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Need help identifying this G-1

Discussion in 'Outerwear' started by Gamma68, Jan 1, 2017.

  1. Gamma68

    Gamma68 One of the Regulars

    Hi everyone and Happy New Year.

    I came across the pictured G-1 at a vintage clothing store. The store tag with price says "1970s," but the faded mouton collar tells me it's no later than 1968/69. The interior tag has no manufacturer name and the lining is maroon rather than brown like my '68 Martin Lane. I'm no leather expert, but it's in nice shape--very soft and pliable. There is no "USN" on the wind flap behind the zipper. Lots of lining tears and the knits have seen better days. It's also a small 38. Otherwise, it's a very interesting piece and I was wondering how old it is and if it's a military-issue G-1 or something else.

    Thanks in advance for lending your expertise.

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  2. HPA Rep

    HPA Rep Sponsoring Affiliate

    This is a USN M-422A from WWII, not a G-1, thus more scarce and desirable. The zipper and knit parts are replacements from well after WWII, and the label with care instructions has been hand sewn and added after WWII, too. There should be evidence of a stenciled "USN" painted to the back of the collar in black, off-white, or yellow.

    Is there a pencil/pen slot under the left pocket or in the stitching of the flap?
     
  3. Gamma68

    Gamma68 One of the Regulars

    Thanks for this info. I'd have to go back to take another look to answer your questions.

    Is it a valuable jacket in spite of its condition and replacement knits/zipper?

     
  4. HPA Rep

    HPA Rep Sponsoring Affiliate

    It has value more than a G-1 in equal condition. Depending on what you need to pay, it could be worth a go. It's WWII!
     
  5. Doctor Damage

    Doctor Damage Call Me a Cab

    The left sleeve is a few inches shorter than the right sleeve, so be aware this jacket is basically un-wearable.
     
  6. Maybe not. It's hanging funny from the hanger, so I would be shocked if that were the case...but a good point to look for.
     
  7. Doctor Damage

    Doctor Damage Call Me a Cab

    ^ I know what you mean, but I'm 100% that the one sleeve is too short. Although the jacket is not hanging "square" on the hanger, it is hanging straight-on to the camera, so there's no perspective distortion; and because both sleeves are hanging straight down from the centre of the shoulder, both forward, without wrinkles, you can just measure the photo. I know that sounds crazy, but if you see enough jackets hanging on hangers or lying flat you learn to see things like this. You can prove it to yourself: if you have a similar jacket, hang it up and manipulate it to duplicate the photo -- you will find it impossible to duplicate this photo with two equal-length sleeves, believe me.
     
  8. HPA Rep

    HPA Rep Sponsoring Affiliate

    I saw that, too, but the positioning may be impacting what we see. Looking at the sleeve ends where the top stitching can be seen on both sleeves, they seem to show no evidence of alteration, but a close exam of these areas and where the sleeves are sewn into the body should be made to be sure.
    Unless otherwise indicated, I'm with ButteMT61 and think it's just an illusion from the way it rests on the hanger.
     
  9. HPA Rep

    HPA Rep Sponsoring Affiliate

    I do see what you are saying and I agree this is very suspect. The only way to be sure is a thorough hands-on exam, with all do attention to the possibility something fishy has transpired with the sleeve length(s).
     
  10. See, this is why my wife rolls her eyes at me ;)
     
    El Marro likes this.
  11. Gamma68

    Gamma68 One of the Regulars

    The sleeve length is a good point and something I didn't notice while examining the jacket in-person. I only took quick photos and didn't bother to arrange the jacket neatly on the hanger. So this could be due to how it's hanging. I doubt the sleeve lengths differ as much as it appears.

    Now I'm going to have to go back and take another look.
     
  12. Doctor Damage

    Doctor Damage Call Me a Cab

    When you go back to take another look please take a measuring tape or yardstick with you.
     
  13. Gamma68

    Gamma68 One of the Regulars

    Naturally.....;)
     
  14. Gamma68

    Gamma68 One of the Regulars

    OK, I returned, took more photos and got measurements.

    First, there is a pencil slot under the left pocket flap. BUT there is no evidence of a USN stencil under the collar. I find this puzzling.

    Other photos show the poor condition of the lining, jacket back, and a close up of the "Scovill" zipper.

    Also, one sleeve is shorter than the other. Here are actual measurements, taken with jacket zipped and lying flat:

    Chest: 41"
    Left sleeve including knit cuff: 19.5"
    Right sleeve including knit cuff: 20.5"
    Length from bottom of collar including knit band: 25"

    Does this information reveal anything additional about this rare piece?

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  15. pilot error

    pilot error One of the Regulars

    Don't measure the knit cuffs, just the leather sleeve. It looks workable. You haven't told us what the asking price is, to me that's a factor. BTW Whirlpool introduced the first coin operated dry cleaning machine in 1960. Zipper looks original, I think it's a civilian G-1.
     
    HPA Rep likes this.
  16. pilot error

    pilot error One of the Regulars

    1960's Hunting Jacket, same care label.....[​IMG]


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  17. HPA Rep

    HPA Rep Sponsoring Affiliate

    Now that we have detailed pics and that you showed the LL Bean label, I agree that this jacket is not a WWII USN jacket. The pic of the collar back clearly shows an absence of the correct stitching found on the USN collar backs, while other pics shine light on the stitching at the waistband and zipper that indicate no knit parts or the zipper were replaced (no empty stitch holes, and thread that matches the color and size found the rest of the jacket).

    This is not an M-422A or G-1 and simply a commercial flying jacket, seemingly from the '60's, that was based on an M-422A, having the lining type and color found on some WWII M-422A's.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2017
  18. Gamma68

    Gamma68 One of the Regulars

    That's very interesting. Thanks to everyone for helping to identify this piece. I will say that the leather on this jacket has a great hand--very soft and pliable.
     
  19. pilot error

    pilot error One of the Regulars

    Lol.......I highly doubt the cleaning label was added later. I'm not an "expert", but always glad to help.
     
  20. I'm pretty sure it's a 1970s civilian copy of a G-1 jacket. It isn't a faithful copy of a m-422 or a m-422a because the m-422 had no pencil pocket and the pencil pocket on the -422a was stitched completely down the interior side of the left pocket. The pencil pocket on this jacket appears to be patterned after those found on modern G-1s. I guess the argument could be made that this is a copy of an early series G-1, but I'm also thinking the flat-pull Scovill zipper isn't a replacement. Scovill zips were generally found on many 1970's flight jackets...G-1s, MA-1s, N-3Bs and N-2As. I think the maker of this jacket just used what the various military contractors were then using.

    Just my 2 cents...

    AF
     
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