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16,109
Are you forgetting the widely unloved Yugo? I think they cost US $3999, but they didn’t run very long.
I remember the Yugo. But it predates the 3 Fiats I mentioned. Of the (now 4) cars mentioned only the Panda is still in production & its demise comes in/after the 2026 model yr.
 

belfastboy

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,720
Location
vancouver, canada
FWIW I own a kia sportage, simply because of the 100,000 mile warranty on everything.

I'm not anti fur felt hats nor am I itching for a big argument here. Just stating a humble opinion however contrary it may be.

I own at least 6 fur felt hats including a 100% beaver. My preference is actually for newsboy caps (Sterkowski, Gamble and Gunn, Wigens)

The world outside of this forum isn't really interested in wearing a fedora. Particularly expensive ones.

Walking around my area in Connecticut, you see baseball hats and the occasional flat cap. If you go to the agricultural fairs, you'll see lots of western hats.

You'll also see vendor's there selling tons of cheaper wool felt western style hats. Last weekend, there was a long line of people waiting to buy one.

Hopefully those buying the wool felt fedora's will advance to fur felt. But the majority will be very happy with their wool felt hats.
My journey into making custom hats has been interesting. The News Hour did a 'human interest' story on me as a hatter and my business exploded immediately. 90% of my new customers are already hat people. They wore hats mostly for utility rather than style but wore cheap ones...wool bucket hats, cheap off the rack wool Akubra knock offs, Brixton wool and some legit Akubras. To a man they were thrilled that such a concept as a custom hat existed. This was new information for them. It helps that my price point for a top quality rabbit fur hat is about the same as an off the shelf Steton. These men, and a few women, leave my shop with huge smiles on their faces wearing a real fur hat instead of the inexpensive hats they had been used to buying.

They bought these hats as that was all that was available to them (we have but one hat shop in a remote suburb and their top line is Brixton wool hats). So if you are not inclined to buy on line then hat wearers here buy the cheap ones on offer because that is all that is available to them. This has been my experience at least.
 

belfastboy

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,720
Location
vancouver, canada
FWIW I own a kia sportage, simply because of the 100,000 mile warranty on everything.

I'm not anti fur felt hats nor am I itching for a big argument here. Just stating a humble opinion however contrary it may be.

I own at least 6 fur felt hats including a 100% beaver. My preference is actually for newsboy caps (Sterkowski, Gamble and Gunn, Wigens)

The world outside of this forum isn't really interested in wearing a fedora. Particularly expensive ones.

Walking around my area in Connecticut, you see baseball hats and the occasional flat cap. If you go to the agricultural fairs, you'll see lots of western hats.

You'll also see vendor's there selling tons of cheaper wool felt western style hats. Last weekend, there was a long line of people waiting to buy one.

Hopefully those buying the wool felt fedora's will advance to fur felt. But the majority will be very happy with their wool felt hats.
Back in 1985 my wife bought a new car....we almost bought the Hyundai Pony because it was cheap...about $8,000. We bought a little Mustang instead for $10,500. Good thing as we had the Mustang for 18 years and the Pony car turned out to be crap.

Many years later we bought a 2010 Hyundai as my work vehicle and I ran it for 11 years and 200,000. Loved the car so much we bought a 2022 Hyundai Tucson to replace it and love it. Pretty much the best cars we have ever owned for reliability over the long haul Just came back for southern Oregon and we recieved just a touch under 50 miles per gallon on the trip. Amazing gas mileage.
 

dkstott

Practically Family
Messages
532
Location
Connecticut
I’m a bit confused here.

I have never worried about any of my Akubra hats or my Rand’s getting rained on, so I’m a bit puzzled by the statement that a $200 Stetson needs “maintenance” if exposed to rain.

A good fur felt hat, with a wide brim, can transform a miserable experience in the rain to at least tolerable, and almost an absolute delight in comparison.
Modern "dress" Stetsons have been notorious for not handling rain, etc.
 
Messages
16,322
Location
Central California
Modern "dress" Stetsons have been notorious for not handling rain, etc.


There was a time when Stetson used powder to even out the color and that didn’t tolerate rain well. There is also the tendency for some fur felt hats to taper when they get wet. I’m not sure how Akubra has avoided these issues while selling for less. I haven’t soaked a current Stetson and would be interested to see how it does.
 
Messages
16,322
Location
Central California
Back in 1985 my wife bought a new car....we almost bought the Hyundai Pony because it was cheap...about $8,000. We bought a little Mustang instead for $10,500. Good thing as we had the Mustang for 18 years and the Pony car turned out to be crap.

Many years later we bought a 2010 Hyundai as my work vehicle and I ran it for 11 years and 200,000. Loved the car so much we bought a 2022 Hyundai Tucson to replace it and love it. Pretty much the best cars we have ever owned for reliability over the long haul Just came back for southern Oregon and we recieved just a touch under 50 miles per gallon on the trip. Amazing gas mileage.


50 MPG…is that right?
 

M Hatman

My Mail is Forwarded Here
There was a time when Stetson used powder to even out the color and that didn’t tolerate rain well. There is also the tendency for some fur felt hats to taper when they get wet. I’m not sure how Akubra has avoided these issues while selling for less. I haven’t soaked a current Stetson and would be interested to see how it does.
They (Akubra) uses a LOT of sizing....sizing will make a hat water resistant......but something that NONE of these manufacturers do today they THEY HAD ALWAYS DONE is add water repellent. Felt processing removes any of the oils present in either fur or wool, thus needing to be replaced to create a water resistant product. From my reading it is largely due to the chemical nature of the repellent and the modern abhorrence to anything chemical on our stuff. AND I am SURE the savings of eliminating that step has not escaped the notice of the manufacturers.

Even in the 19th century this was true.....however also true were companies cutting corners on government contracts which is evident in the extreme tapering of the issue army hats in the field (granted they were wool) evidenced in the photographs of the time.

Now speaking of wool (and fur) I personally TREAT MY WORK HATS (and always have), and do NOT have the tapering or associated problems others do with their work hats when exposed to the elements.....for dress hats I tend to keep them out of the heavy rain (but have treated 1/2 a dozen for such weather). {Dress hats need to be handled carefully when applying water repellent if you do not wish to effect the sizing and hand of the felt which spraying on will do.....needs to be wiped on with a cloth, just applied to the surface of the fabric, thus avoid soaking the felt through.}

And I will say even my "Woollies" have stood the test of time.......when treated!:)
 
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ILB Frank

One of the Regulars
Messages
137
They (Akubra) uses a LOT of sizing....sizing will make a hat water resistant......but something that NONE of these manufacturers do today they THEY HAD ALWAYS DONE is add water repellent. Felt processing removes any of the oils present in either fur or wool, thus needing to be replaced to create a water resistant product. From my reading it is largely due to the chemical nature of the repellent and the modern abhorrence to anything chemical on our stuff. AND I am SURE the savings of eliminating that step has not escaped the notice of the manufacturers.

Even in the 19th century this was true.....however also true were companies cutting corners on government contracts which is evident in the extreme tapering of the issue army hats in the field (granted they were wool) evidenced in the photographs of the time.

Now speaking of wool (and fur) I personally TREAT MY WORK HATS (and always have), and do NOT have the tapering or associated problems others do with their work hats when exposed to the elements.....for dress hats I tend to keep them out of the heavy rain (but have treated 1/2 a dozen for such weather). {Dress hats need to be handled carefully when applying water repellent if you do not wish to effect the sizing and hand of the felt which spraying on will do.....needs to be wiped on with a cloth, just applied to the surface of the fabric, thus avoid soaking the felt through.}

And I will say even my "Woollies" have stood the test of time.......when treated!:)
What do you use to treat your fur felt hats?
 

belfastboy

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,720
Location
vancouver, canada
50 MPG…is that right?
Yes, it based on our Imperial gallon which is somewhat larger than the US. I tracked it the whole trip and it was consistent. I didn't try to drive economically I just drove my usual way. The mileage dropped down a bit through the mountains as there was lots of truck traffic and I lead footed it a lot to pass the trucks on the steep parts.
 

M Hatman

My Mail is Forwarded Here
What do you use to treat your fur felt hats?
Well......I have used a few things including a mixture of my own using mineral spirits......(which actually works ok, but only for dark felts and has a long "dry time"). Mainly I use a product called Swan Cote (also uses mineral spirits) which unfortunately is for industry use only as it has some strong solvents....but works well on all my felts and ribbons.

Not sure what over the counter products may be available unfortunately.
Stay away from any of the products with "plasticizers" or silicone!!!

Again on my fur felts I spray or pour into a small bowl and wipe on only.

For my special mixture I used isopropyl alcohol 80% to 20% mineral spirits (odorless). But found it did not work as well on light felts as the swan cote (some dis-colorization). Generally two applications did the trick.....Rubbing the felt down with a clean dry cloth afterward in either event (even with the swan cote).

For what it is worth.......
 

belfastboy

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,720
Location
vancouver, canada
I’m not disparaging anyone’s choices or product, but I don’t see a hat which can’t be worn in the rain as a useful hat.
I have had two customers that had their new black Stetson's bleed black dye down their faces when they wore the hat in a heavy rain. Not sure why other that the dye was not set. But I washed it for them and then used a dye set in an attempt to make the dye fast. A ton of dye came out turning the wash water a deep dark black. I think I got it fixed as I did not receive any complaints afterwards.
 

johnnycanuck

Call Me a Cab
Messages
2,916
Location
Alberta
I have had two customers that had their new black Stetson's bleed black dye down their faces when they wore the hat in a heavy rain. Not sure why other that the dye was not set. But I washed it for them and then used a dye set in an attempt to make the dye fast. A ton of dye came out turning the wash water a deep dark black. I think I got it fixed as I did not receive any complaints afterwards.
Like brand new? Not new old stock. I heard Stetson got better with not needing to use powders to correct bad dye jobs. That’s not good news.
 

PanosChris

Practically Family
Messages
850
This thread deserves some more love.

Reiner Brillant Haarhut. This was the second great hat from a 5lot we bought last year with @Mean Eyed Matt, the other one being the gorgeous Erko velour that unfortunately it's a few sizes large and thus fits him better ;)
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Beige-tan color, great solf felt that creases easily. From the feel of it the content might have some fur in the mix. Unclipped similar to a flamand finish. Probably from the 30s. I was initially thinking a Guben source but I've also seen very similar markings on the sweatband from Wien hats. No paper labels inside. @mayserwegener will know better
 
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Messages
16,528
Location
Maryland
This thread deserves some more love.

Rotner(?) Brillant Woolhat (Haarhut). This was the second great hat from a 5lot we bought last year with @Mean Eyed Matt, the other one being the gorgeous Erko velour that unfortunately it's a few sizes large and thus fits him better ;) View attachment 465740 View attachment 465741 View attachment 465742 View attachment 465743 View attachment 465744 View attachment 465745

Beige-tan color, great solf felt that creases easily. From the feel of it the content might have some fur in the mix. Unclipped similar to a flamand finish. Probably from the 30s. I was initially thinking a Guben source but I've also seen very similar markings on the sweatband from Wien hats. No paper labels inside. @mayserwegener will know better
Panos, Yes this thread needs a bounce! Really fantastic! It's "Reiner Haar" so "Pure Fur Felt". I am not sure of the hat company but it could be from a Guben maker. I really like the finish and color. It's very unique / special! Thanks for posting the photos.
 

PanosChris

Practically Family
Messages
850
Panos, Yes this thread needs a bounce! Really fantastic! It's "Reiner Haar" so "Pure Fur Felt". I am not sure of the hat company but it could be from a Guben maker. I really like the finish and color. It's very unique / special! Thanks for posting the photos.
Thanks Steve! I edited
 

PanosChris

Practically Family
Messages
850
Panoschris,
What a beauty. I am just a new guy in hats, so new that I think that wool is just fine. But this vintage one, with its great shape, nice ribbon, nappy texture comes together as one fine hat. I hope you shape it in a suitable way and give it a new life.
Thanks! Welcome to the hobby. Be warned though that if you have a soft spot for the very oldies in wool and other special finishes it's like going down to a rabbit hole with no obvious escape ;)
 
Messages
15,940
Location
Nederland
This thread deserves some more love.

Reiner Brillant Haarhut. This was the second great hat from a 5lot we bought last year with @Mean Eyed Matt, the other one being the gorgeous Erko velour that unfortunately it's a few sizes large and thus fits him better ;) View attachment 465740 View attachment 465741 View attachment 465742 View attachment 465743 View attachment 465744 View attachment 465745

Beige-tan color, great solf felt that creases easily. From the feel of it the content might have some fur in the mix. Unclipped similar to a flamand finish. Probably from the 30s. I was initially thinking a Guben source but I've also seen very similar markings on the sweatband from Wien hats. No paper labels inside. @mayserwegener will know better
Very nice, Panos. Good to see you posting again. Unpack the hats and make us envious!
 
Messages
15,940
Location
Nederland
Sools woolfelt hat in black. Unsure about the maker, because all of the labels are gone. Sools had hats made by various manufacturers with Mossant and Laubin as the ones I've seen most often. Size 57 with the brim at 6cm and the crown at 11cm at the center dent. Really nice proportions to the hat. Even has a bit of reverse taper. First time I've seen a woolfelt hat for Sools, but that could be because they didn't survive. Weighs in at 138 grams. Also an early one.

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There was a label there once (picture above). The square size points towards Mossant as the most likely maker.
 

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