My Himel Experience (v2)

Discussion in 'Outerwear' started by jeo, Mar 3, 2021.

  1. jeo

    jeo Practically Family

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    Philadelphia
    Dave I appreciate you coming on here to address this, but I didn't go online to "resolve my issues", I went to you. I did drop you an email, I did contact you first, I did reach out instead of going online to complain.

    I showed you the chest pocket flaw, which IMO was the worst flaw. Technically the worst stitching flaw was the facing stitching but no one sees that. The worst overall flaw maybe the collar, but I didn't discover that until later.

    I showed you the chest pocket flaw and this was your response to me:

    "I talked it over with the team, unfortunately there is nothing we can do to make that stitch work look neater on that pocket because of the pocket placement. According to my main sewer, the problem was the leather is a bit slippery on that hide and the tape on the zipper caused some uneveness of the walking foot....I am really sorry about that...it wont happen again obviously. We are going to be much more focused on stitchwork especially using contrast thread"
     
    dpspider, red devil, dannyk and 8 others like this.
  2. jeo

    jeo Practically Family

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    Did you not read the post?

    I emailed him and expressed my disappointment.
     
  3. TREEMAN

    TREEMAN One Too Many

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    Round and round we go .....o_O
     
    Carlos840 likes this.
  4. Well it's because some are continually deflecting with BS, IMO..to be frank.
     
  5. jeo

    jeo Practically Family

    Messages:
    631
    Location:
    Philadelphia
    I don't know, to me it was the worst flaw by far. If anyone of those flaws would be noticed, it would be that one, and that one flaw should have been enough, but I guess that is my opinion.

    You know, you're absolutely right. I gave my account. I will not go into it again. I do not think I needed or would have done anything differently.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2021
  6. dlite90

    dlite90 Familiar Face

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    88
    @Superfluous did you experience any similar issues with your jacket? I saw that you said you enjoy your 4 Himels.
     
    Jin431 likes this.
  7. Sorry that you and Carlos didn't get what you thought you were ordering.
     
  8. Superfluous

    Superfluous My Mail is Forwarded Here

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    No. Six jackets purchased, four still owned, and no similar problems.

    Had I received a jacket similar to that received by Jeo, my head would have exploded. That said, I am more confrontational than Jeo and I respect Jeo's more amicable approach (I am trying mightily to be more amicable and less confrontational in my daily interactions). Unfortunately, in most instances, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. On the other hand, a gentle, polite word often goes much further than manifest outrage. Here, Jeo's kind word should have been enough to start a respectful dialogue, as opposed to a flat denial.
     
    sweetfights, red devil, TG3 and 11 others like this.
  9. El Marro

    El Marro Call Me a Cab

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    2,770
    Location:
    California
    This post resonates with me because I can’t imagine how I would feel if I were in his shoes. I think sometimes it is easy to lose sight of this when we are upset and to forget that we are all just people trying to accomplish something good here.
    I’m glad that Dave Himel replied to this thread and I hope that Jeo accepts a remake.
     
    sweetfights, TG3, antoine p and 6 others like this.
  10. navetsea

    navetsea I'll Lock Up

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    5,494
    Location:
    East Java
    yeah it is a shame, usually when a contrast stitching jacket is ordered then the workmanship is a notch more careful than with tonal stitching since the client would be able to spot it immediately, seems like this one went the other way around. sometime you don't get chance to fix past error, in product and in relation due to one or other factors to complicate the matter like in Carlos case, better to send out photos first before the the jacket ever leaving the workshop, saving everybody from extra costs and time. let the customer be part of the qc, since he is the one who own the jacket he will be eyeballing the photos a lot more than a person who have to check QC of a stack of jackets in front of him.

    still I can't understand how a clearly wonky stitching is being done until finish and not immediately stop, maybe mend the little holes somehow since leather products have lots of magic putty to make needle holes disappear and touch up the color in few dots I bet it would be non visible or at worst replace one panel, rather than a finishing wonky stitched panel and assembling together into a finished jacket, hoping to pass a qc.. which is somehow passed.

    there is no exaggeration on how well these "bespoke" orders fit the clients very well and trim. and the designs are all cool understated look special.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2021
  11. MrProper

    MrProper One Too Many

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    Europe
    And poor Parker.
    Even if Parker is in charge of quality control, as a boss, I would never publicly name an employee in a forum and thus pillory them.
    If I'm the boss, I'll be in charge and I'll use my own name.

    ...assuming, of course, that Parker is an employee and not a partner.
     
  12. Marc mndt

    Marc mndt My Mail is Forwarded Here

    Messages:
    3,491
    Thank you for responding.

    This was and is indeed my opinion and my personal feeling. Sharing our opinions and how we feel about things is what we do here on this forum. We mostly praise jackets and their makers and continuously share how great we feel whenever we wear all these beautiful jackets. Like you mentioned, you have many customers here on TFL who have had incredible experiences, experiences which they do share. But sometimes we also share our less than positive opinions and feelings and I will continue to do so, even though that might not always be beneficial for the maker.

    I initially added a link to my post. Instead of saying just look at the issues on Jeo's jacket I said just look at the issues on this jacket (follow link). I later edited my post and removed the link because I was afraid the forum mods would step in and remove my post (because I basically continued a discussion from another thread that was 'not open for further replies'). The linked post shows issues at least as severe (in my opinion) as the ones on Jeo's jacket. They were brought to the attention in the same thread where @Carlos840 brought the issues on his Chevalier to attention. The same thread where you/Parker stepped in, offering @Carlos840 a remake. Yet you only offered @Carlos840 a remake, ignoring the op's (Original Poster's) issues. Because of that, to me your response came across as cheap and easy damage control.

    You might call it speculation, I call it sharing my opinion (which I will continue to do so). Unfortunately I could not substantiate my reasoning further because that would be continuing a thread that was already closed by the mods.

    Cheers, Marc
     
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  13. Marc mndt

    Marc mndt My Mail is Forwarded Here

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    3,491
    +1. DH is basically throwing Parker under the bus. Saying "Parker was new and unused to qc".
     
  14. Carlos840

    Carlos840 I'll Lock Up

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    4,245
    Location:
    London

    After your first message where you offered me a remake i got in touch with Parker.
    I told him i didn't start all this because i wanted a remake, but because i wanted to be honest and show people what my jacket was really like.
    I also said i was happy to return my jacket for a remake as long as i was not expected to pay anything and that you guys had to deal with all expenses.
    IMO this is fair considering i was sold a jacket with "serious issues" after being told i would get "best quality, best sewing, best leather" (your words not mine).
    Parker told me "There is no way I’m going to be able to get David to pay the duties and taxes."
    That to me was the end of that conversation...

    After making thousands in sales from my pics on your website you still expect me to have to cash out more money to make up for your company's mistake...
    That IMO is not "standing behind your work".

    I personally don't want anything from you, i am letting you take the decision you want.
    You are either ok with a jacket with "serious issues" bearing your name being in the wild or your are not...
    I know how i would deal with that situation, we can all see how you are dealing with it.
     
  15. navetsea

    navetsea I'll Lock Up

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    Location:
    East Java
    if I imagine I'm a jacket entrepreneur (which I'm not) and I see a finished jacket with this kind of QC problem about to leave the shop to the client, I would simply send these pictures regarding flaws to the client, apologize and give him option
    - to keep the jacket with a discount (like a test product/ or B product) pay back the discount to the client, or
    - to wait for a scheduled remake (and of course sell the finished jacket as a B product).
    whichever they want, but it won't leave the shop without any greenlight from the client.

    and tell the sewer to be more open about mistake they make the soonest they see it, and have plans to fix the mistakes according to its severity, not hiding them, let them be first gate of QC.

    no need for future hassle or diplomacy.
     
    red devil, tmitchell59, TG3 and 6 others like this.
  16. Carlos840

    Carlos840 I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    4,245
    Location:
    London
    This is exactly 100% what Norshore leather did for me.
    I ordered a jacket from him, he made it but was unhappy about the way he had stitched the collar.
    He had tried "a new way" and wasn't 100% satisfied with the result.
    He sent me pics, showing what he was unhappy about and offered to either send me that jacket at cost as a test jacket and then a remake if i was unhappy, or to remake it straight away as he now felt confidant he would 100% nail the collar.

    I didn't want to pay customs twice so i opted to go with the remake straight away, Marc was cool about it, the remake is now in the post.

    Point is, he knew he had produced something i might not be happy with and he wanted to OK it with me before shipping.
    That is IMO a far better way to do things than just sending out flawed jackets hoping the customer won't notice or complain about it.


    Edit: Marc actually tried to give me a discount on the remake to appologize for the trouble and the delay. I refused as i felt he had been honest in the way he dealt with the situation and i didn't want to take advantage of it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2021
  17. Riu

    Riu Practically Family

    Messages:
    697
    Location:
    UK

    There are more details to discuss when it comes to situations like these but, from a customer service perspective, the right way is for the maker to cover all the costs that come with the returns/remake whatever the outcome is.

    I know it's a bit costly but since it's a faulty product there is no debate about it: the customer should not be charged for anything extra unless the fault on the product is caused by him. Simple rules, simple life ;)
     
  18. Mark R

    Mark R New in Town

    Messages:
    47
    Location:
    Kirkintilloch
    That sums it up perfectly for me.
     
    Superfluous likes this.
  19. Mark R

    Mark R New in Town

    Messages:
    47
    Location:
    Kirkintilloch
    And in my opinion in this case you both did the right thing, well done you in wanting to still pay the full price, many would have taken the discount regardless.
     
    Fonzie likes this.
  20. navetsea

    navetsea I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    5,494
    Location:
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    if someone is very confident that this situation is only happening once every hale-bopp passing the earth then they shouldn't be worried to cover these extra tax and fee since in theory it only happens 1 or 2 time in thousands of jackets that ever reach the client in such condition, it practically never happens... but if this anomaly happens a bit more often.. then tough, that's why don't even send them out in the first place, don't even finish the jacket before fixing/ replacing the problem panels.

    maybe giving a roll of ribbon with the sewer name printed on it, and make them sew their name on the finished product could trigger more personal pride of their workmanship, since their name too is forever tagged on the jacket.
     
    red devil, El Marro, jeo and 3 others like this.

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