To Epaulette or not to Epaulette an Aero J107/106

I would keep epaulets on a black D pocket style, but eliminate them on a brown bootlegger.
I've seen many old examples of "aviator" jackets without. "Biker" jackets seem to have them. Plus, I like the little star . I would also ask for bars at the end of the zips...but thats just me.

shadowrider said:

Talking about functionality, what is the purpose of snap buttons on the front beltloops on police/cross zip jackets (as opposed to beltloops on say an Irvin jacket that don't have snap buttons)?
I am talking about jackets that have the belt straps installed (not removable).

Click to expand...

Probably just decoration. Or maybe, somehow, it works out cheaper to do it that way, as installation of the snap will be faster than sewing it?

Big J said:

@Edward, interesting information. Doesn't explain use of SB belt with pistol holsters rather than swords though. And why adopted by police forces who never wore swords.
Incidentally, Hugo Boss did away with the SB belt on German Army uniforms by installing two metal hooks on the of the jacket to support the weight of the belt.

Click to expand...

Yes, some of the metal hook bit have been incorporated into later British uniforms too.


As to using it with pistols, the pistols simply replaced the swords as time went on (though there was a period - during WW1 where some officers would have carried both). Whether they really needed them or not with the pistols, sometimes military tradition dies hard.


With the police forces, as noted, some of them carried swords way back, but mostly I'd say it was just for show. Some states liked to give their police a touch of the military look to give them a certain aura. Interestingly, certain ranks (Inspector and above) of An Garda Síochána, the Irish police force, wear a black Sam Browne with their dress uniform, despite the fact that the Garda have, since their inception in 1921, been a largely unarmed force (even today, around 75% of them are routinely unarmed). I can only speculate that here it was purely cosmetic - perhaps some notion of a nod towards those who fought for Irish independence from Britain in 1919-21, as during that conflict those fighting the British army wore no uniforms, but often a Sam Browne belt. Some of these would have been purchased, and some, I rather suspect, were pulled off the bodies of dead soldiers. Armed police forces, of course, would have found them useful in supporting the pistol holster and keeping it in place.

With the Nazi-era Wehrmacht (et cetera) uniforms, the interesting thing is how they bucked certain broad trends in dress uniforms, to stick with an older, neck-high look (for the most part), to drop the SB in favour of a simpler belt, and so on. I wonder how much was done to deliberately hearken back to the Imperial Germany era, and how much was just coincidence on that front.


@shadowrider, I'm speculating that the snaps on the jacket belt loops allow the officer to remove/attach his gun belt without having to remove the pistol holster, mag pouches, handcuff pouches etc from the belt to thread it through the jacket loops. Must be much faster.[/QUOTE]


Good point.

@Edward, ah, fair points. Militaries are generally in the business of creating their own traditions to infer legitimacy and authority, and the western concept of police is pretty much derives from a domestic militia. So the idea that one should seek to mimic the other to increase its legitimacy seems reasonable.
And once something becomes 'traditional' all logic goes out the window.

Big J said:

@EdwardAnd once something becomes 'traditional' all logic goes out the window.

Click to expand...

Don't have to tell me that - I grew up in Northern Ireland.

handymike said:

I would keep epaulets on a black D pocket style, but eliminate them on a brown bootlegger.
I've seen many old examples of "aviator" jackets without. "Biker" jackets seem to have them. Plus, I like the little star . I would also ask for bars at the end of the zips...but thats just me.

Click to expand...

I like the epaulettes specially adorning the single star. My Scott 613SH (in horse hide) satisfies that... I love it. In the Ridley D-pocket, I’m seeking the ability to carry a bag over my shoulders without the worry of catching the epaulettes when dismounting the bag. I have also seen the bars at the pockets on the “Elvis Ridley” and they look very cool.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

@Edward, I'm guessing you grew up somewhere between that late 60's and early 90's, so you must have some pretty strong opinions of your own about NI, and a strange disconnect with those born within the last, what, 20 years? That must be very strange.
But yeah, 'tradition' defies all logic. Come over to my house any night my wife brings home whale meat for a demonstration.