Union tags on hats

[ScottF]

I posted this on another thread and didn't get any bites, so perhaps it needs more visibility. I remember at one point seeing a post about the significance of the size of these tags, and another about the merging of two unions; however, I cannot locate the thread (or posts). Can anyone help out?

... Here's the union tag - I can't remember the significance of using these for dating hats, and can't find the info here in the lounge.

 

[Lefty]

I don't know if this applies to the hat you posted, but here's some good info from Mr. Bowers.

 

[anon`]

The UHCMW came into existence when the United Hatters of North America merged with the Cloth Hat, Cap and Millinery Workers International Union in 1934. So the label should at least be useful in telling you that your hat was made in 1934 or after. Otherwise I've yet to find a use for them =)

I have no idea if they can be "read" in the same sense as ACWA labels can. Never head anything about the size of the label either, but I too would be interested in hearing any more information that may be lurking out there...

 

[Brad Bowers]

The dates for the Union mergers are only part of the story. The other part is that certain manufacturers were union shops only at certain times, not always, and so that helps narrow dates even more. It depends on the manufacturer. I have dates for many of the manufacturers, but need to dig through my information to get to them, and then organize it. One of my future projects.

So yes, your hat is post-1934 merger, but who is the manufacturer on this hat?

Brad

 

[ScottF]

The dates for the Union mergers are only part of the story. The other part is that certain manufacturers were union shops only at certain times, not always, and so that helps narrow dates even more. It depends on the manufacturer. I have dates for many of the manufacturers, but need to dig through my information to get to them, and then organize it. One of my future projects.

So yes, your hat is post-1934 merger, but who is the manufacturer on this hat?

Brad

Thanks Brad, anon, Lefty!

Brad - it's a Brock, but no need to dig too deeply - it has a basting stitch along the top of the ribbon, so rlk had mentioned that it might be an old hat, but it also has a more modern size tag (silver paper square). When I found the union tag, it reminded me of a discussion some of you had had previously, and got me curious.

 

[Brad Bowers]

Brock sounds like it might be a brand made by someone else, so unless we knew that, I couldn't help, in any case.

Brad

 

[ScottF]

Brock sounds like it might be a brand made by someone else, so unless we knew that, I couldn't help, in any case.

Brad

Jtl had posted some info on Brock previously (see below). I read this as saying that Wolthausen Hat Co. was creating hats that were labeled as 'made in Canada' Stetsons, not as separate brands. 'The Brock' is just an example of a brand that Wolthausen was making before Stetson approached them.

From Snyder's Stetson Hats and the John B. Stetson Company:

In 1935, as it became increasingly difficult to market their hats overseas, Stetson began setting up plants in other countries to thwart the tariff restrictions. Their first foreign plant was located in Canada. Stetson "acquired a substantial interest" in the Wolthausen Hat Corporation in Brockville, Ontario. One of the largest manufacturers of men's fur hats in Canada, Wolthausen producing [sic] Brock hats and other lines known throughout the Dominion. These continued to be produced, along with Stetsons. It was the first time Stetson hats had ever been produced outside of Philadelphia. Other foreign branches were soon opened in Mexico, Australia and elsewhere.


Cheers,
JtL

 

[rlk]

Jtl had posted some info on Brock previously (see below). I read this as saying that Wolthausen Hat Co. was creating hats that were labeled as 'made in Canada' Stetsons, not as separate brands. 'The Brock' is just an example of a brand that Wolthausen was making before Stetson approached them.

Useless trivia: Brock and Brockville were named for Sir Isaac Brock who is credited for saving Canada from invasion and takeover by the evil Americans in the war of 1812.
http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.com/index.cfm?PgNm=ArchivedFeatures&Params=A266
There is also a Brockville Museum with archives with some references to the Stetson Factory.
http://www.brockvillemuseum.com/html/archives.htm

 

[jimmy the lid]

Jtl had posted some info on Brock previously (see below). I read this as saying that Wolthausen Hat Co. was creating hats that were labeled as 'made in Canada' Stetsons, not as separate brands. 'The Brock' is just an example of a brand that Wolthausen was making before Stetson approached them.

Scott -- I think what Snyder is saying is that, even after the Stetson acquisition, Wolthausen continued to make Brock hats -- in addition, they also made hats under the Stetson label.

Also -- don't be so sure that a silver paper tag isn't an older tag. I have such a tag on my Mallory Dallas, which is not a "modern" Mallory.

Cheers,
JtL

 

[ScottF]

Scott -- I think what Snyder is saying is that, even after the Stetson acquisition, Wolthausen continued to make Brock hats -- in addition, they also made hats under the Stetson label.

Also -- don't be so sure that a silver paper tag isn't an older tag. I have such a tag on my Mallory Dallas, which is not a "modern" Mallory.

Cheers,
JtL

Thanks jtl - that's how I was reading it as well, just didn't communicate it well.

Thanks for the silver tag info - tags have been the toughest thing for me to get a feel for. The sweatband has a fifty-ish look to it also, but let me know your opinion. I would love to hear it's an older hat: