My First Experience at a Tailor--Not good!

MondoFW · Jun 5, 2018

Hello all,

I thought I'd share something of note that I'd think could start some discussion. Today, I took a pair of 1950s pleated gab slacks (a $10 investment, thought it would be a good test run for my first trip to the seamstress) to my nearest tailor. Since I'm underage and broke, my mother took me and was willing to pay for the operation.

My objective was for a hemming and a tapering. The pants were quite wide, but I thought I'd be able to get a decent full cut after the operation.

I stepped out of the booth wearing the pants and the seamstress looks at me as if I'd killed a dog.
"Why so big??" she exclaimed
"Well, that's why I'm here." i replied.

She then examined the fit. To keep it short, she was dumbfounded by my preference of vintage over much of the modern plastic garbage that floods the market today (Not ALL of it, but let's be frank here). I won't bore you with specific dialogue, but she was convincing my mom that wearing wider, pleated pants is wrong and that investing/bringing the pants in today were a waste of time and my money. I tried saying that I didn't want to be like the youngsters wearing ultra-slim trousers, and that pleated pants can be a cool look. She rudely insisted I was wrong and seemed to, interestingly enough, NOT want to work on them, like she was denying my business. Regardless, my mother bought into her rhetoric.

Do a lot of tailors have a similar mindset? Even though she ostensibly gets a lot of people dropping off their goodwill/ebay finds, she was resentful of the idea of a kid donning the styles of older generations. Not all people will see eye to eye on style, and vintage fans likely know this especially, but she was, frankly, quite rude with the delivery of her message, and it was totally unexpected from someone who fixes/tailors garments to please customers. Perhaps I was just very unlucky with this tailor.

Tiki Tom · Jun 5, 2018

Don’t take it personally. The other day I was getting an Rx filled at the pharmacy and the pharmacist saw fit to try to second guess my doctor. I’ve had butchers try to talk me out of a particular cut of meat. And let’s not even talk about auto mechanics. Still, they are all professionals in their areas and their opinions are good starting points for discussions and I usually learn something. However, at the end of the day I’m the paying customer and I either accept their recommendations or not. In the best case scenario such encounters are an opportunity to get to know your tailor and have a good discussion about a common interest in a friendly manner. But by all means, don’t get rail-roaded into something you don’t want.

Davy Crockett · Jun 5, 2018

There are lots of tailors out there, I believe they should only be interested in fit and not style as this is a personal thing, I'm sure you will not have commented on what she was wearing so if I were you I'd either find another tailor or contact some of the dealers in the style you like, there are plenty listed in the various threads on here. Rudeness is something that should never be tolerated, take your business to someone who will appreciate it.

Good luck.

D

GHT · Jun 5, 2018

A seamstress is not a tailor. There's a world of difference. The lining, seams, waistband, zipper and the rest are something that takes a long time to master, which is why a good tailor will have served an apprenticeship.
You saw, and commented on the way my wife unpicked a pair of sixties style tapered trousers, straightened out the taper, created a turned up cuff and made them more in the style that I prefer.

It was mature of you to hold your tongue, even though you didn't get your mother on your side, stiil being polite doesn't mean that you should allow yourself to be ridden roughshod over. When I was just a little older than you are now, to finance my studies whilst at college, I had a Saturday job in one of Singer sewing machine shops, where I learned many sewing related techniques. Sadly they no longer exist, but there are still ways and means, without spending much money that you can learn to do your own alterations.
You might find this thread helpful: https://www.thefedoralounge.com/threads/my-first-trouser-project.75321/

Edward · Jun 5, 2018

Friend of mine was getting married a decade or so ago. Haughty woman in the dress shop tried to order the bridesmaids into an unpleasant, mustard-coloured confection they didn't like, then wouldn't credit their objections. "As the professional here," said she, "I know these are the dresses for you." Said friend's mother, "As the person who is paying, no they aren't." They left and spent their money elsewhere.

scottyrocks · Jun 5, 2018

As GHT hinted at, this seamstress may very well not know how to do the alterations you wanted, due, possibly, to the unusualness of the garment - that is, the finer details of how it should look when done properly.

Then again, maybe she was just an opinionated ~!@#$%i who'd rather criticize than do business outside her comfort zone, or with someone she felt was a one-shot deal, or she she had a bad morning that AM.

Who knows. Anyway, there are plenty of fish in the sea, er, tailors on the boulevard.

MondoFW · Jun 5, 2018

Davy Crockett said:
There are lots of tailors out there, I believe they should only be interested in fit and not style as this is a personal thing, I'm sure you will not have commented on what she was wearing so if I were you I'd either find another tailor or contact some of the dealers in the style you like, there are plenty listed in the various threads on here. Rudeness is something that should never be tolerated, take your business to someone who will appreciate it.

Good luck.

D

Thanks for your support. Yep, I knew immediately that she wasn't the right person to be giving my business. I try to think the best in people, but her reaction was a little uncalled for. Oh well.

GHT said:
A seamstress is not a tailor. There's a world of difference. The lining, seams, waistband, zipper and the rest are something that takes a long time to master, which is why a good tailor will have served an apprenticeship.
You saw, and commented on the way my wife unpicked a pair of sixties style tapered trousers, straightened out the taper, created a turned up cuff and made them more in the style that I prefer.

It was mature of you to hold your tongue, even though you didn't get your mother on your side, stiil being polite doesn't mean that you should allow yourself to be ridden roughshod over. When I was just a little older than you are now, to finance my studies whilst at college, I had a Saturday job in one of Singer sewing machine shops, where I learned many sewing related techniques. Sadly they no longer exist, but there are still ways and means, without spending much money that you can learn to do your own alterations.
You might find this thread helpful: https://www.thefedoralounge.com/threads/my-first-trouser-project.75321/

Thank you for the response. Do you really think with enough time I could just learn to do the alterations myself? If so, sounds like the best thing for a last resort. For now, I'll try to find another alterations place in my neck of the woods.

Edward said:
Friend of mine was getting married a decade or so ago. Haughty woman in the dress shop tried to order the bridesmaids into an unpleasant, mustard-coloured confection they didn't like, then wouldn't credit their objections. "As the professional here," said she, "I know these are the dresses for you." Said friend's mother, "As the person who is paying, no they aren't." They left and spent their money elsewhere.

Mustard-colored? She must have been trying to get rid of that dress for years!

scottyrocks said:
As GHT hinted at, this seamstress may very well not know how to do the alterations you wanted, due, possibly, to the unusualness of the garment - that is, the finer details of how it should look when done properly.

Then again, maybe she was just an opinionated ~!@#$%i who'd rather criticize than do business outside her comfort zone, or with someone she felt was a one-shot deal, or she she had a bad morning that AM.

Who knows. Anyway, there are plenty of fish in the sea, er, tailors on the boulevard.

No, I'm thinking she knew how to do the alterations. What she was trying to say was that I was better off buying a new, modern, youthful pair of pants from [insert locations infamous for rubbish clothing], and that investing money and time into altering these "fogey" trousers were a waste. Then again, she could have been playing this card to get out of doing the alterations, but I'm still skeptical that she hasn't had countless geezers turn in their ancient double pleated trousers that are two generations removed, for the same reason I came in, ergo she would have some experience with the style. Who even knows

As for the bad day theory, maybe. Still a shallow way of basically rejecting service. As for being a one-shot deal, my mother made it clear to the woman that I was way into vintage (Mother was always worried I'd get beat up in the school grounds or 7-11 parking lot for my attire), which could have implied that I would be willing to be a return customer....on the account that the tailor wasn't insufferable

The cherry on top was that right before we were ready to walk out, she recommended that if I were really stupid enough to dress like David Niven's graverobber, I should go to Goodwill. Ironic.

scottyrocks · Jun 5, 2018

MondoFW said:
The cherry on top was that right before we were ready to walk out, she recommended that if I were really stupid enough to dress like David Niven's graverobber, I should go to Goodwill. Ironic.

haha, wow. Neeeext!

Benny Holiday · Jun 6, 2018

Totally unprofessional. Time to find a real tailor.

GHT · Jun 6, 2018

MondoFW said:
Thank you for the response. Do you really think with enough time I could just learn to do the alterations myself? If so, sounds like the best thing for a last resort. For now, I'll try to find another alterations place in my neck of the woods.

What's to stop you experimenting? For a few dollars you could buy a pair of thrift store pants, run off some how to instructions off the internet, using just a pair of scissors and a needle and thread, attempt your first alteration. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Benny Holiday said:
Totally unprofessional. Time to find a real tailor.

George Dyer takes some beating. He's been running his South London shop for well over 20 years. He's not cheap, but quality never is. But he is a fraction of the prices charged at Savile Row.
If Mondo resided in the UK he could buy a made to measure pair of trousers, to the exact style of his choice, with a wide choice of fabric, for just £125.00. That's about $168US.
Mondo, Savile Row, in the heart of London is world famous for Gentlemen's made to measure attire for the rich and famous. Savile Row is a street name, there are many tailors still working in Savile Row. Put it into Google and see what price they charge. If the price says plus VAT, that means value added tax. Add 20% meaning add £20 for every hundred, or £200 for every £1000.

Maybe one day when you rule the world you too can buy your suits there, but for now, there's always: Savvy Row.

MondoFW · Jun 6, 2018

GHT said:
What's to stop you experimenting? For a few dollars you could buy a pair of thrift store pants, run off some how to instructions off the internet, using just a pair of scissors and a needle and thread, attempt your first alteration. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

George Dyer takes some beating. He's been running his South London shop for well over 20 years. He's not cheap, but quality never is. But he is a fraction of the prices charged at Savile Row.
If Mondo resided in the UK he could buy a made to measure pair of trousers, to the exact style of his choice, with a wide choice of fabric, for just £125.00. That's about $168US.
Mondo, Savile Row, in the heart of London is world famous for Gentlemen's made to measure attire for the rich and famous. Savile Row is a street name, there are many tailors still working in Savile Row. Put it into Google and see what price they charge. If the price says plus VAT, that means value added tax. Add 20% meaning add £20 for every hundred, or £200 for every £1000.

Maybe one day when you rule the world you too can buy your suits there, but for now, there's always: Savvy Row.

I guess I'll have to take the plunge eventually. I do have a pair of pants I could Frankenstein on.

Savile Row's merchandise is not something I'll be donning for a looooong time, at least as a purchase made by me. My grandfather, 9 years before he died, got a bespoke suit from a Savile Row tailor, Anderson & Shepherd. It's dated 1985, but it isn't like the garbage styles that were popular in North America at the time, it's an elegant suit that's more akin to the styles he likely grew up with (he was born in 1908). It's sitting in a dry cleaner bag to shield it away from the elements, for now. But yeah, Savile is a name I'm familiar with.

Speaking of hot spots for the dandy, I know that Hong Kong had a powerful tailoring industry in the mid-20th century--what happened to that?

ChazfromCali · Jun 6, 2018

Sorry to hear that but I'm not surprised. I'd say get on the phone with some prospective tailors/seamstresses find one receptive to what you want to do.

I had a similar experience with a jacket. Older, I liked it, but from their reaction you'd think I was breaking some Inviolate Law of Modern Disposable Culture by wanting save it and wear it.

MondoFW · Jun 6, 2018

ChazfromCali said:
Sorry to hear that but I'm not surprised. I'd say get on the phone with some prospective tailors/seamstresses find one receptive to what you want to do.

I had a similar experience with a jacket. Older, I liked it, but from their reaction you'd think I was breaking some Inviolate Law of Modern Disposable Culture by wanting save it and wear it.

How old was the jacket? What was the tailor's actual reaction? You'd think these people would be more understanding of vintage fans' taste, seeing as they're attempting to preserve styles and practices from a time where men took more pride in their appearances, which is a lost art, at least in North America.

Michael A · Jun 6, 2018

A photo of you wearing the pants might be informative. Big and taper are words that are open to a lot of interpretation in tailoring. If they needed a lot of resizing work above the crotch line that runs into a lot of time, and hence money, quickly. And gets into the area of iffier results. Most seamstresses don't want to take on a job that they can't 100% guarantee success. Taking in the waist less than 2", or tapering the lower leg, or hemming are pretty straightforward. As an example I did these pants this morning, about 2" on the waist and shortened by about 3"

DSCN1770 crop by Michael A2012, on Flickr

DSCN1773 by Michael A2012, on Flickr

DSCN1776 by Michael A2012, on Flickr
As GHT said, hemming needs only a needle and thread and tape measure. And can easily be undone and redone if you don't like the results the first time. For other operations a sewing machine may be nice, but they are available at thrift stores for a reasonable price usually. I got two just last week for $10 each and one is a Bernina. Both worked fine. There are many good video tutorials available online to walk you through learning how to do simple alterations and how to use a sewing machine.

Many men's stores still have an in house alterations tailor and they usually take walk in trade. Better sorts of dry cleaners will have a blind hem machine and do hemming for a low price. Around here at least, most seamstresses primarily work with wedding dress alterations and other such things. They haven't the experience or any great willingness to work on men's clothing beyond hemming pants or shortening a jacket sleeve from the cuff.

Good luck,
Michael

Canadian · Jun 6, 2018

I actually had a bizarre experience at a seamstress yesterday.

I'm on my way to a conference which will be immediately followed by a family funeral. I had brought a pair of suit pants into a local seamstress and got the trousers back yesterday. She had instead of hemming the pants to 35 inches, she had taken the waist in to 35 inches, then told me it was my fault. Now, I have a 40 inch waist, and she had the nerve to charge me, then try to fix them which resulted in a repair which is clearly a repair.

I now own an orphaned DB PL suit jacket and a pair of trousers that may split the first time I bend over.

I will never go back to that seamstress. Not only did they mess up my pants, they actually charged me fifteen dollars for alterations.

Sadly, I chose a career which will never permit me to buy bespoke, but I do get a fair amount of access to good clothing of Ebay. Accept that certain items will be destroyed by people who don't understand what you want. Take that as a risk of buying and tailoring. If the seamstress does not have the same views as you, find another person. My grandfather made bespoke fur goods for a living, and he always advised me to seek out the input of a qualified tailor whenever making serious changes. Not the little girl at the corner dry cleaner.

C.

MondoFW · Jun 6, 2018

Canadian said:
I actually had a bizarre experience at a seamstress yesterday.

I'm on my way to a conference which will be immediately followed by a family funeral. I had brought a pair of suit pants into a local seamstress and got the trousers back yesterday. She had instead of hemming the pants to 35 inches, she had taken the waist in to 35 inches, then told me it was my fault. Now, I have a 40 inch waist, and she had the nerve to charge me, then try to fix them which resulted in a repair which is clearly a repair.

I now own an orphaned DB PL suit jacket and a pair of trousers that may split the first time I bend over.

I will never go back to that seamstress. Not only did they mess up my pants, they actually charged me fifteen dollars for alterations.

Sadly, I chose a career which will never permit me to buy bespoke, but I do get a fair amount of access to good clothing of Ebay. Accept that certain items will be destroyed by people who don't understand what you want. Take that as a risk of buying and tailoring. If the seamstress does not have the same views as you, find another person. My grandfather made bespoke fur goods for a living, and he always advised me to seek out the input of a qualified tailor whenever making serious changes. Not the little girl at the corner dry cleaner.

C.

That sounds awfully bizarre. So she took the waist in 5 inches? How is that even possible? Would that not throw off the proportions completely? I'm sorry to hear of your dismal experience.

What's annoying is that the the best alteration shops around me will likely be in Portland (a lot of reputable places concentrated in this one area in particular), which leads me to believe that I'd be spending a little more for alterations than I'd honestly like to. I wonder if this was a problem for kids in the Golden Era?

MondoFW · Jun 6, 2018

These are the only fit pics I can take at the moment. If they're too rubbish for y'all, I can retake them tomorrow afternoon.
The best photography you'll get from a 9-year-old. I find them too long, which is why I wanted to hem them.

Canadian · Jun 6, 2018

If you are having trouble finding an alternation shop, phone a soldier, preferably an officer. Not a policeman, an army officer if you know one. Many officers have their uniforms custom tailored, and tailoring/alteration shop around bases tend to be very high quality.

In the GE? Probably around here, kids only had work or casual school clothing and, if lucky or well heeled, some kind of church clothing for church only. If they were particularly well to do, and attended schooling, I would expect they typically wore OTR and had their mothers fix hems and minor holes. And if they needed a set of clothing to go out (see the movie Swing Kids, it's almost gospel for the swing scene here) they probably simply bought used clothing, or got it from fathers/brothers. People didn't have the luxury of being able to take in a jacket by an inch at the sleeves, they simply bought clothing and wore it. And I suspect, just as my parents were when I was younger, they ensured that my clothing fit before it came off the sale rack at Sears and into my closet. If it didn't fit perfectly at time of purchase (and I was well to do, just had frugal parents) I found, no matter how presentable, it was not welcomed into my clothing.

My parents did not indulge fads. I did not have jeans till Grade 5, and by Grade 10, was going "businessman" (as my friends called it). I didn't get into vintage until I started shopping on Ebay with my own CC and my own money.

That's just what I've seen in movies. I am sure there were extremely well to do children, who traveled and attended better schools than others, but aside from a few comedies, they are hard to examine.

C.

GHT · Jun 6, 2018

Canadian said:
I'm on my way to a conference which will be immediately followed by a family funeral. I had brought a pair of suit pants into a local seamstress and got the trousers back yesterday. She had instead of hemming the pants to 35 inches, she had taken the waist in to 35 inches, then told me it was my fault. Now, I have a 40 inch waist, and she had the nerve to charge me, then try to fix them which resulted in a repair which is clearly a repair.
I now own an orphaned DB PL suit jacket and a pair of trousers that may split the first time I bend over.
I will never go back to that seamstress. Not only did they mess up my pants, they actually charged me fifteen dollars for alterations.

She has obviously never heard the term, measure twice cut once. Tape measures have imperial on one side and metric on the other. Measure using both systems, if they don't match when you turn the tape measure over, measure again.
In the UK you could have asked The Trading Standards Officer to intervene. He would ask her for her details, such as her notes and calculations. If she failed to produce any, the officer would have judged in your favour. Any money paid would have to be returned and compensation granted at the total cost of the trousers. She could keep the trousers of course, having paid for their replacement.

Something similar happened to me some years ago. A fitted kitchen that I had paid quite a lot of money for, had a join part way along the work surface. The carpenter had cut it short, then bodged his own mistake expecting me to accept his shoddy work. Just the threat of Trading Standards Officer was enough to get the work surface replaced.

MondoFW · Jun 7, 2018

Does anyone know how many inches a tailor can taper pants? The bottom width of these are 9 inches, and a pair of 40's pants that fit me very well are 7 inches.

My First Experience at a Tailor--Not good!

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