "test". I will try! Your is very beautiful.
Thinned leather is a processing techniques? Greg can do it? It means that final leather could be, for example, not 1.1-1.3mm but less? Will it be softer and lighter?

Deerskin is really easy to wear, the 5* version is (milled probably pressed) lightweight it is not the best but it would be close to what I would consider a fashion jacket leather but even the heavier deerskin is very drapery and easy to wear.

Yes, Greg can send the hides to be skived (basically thinning the leather so it's not so thick) to that extent or to what is still appropriate for jacket making so as not to weaken the leather too much. It will be lighter for sure but I believe it will still be stiff at first but it will be more pliable and easier to wear compared to the regular thickness of the 1.3mm leather
 

ericsanpablo31

One of the Regulars
Messages
153
Location
Vancouver
For a lighter wearing jacket try Horween Vermont from Johnson Leather. It is much better than any lambskin and not at all stiff/thick. Thedi may have something up your alley too, doesn't hurt to email them and ask.
 

Edward

Bartender
Messages
23,141
Location
London, UK
holy hell that green plastic zipper is cancer

It's not very attractive, no.... Also unusual to see a twin-track zipper oriented more to the centre like that rather than on a cross-over / lancer front. Useful feature, of course. Lewis did it first AFAIK; they introduced their Twin Track Bronx model for the tenth anniversary of the Bronx in 66. (the TT Bronx was also the first Lewis to carry the angled forearm zip pocket that became a bit of a Lewis trademark later on, and was gradually rolled out elsewhere on the line).
 
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