Terms Which Have Disappeared

[LizzieMaine]

Does anyone still say gas-guzzler or road hog anymore? Or drive-in restaurant. I don't think of a McDonald's as a drive-in. A drive-in has car hops who bring your order out on a tray that hooks on your car window. What about speed trap? They still exist, sort of. I know of one place where there might be a police car lurking just over the rise in the road. There used to be a place where the traffic backed up and the police with wait there to check registrations and inspection stickers.

We still have drive-ins here, although carhops were never popular in this area. You'd have to order and then wait for your number to be called, and go get your food at the window yourself. This is a classic Maine drive-in, still in business after nearly eighty years:

 

[BlueTrain]

Do you suppose there are any diners that old? In our small town of, oh, about 8,000 (it seemed much bigger), there were only two drive-ins, and one of them wasn't even in town. It was just outside of town, outside the city limits. The other one was in the middle of town, more or less, just two blocks from home. But the one outside of town was much better to go to, if only because it had a much bigger parking lot, paved with gravel and bottle caps. Nothing special about the menu at either place.

There was nothing that qualified as a diner in my book, although there was a place, also in the middle of town about two or three blocks from the drive-in, that had many of the qualities of a diner. It just wasn't a separate building. But the inside fixtures and general styling were either what might be called "diner style," but just as likely to be "1940s/1950s" style. But it was named "Ferrel's Diner," so I guess it really was a diner. I rather doubt it's in business now.

There were a few restaurants, too, depending on how far outside of town you went before you stopped counting. One that I remember quite well was called the Dinner Bell Restaurant. It was a block from the court house. It was the sort of place that served blue plate specials. And there were a few other lunch counter places here and there, too. And last but most numerous were the places usually referred to as beer joints, called taverns elsewhere. But I, uh, don't know anything about them.

 

[HudsonHawk]

We still have drive-ins here, although carhops were never popular in this area. You'd have to order and then wait for your number to be called, and go get your food at the window yourself. This is a classic Maine drive-in, still in business after nearly eighty years:

We still have a few of those around here, mostly in smaller towns. In high school, we had the Burger Mart, though we called it a drive "up". And there's always Sonic, which still has the classic window ordering and even carhops on roller skates.

 

[EngProf]

Here in Nashville we have several drive-in's but they are all part of a chain/franchise. You place your order via speaker from your car and then the car-hops bring your food and pick up the money. I eat at one of those occasionally.

As for diner's, we have one here that is locally famous. It started as a trolley car in 1927 (80 years old next year) and has been added on to over the years. They claim to have the oldest operational beer license in the city.
Great cheeseburgers, great chili... They win local food awards on a regular basis.

It's near Music Row so a lot of music-related folks eat there and they have live music several nights a week. They are mostly behind-the-scenes/sessions people so you don't usually see famous people there, but the "stars" do go there occasionally.

It's only about 1/4 mile from my house so I used to eat there about once a week but got out of the habit recently.

 

[BlueTrain]

There were streetcars in my hometown but they disappeared before I was born. And I mean disappeared literally. You would never know there had ever been streetcars because there wasn't a trace of them anywhere. The places alongside the "old road" where the tracks used to be were fairly obvious but you had to look for them and know what they were. I have no idea whatever happened to the cars themselves. There was likewise no trace of the tracks on the streets, either. I don't recall anyone talking about them when I was little, either, although I have seen photos of the street with the tracks still in place. Anyway, I guess none of the cars were converted to diners.

I live outside Washington, D.C., and apparently there is something of a food truck scene downtown (but not uptown), judging from articles in the paper. But it isn't the same thing. One still sees open-pit barbecues going in a few places here and there, typically along the road in select places. There are also a few regular (not a truck beside the road) barbecue restaurants around town, too.

The most "authentic" diner I've ever been in was in Front Royal, Virginia, unfortunately no longer in business, though the building is still in use for other purposes. It was really small and frankly, not particularly clean. But it had a good menu and good food with ancient posters for Patsy Cline performances somewhere in the valley. It was also tiny.

 

[LizzieMaine]

We have Moody's Diner not far from here, in business at the same location since 1927. It's been expanded several times over the decades, but the counter is still original, and the worn spots on the rail prove it. The food is not particularly good or memorable, except for the pies, but it's cheap and unpretentious, which is all you really have any right to expect from a diner. The people who run the place are kind of odd, and have had some issues because of it, but it's an interesting place to visit nonetheless.

The trolley was a big deal here for a long time until it was bought out and shut down in 1929. Before that it was possible to ride from here to Boston via interurban trolley with just a pocket full of transfers.

A few years ago we had a really bad frost heave on Main Street which brought up the roadbed where the tracks had been -- the tracks had been pulled up and turned in for salvage during the war, but the cobblestone bed was still there under the asphalt and was temporarily exposed to the public.

 

[KILO NOVEMBER]

I remember trolleys in downtown Pittsburgh when I was a boy. My mother and father would take me and my brother downtown shortly before Christmas to see Santa Claus. I vividly remember the sparks the overhead lines threw off when the poles powering the trolley cars would pass under a join in the wires.
Another vivid memory is a lunch counter smell. There was a large 5-and-dime (I don't remember which chain) downtown, and when you went through the revolving doors, the smell of the deep fryer grease made me lust for french fries.

 

[Fading Fast]

In NYC, since the streets are constantly being torn up (there is no dirt under our pavement, just infrastructure supporting a web of cables, pipes, wires, subway tunnels and God knows what else - while this is an exaggeration, it is amazing how many times I've seen the street torn up only to expose a complex of infrastructure - not dirt -underneath) and the re-paving, etc. is sporadic, so I see old trolley / rail tracks all the time. And in the oldest parts of the city - downtown, Village, Soho, etc. - that still have cobblestone streets, you can see old tracks in many places.

Another neat things is that the Subways here were originally independent private companies - they were taken over in the '30s by the government and all renamed under the NYC transit system rubric - and you can still find many of the old signs for the "Interborough Rapid Transit Company" or "Independent Rapid Transit" or "Brooklyn Manhattan Transit Corp -" either the full name or initials all over the place. Some old buildings that had subway entrances still have metal signs or signs carved into their masonry or stone work and even in the subway itself an old sign or designation will pop up. And of course, you can see those same signs in movies of the period.

 

[BlueTrain]

I was pleased when I found out where the musical ground "Manhattan Transfer" got it's name, then I found out I was wrong. Either way, it had to do with New York, sometimes referred to as New York City.

 

[tonyb]

.,,
The only authentic Florida accent I've ever heard on screen was Jean Smart in a version of The Yearling (which is set in rural central Florida) a few years back. I don't know where she's from, but she nailed the accent.

Seattle, Ballard district, specifically. She was quite helpful in fundraising efforts for the Ballard High School Foundation.

She remembers where she came from. Good for her.

 

[tonyb]

...

The most famous alimony dodger of the Era, however, was a Bronx con man named Lester Kroll -- who formed "The Institute of Marital Relations," changed his name to John J. Anthony, and spent the better part of the forties as a national radio celebrity, dishing out advice to troubled married couples. Takes one to know one.

Never crossed paths with Mr. Kroll or Anthony or whatever else he may have called himself, but I'm well acquainted with characters who may as well be his brothers.

 

[tonyb]

I remember trolleys in downtown Pittsburgh when I was a boy. My mother and father would take me and my brother downtown shortly before Christmas to see Santa Claus. I vividly remember the sparks the overhead lines threw off when the poles powering the trolley cars would pass under a join in the wires.
Another vivid memory is a lunch counter smell. There was a large 5-and-dime (I don't remember which chain) downtown, and when you went through the revolving doors, the smell of the deep fryer grease made me lust for french fries.

Seattle is reintroducing trolleys, on First and Capitol Hills and in the South Lake Union area. The authorities now insist that the latter be called a streetcar, as the acronym for the South Lake Union Trolley wasn't quite in keeping with the image the city fathers and mothers hoped to project.

The unlicensed T-shirts were fun, though.

 

[Fading Fast]

Seattle is reintroducing trolleys, on First and Capitol Hills and in the South Lake Union area. The authorities now insist that the latter be called a streetcar, as the acronym for the South Lake Union Trolley wasn't quite in keeping with the image the city fathers and mothers hoped to project...

Jersey City NJ, introduced, early this Century, a "Light Rail" system that, to my eye, looks and quacks like a street car - overhead electric wires picked up by the train's pantograph, tracks laid right into the street bed, trains interacting with other street traffic - but again, it's a "Light Rail."

I'm a huge fan and advocate, but to be honest, I blanch at the $2.2 billion it will cost for the 34 miles planed (already north of $1 billion for less than 20 miles). How can it cost that much - that is a lot of money per mile.

Any-who, despite nomenclature preening and mind-blowing budget numbers, it is a wonderful little system.

 

[KILO NOVEMBER]

More on trolleys. A neighboring jurisdiction, Arlington County, VA, was hell-bent on building a streetcar line along a busy traffic corridor. I expect it was being pushed by the same sort of people whom Lizzie loves to hate. It would have snarled traffic during construction and been a real nightmare once operational. It would have been yet another taxpayer subsidy for the chi-chi. Imagine a traffic-choked commuter artery where drivers have to contend with trolley cars!

And no, people aren't going to abandon their automobiles for the street cars, no matter how charming and environmentally-conscious an urban light rail might be, not 'til you pry their cold dead fingers from around the steering wheel.

The voters eventually told the political elite in no uncertain terms that this was one boondoggle up with which they would not put!

But there's no denying the charm, so long as someone else is paying for it.

 

[tonyb]

There's rail and then there's rail.

A light rail line on its own grade separated right of way is a whole 'nother animal from a streetcar running on the same right of way as automobile and truck and pedestrian traffic.

A light rail station is opening later this year half a mile from this place we bought last fall. A large parking garage is nearing completion and ground is soon to break on a 400-some unit apartment complex and commercial space on an adjacent chunk of open land (transit-oriented development, as it is called).

The lovely missus will likely ride this rail line at least one way on her daily commute. The train will take her, without transfer, literally in front of the downtown building where her office is moving next month, and in roughly the same time it takes to drive there, on average. Some days the drive actually takes longer.

We didn't plan for this, but we'll take it.

 

[Fading Fast]

There's rail and then there's rail.

A light rail line on its own grade separated right of way is a whole 'nother animal from a streetcar running on the same right of way as automobile and truck and pedestrian traffic....

Great info - thank you.

 

[Fading Fast]

There's rail and then there's rail.

A light rail line on its own grade separated right of way is a whole 'nother animal from a streetcar running on the same right of way as automobile and truck and pedestrian traffic.

A light rail station is opening later this year half a mile from this place we bought last fall. A large parking garage is nearing completion and ground is soon to break on a 400-some unit apartment complex and commercial space on an adjacent chunk of open land (transit-oriented development, as it is called).

The lovely missus will likely ride this rail line at least one way on her daily commute. The train will take her, without transfer, literally in front of the downtown building where her office is moving next month, and in roughly the same time it takes to drive there, on average. Some days the drive actually takes longer.

We didn't plan for this, but we'll take it.

If she rides it one way on her daily commute, how will she go the other way that day?

 

[HudsonHawk]

We have 21st century "light rail" here in Houston. When I think of a "street car" or a "trolley", the image is of a single car riding along in the same lane as other traffic, as Tony describes above. "Light rail" is more like a train, with six or eight cars riding on its own dedicated lane. At least that's how I see it, though it could certainly be because "light rail" sounds more modern than telling taxpayers "we want to install a trolley system". The problem with the light rail now is that it's pretty geographically isolated, only going to/from downtown to the medical center and out to one suburban area, though granted, those are areas that employ two million people. But I think they're working on expanding it. We also have a commuter bus that runs around downtown called the "Greenlink". It's a series of small shuttle buses that run on propane, and they're free to ride. Some office buildings also offer their own free shuttles to various points downtown at certain times of the day. We also have an expansive underground system where you can walk from building to building in an air conditioned tunnel, out of the rain and summer heat. There are shops and restaurants and shoe shine stands and what have you in the tunnels as well. It's like having a giant mall under the pavement. All in all, it's not too bad getting around downtown.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Montreal has that same kind of "Underground City" deal -- their Metro was built for the Expo in the 1960s and remains the cleanest, most pleasant, and most efficient mass transit system it's ever been my pleasure to use. No surface cars, but the subway is comfortable and efficient.

The "Underground City" is a very popular attraction during the cold Quebec winters, as well as rainy days in the summer. You can do just about everything you need to do without coming to the surface -- when the Expos played at Olympic Stadium, the Metro even let you off directly inside the ballpark.

 

[tonyb]

If she rides it one way on her daily commute, how will she go the other way that day?

I'll give her a lift. She doesn't drive. One daily round-trip in the minivan beats two.