Lewis Leathers Star Lightning premature wear

Discussion in 'Outerwear' started by Bat02, Nov 22, 2019.

  1. Bat02

    Bat02 New in Town

    Messages:
    30
    Location:
    Paris
    Dear Loungers, I'm looking for advice around something that's happening to my LL Star Lightning Horsehide. Please let me know if you faced this situation in the past and if you have any idea how I could fix this.

    Some context, I bought the jacket around a month ago on the LL ebay store. I had to have it tailored as the sleeves were too long and used it 4 times since then on the commute between work and home. At home it was stored in a clean room, nowhere near a source of heat, in a pet free, smoke free environment. I'm from Paris so no tropical heat outside.

    The problem, after my last wear I noticed some color is litterally peeling off in the armpit area (see photos attached). I don't know what caused this (my aero jackets are fine). I inspected the leather and it doesn't show any scars or scuffs. Analyszing what's coming off makes me think that somehow the color coat and the shiny finish coat are detaching from the leather (as when you grab this part you can feel it's sort of plastic-y and is not actual leather coming off) but why so fast? and why so much ?

    What I did so far? I emailed LL and I took the jacket to a leather repair shop. I haven't heard back from LL yet and guys from the store told me they've never seen anything like this and that this was not normal. They confirmed the leather underneath was fine and this wasn't due to a shock or excessive rubbing and were reluctant to take the jacket as they don't know how to fix this. They could try and tint the leather again but then inspecting the jacket in details shows that this is happening all around it but with far less severity that the armpit situation meaning it would require a full retan and they didn't see any easy way to take out cleanly all the coating that's coming off.

    At the moment I'm still waiting for a response from LL but I'm at a loss here. Should I try other shops and have the jacket completly recolored ? Is it even fixable ? If you ever experienced something like this please let me know as any advice is welcomed at this stage.

    Thanks for having read through this and for your help.
    arm1.jpg
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    Last edited: Nov 22, 2019
  2. Monitor

    Monitor I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    9,241
    Ugh. Yeah, you've identified the problem correctly - it's the top coat pealing off. If I'm not mistaken, this is the kind of plasticized finish that usually gets applied to heavily processed, cheap leather, the kind that's used for mass produced handbags and such items.

    This absolutely should NOT be happening to a quality leather jacket. Never. Ever!
    Send it back immediately for a full refund and don't look back. I've never seen this happen to such an extent even on the cheapest of cheapos. Just awful.

    Also, no matter what anyone tells you, this cannot be fixed. Not even by the tannery.
    This jacket a faulty product that should not have passed the QC.
     
  3. Carlos840

    Carlos840 Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,313
    Location:
    London
    Like @Monitor said, this is not normal, this is a defect in the leather, and i have to say i find it incredible that this is happening to a LL!
    Problem is, if you bought it from the LL eBay store, it most likely has a SAMPLE stamp on the label, and they refuse to do any warranty work on these jackets!
    Personally i am not even sure that is a legal thing to do, i was under the impression it was illegal to sell something without warranty in the EU but i might be wrong.

    As far as repairing it, there is nothing you can do IMO.
    The part that is pealing is the finish itself, what is left beneath it is raw unfinished leather, you will be able to dye it black, but it will never be waterproof like the finished areas, it will never have the shine of the finished areas, it will never age like the finished areas. The best you will get is matte black in these naked areas.

    If i were you i would get in touch with LL and fight their "no warranty" rule and get them to take it back.
     
  4. Bat02

    Bat02 New in Town

    Messages:
    30
    Location:
    Paris
    I was affraid you were going to say that. It is indeed marked with the sample tag and no warranty thingy. I emailed them with the same photos that were attached to this thread so I'll just have to wait and see. I'm not trying to push the blame or cast a bad shadow on the brand here. I love the look of the lightning and corsairs and was planning to buy a sheep or cow leather version of those but it sends chills down my spine after having experienced this. Is it possible that I was just very unlucky ?
     
    regius likes this.
  5. Colin G

    Colin G Practically Family

    Messages:
    715
    Location:
    Canada
    If you paid by paypal then you may have some help there if you get nowhere with the ebay seller. If LL's ebay store gives you nothing then I'd escalate things and get things going with paypal. Make sure to save all e-mail correspondence with seller in case things have to get taken to paypal.

    Ebay and paypal usually side with the buyer and in this case you would be in the right since the jacket is clearly defective.
     
    AbbaDatDeHat, Monitor and Carlos840 like this.
  6. Carlos840

    Carlos840 Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,313
    Location:
    London
    There is no other way around it, this is a defective batch of leather, the only proper thing for them to do is to acknowledge it and make things right. I would not expect them to offer you a remake since this was a sample jacket, but the bare minimum would be to take the jacket back and refund you.

    If you keep it you will most likely end up with a peeling monstrosity pretty fast!

    Sales jacket and "no warranty" isn't a valid excuse to offload defective products on unsuspecting customers.
    Please keep us informed, i really want to know how LL deals with this situation.

    They can't possibly ignore your problem, imagine the horrible publicity if you post these pics on their Facebook!
     
    ton312, AbbaDatDeHat and Monitor like this.
  7. Monitor

    Monitor I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    9,241
    I love LL, I have had a few LL jackets. It's one of my favorite brands and I found all the LL jackets I've seen to be brilliant.
    I think you've just been extremely unlucky.

    But what Carlos says, even if it was sold as a Sample, this is just something that shouldn't have happened. I mean, Sample or not, simply put, this is not a wearable garment.

    It reminds me of those "leather" jackets you'd end up with if you fell for that parking garage scam. That's exactly how the material on those would peel off.
     
  8. nick123

    nick123 I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    5,729
    Location:
    California
    That's disappointing. Totally on LL to do something, otherwise we should protest.
     
  9. regius

    regius One Too Many

    Messages:
    1,989
    Location:
    New York
    This is concerning to understate it, because I too bought a patched horsehide lightning around three months ago!! Except I paid full price as a direct custom order. Damn. I hope mine doesn’t end up like this


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Carlos840 and Psant25 like this.
  10. Skyhawk

    Skyhawk Vendor

    Messages:
    316
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    This is much more than bad luck. This is bad leather! This jacket should have never been made, as the sample of the leather from the tanner would have been easily identifiable as a leather with a painted on finish, that will either rub off or peel.

    It almost looks like it is Nubuck that was pained to look like it has a finished leather surface. I have not owned a Lewis, but there are a lot of good looking ones I have seen with nice looking hide. I think this one may have been outsourced to a questionable maker. Then sold as a "sample".

    This is not acceptable. You deserve a refund.
     
  11. regius

    regius One Too Many

    Messages:
    1,989
    Location:
    New York
    The upside (if there is one) would be that the strength of the leather is not related to the paint. Although one May say if they don’t care about the paint they must not care about the selection & tanning of the hide, well, not necessarily.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  12. Corsair42

    Corsair42 One of the Regulars

    Messages:
    135
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Thats messed up, what leather is it? I've got a recently made horsehide lightning and as far as I can see it straight through chrome tanned black, its been out in all kinds of weather and been soaked through and no issues, only time I've seen that happen is to coated leather, was the sample some sort of experiment with a different hide?
     
  13. Carlos840

    Carlos840 Call Me a Cab

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    2,313
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    Let's not forget that most leather has a "painted on" finish...
    That's not different from the process Schott, Vanson, Lost world, Langlitz and many other makers use.
    The fact that is separating is a sign of a bad batch, not neceseraly a sign of bad leather.

    Unless a leather is natural/raw, or is only drum dyed and has no top coat it will have been "painted" one way or another.

    Even CXL has a hand applied topcoat (2:43) :



    This company uses sprays (14:22):



    I don't think saying " I think this one may have been outsourced to a questionable maker. Then sold as a "sample"" makes sens. Let's wait and see what they say before giving them bad intentions.
     
    Mysteryo and regius like this.
  14. AeroFan_07

    AeroFan_07 Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,085
    Location:
    Iowa
    The photos remind me of what is used in domestic car & truck seats are called "leather" which seems to go about as deep as the "paint."

    In this instance, I would encourage you, now that you have e-mailed them and sent the photos, to go old-fashioned and pick up the phone and call them directly. Get a customer support person on the line, calmly and carefully share what you have going on and ask if you can send the e-mails & photos to them. This usually tends to go a lot further than just sending an e-mail to some customer support line.

    Good luck, I agree it's defective and should not have been sold.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2019
    Harris HTM, El Marro and Monitor like this.
  15. Carlos840

    Carlos840 Call Me a Cab

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    2,313
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    The Lewis Leather store is 4 people in a two room shop, the person who will answer the phone is most likely the same person that is answering the emails...
    They most likely have to show this to Derek and see what he says.
     
    Edward likes this.
  16. Bat02

    Bat02 New in Town

    Messages:
    30
    Location:
    Paris
    Please note I have only an amateur level understanding of leather but one thing I can mention is that, from what I feel while touching it and so on, I don't think the leather used is bad or bad quality other than the peeling off of top coat. It feels quite light for horsehide but that's compared to non-lightweight FQHH CXL. What's puzzling me is chosing a brand that's well known in the jacket world because of their legacy and long history and craftmanship and experiencing the color coming off this way. One question to the experts, is it possible that this is due to the way the jacket was stored or it's really a tannery problem which didn't apply the finish correctly ?
     
  17. Mich486

    Mich486 Practically Family

    Messages:
    850
    I had a LL in horsehide. I didn’t care for the leather. Their sheepskin imho is the way to go. Sure the veg tanned cow looks cool but the upcharge seems a bit excessive.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2019
    regius likes this.
  18. Gamma68

    Gamma68 One Too Many

    Messages:
    1,755
    Location:
    Detroit, MI
    I didn't know LL had an eBay store. Thanks to this thread, I now know NOT to shop there.
     
  19. ton312

    ton312 I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    8,829
    Location:
    Chicago
    That’s an abomination. There is no way they don’t take that back for a refund or (worst case) you absolutely win a case through eBay. That’s just straight up junk. I wouldn’t assume malice on the part of the seller, they should simply refund you the cost of the jacket and send that thing to the recycling bin.
     
    AeroFan_07 likes this.
  20. Monitor

    Monitor I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    9,241
    Leather jacket makers aren't necessarily tanning experts and often enough, when a leather jacket maker is introducing a new leather, they too go through the same process of trial and error, trying to find that perfect leather to work with.

    If the leather seemed good and came from a somewhat respectable tannery, in all likelihood, Lewis Leathers too could not have anticipated something like this would happen so what happened to you might turn out to be as much of a shock to them as it was to you.

    Which is why I'm absolutely sure they'll take care of you. LL isn't some small time cheapo scam company. Hearing about it will probably upset them even more than it did you.

    The jacket that you bought is a motorcycle jacket at its core. Regardless of how it was stored, believe me when I say that this should not have happened. No way. 7 years ago I have found a motorcycle leather jacket that was buried for years under a pile of boards in an old, leaking attic. I dusted it off, cleaned it and wore it for a year. Eventually I gave it to a friend who to this day wears it on an almost daily basis and other than the usual light fading, not a single stitch on that jacket is out of place.

    My Lewis Leathers Super Phantom was sitting piled up in a corner of an old, musty, stinking basement for 20 something years. When I got it, it had actual spider nests in the creases. White mold was growing all over it.
    Today it looks like this...

    [​IMG]
     
    El Marro, AeroFan_07, regius and 2 others like this.

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