B3 Redskin

[bburtner@moran]

This one is for Andrew,Eastman (used B3 redskin),decent price for one?Brian.

 

[aswatland]

Are you asking what is a decent price to buy one for? It depends on size and condition and could sell for £400 to £600. New ones are £800 now and will keep going up as the price of sheepskin continues to increase.

 

[bburtner@moran]

Thanks Andrew...The one I am watching is up to $805.00.

 

[aswatland]

Yes, its a very nice example with a custom Hookless zipper.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/b-3-jacket-...070?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d0449570e

 

[John Lever]

I know the seller of that jacket, he is 100 % solid.

 

[aswatland]

I know the seller of that jacket, he is 100 % solid.

That is a good endorsement John.

 

[aswatland]

It sold for $1,578.53, which must be a record for a repro B-3.

 

[rocketeer]

I have a few pics of a well worn Eastman B3 Roughwear.
This jacket is over 10 years old, has worn in all the right places to the point of being bald in the rubbing areas.
Though it is a fantastic jacket for quality and accuracy, I do not think the fleece outer finish will look the same as a wartime example. Take a close look at the crazing that comes with natural wear, no dry tumbling or false break in, just 10 years of natural wear.
Just to add to that statement, I dont think in another 40 years it will look the same as an original wartime example.
The Horse leather details may wear in a similar fashion but not the fleece outer.
Now saying all that, Eastmans early examples, and I mean really early jackets had a different finish, more accurate to an original. My advice, but I'm not anywhere near as knowledgeable as Andrew, is to hunt out one of these early jackts if it is authenticity you are looking for. Garry did used to number them inside the pocket.
I stopped buying replica WWII jackets with this jacket, I simply didn't need anymore. Now I live and die in Aero Civvy jackets during the not so cold spells.

 

[aswatland]

I think your ELC jacket has aged gracefully. You are right about the fleece. It does not appear to crack and flake like many originals. Howerver to most members of the public your jacket could easily be mistaken for an original wartime jacket.

 

[Edward]

Lack of cracking and flaking like the originals is a good thing, surely? I understand the desire for accuracy, but I'm happy to compromise on that level of accuracy for the sake of durability. That said, it's all horses for courses: My jackets are bought exclusively to be worn as regular wardrobe; if I was buying them as a collector, I might look at it from a different angle.

It sold for $1,578.53, which must be a record for a repro B-3.

Jinkies, the seller must be ecstatic over that! Is there something special about this particular repro, or is it just a case of auction fever? Even at today's prices (significantly up on when I last looked about three years ago), that's more than a new ELC would cost.

Hoping the price of sheepskin comes down. Can't afford it at the minute, but I'd eventually like to add a couple more sheepskins to my collection. not at this kind of price, though!

 

[aswatland]

A new one costs a penny less than £800, so this one went for over £100 more! The fact that it has a non standard repro Hookless zip may have helped to push up the price, but beyond that I'm at a loss to explain the OTT price!

 

[rocketeer]

I think your ELC jacket has aged gracefully. You are right about the fleece. It does not appear to crack and flake like many originals. Howerver to most members of the public your jacket could easily be mistaken for an original wartime jacket.

Thanks Andrew, the main difference is of course patina and a little dirt/ discolouration over the said years as most of us tend to 'baby' our jackets. Have you noticed the vast majority of used jackets from all makers tend to be advertised as 'Mint' or hardly worn?
I dont abuse my jackets but tend to wear them a lot when it's cold, sometimes around the house and in the car even though it has a heater.

Lack of cracking and flaking like the originals is a good thing, surely? I understand the desire for accuracy, but I'm happy to compromise on that level of accuracy for the sake of durability. That said, it's all horses for courses: My jackets are bought exclusively to be worn as regular wardrobe; if I was buying them as a collector, I might look at it from a different angle.

Hoping the price of sheepskin comes down. Can't afford it at the minute, but I'd eventually like to add a couple more sheepskins to my collection. not at this kind of price, though!

Unfortunately I have only ever seen the prices of things like this go up every now and then, not just clothing but everyday items. Maybe computers and some electronics, the price is high when new, i.e. Digital camera, but as the techy part improves and becomes cheaper, the higher tech object stays almost static, simply meaning better value for money. But when did a pair of Levi's actually get reduced in price because they are not now made in San Francisco but Turkey, or Indonesia.
Steel prices rose considerably a couple of years back, the price they would give you for an average scrap car differs each week, but the prices of objects made from steels seems static, then only to rise. Ten years back I had to pay £30 for a car to be collected for scrap, had I taken it to the salvage yard it would have given me £30-35, saving me the collection fee.
(just using the above as an example for up and down pricing)
John

 

[ButteMT61]

Based on bad descriptions on eBay, how many people buy a repop thinking it's original?
That's just stupid. Now, an exception: I find a perfectly worn in or new /almost new Good Wear online. It will fit based on the numbers. I want it now, not 15-18 months. I'd pay more than Na new one for that. People often do. Otherwise, um, no.

 

[rocketeer]

Based on bad descriptions on eBay, how many people buy a repop thinking it's original?
That's just stupid. Now, an exception: I find a perfectly worn in or new /almost new Good Wear online. It will fit based on the numbers. I want it now, not 15-18 months. I'd pay more than Na new one for that. People often do. Otherwise, um, no.

I almost did once, fantastic looking jacket, advertised a WWII A2, after about a novels worth description featuring every film known such as Great Escape, 12 Oclock High and Memphis bell etc even a peace campaigner could have become a jacket collector Then in the text way at the bottom was the description "Genuine WWII authentic jacket Beacon NY. Then I remembered a chat with Ken a Lot of years back When Gary Eastman made a few jackets with that label. Yes the seller did admit it was not original WWII but then he never claimed it was, just a clever use of the word Authentic.
Would I pay more for a used example of something hard to come by. Yes if I wanted it bad enough. How about a new Norton Cafe racer? Thats a bike rather than a jacket, there like rocking horse poop.

 

[Edward]

A new one costs a penny less than £800, so this one went for over £100 more! The fact that it has a non standard repro Hookless zip may have helped to push up the price, but beyond that I'm at a loss to explain the OTT price!

Possibly... Alternatively, I suppose, it could have been somebody who figured that was quicker and easier than paying for one to ship from the UK, plus the import taxes....? Still, it's amazing how out of hand bidding on eBay can get. A decade ago, I bought a "Fight Club Style" jacket - a close-to-repro of the red-with-white-accents cafe racer Brad Pitt wears in one sequence i Fight Club. When it arrived, the quality was appalling. This was long before I discovered Aero, ELC etc and became cursed with very expensive tastes in leather, but even so I had a fair level of experience then with utilitarian, modern bike leathers which are available at a very reasonable quality level for a hundred pounds and less. For GBP150, ASOS sent me something you could have spit through. It went right back in the return post, and I wrote the six pounds off as a learning experience. Wouldn't you know, the next week one sold for over GBP250 on eBay after a bidding war between two people clearly too dim to run a Google search (at the tie the same jacket was all over the web at GBP150 a pop). I briefly regretted not risking it on eBay with a high reserve, but to be honest I think I'd only have felt guilty taking the poor bugger's money...

Thanks Andrew, the main difference is of course patina and a little dirt/ discolouration over the said years as most of us tend to 'baby' our jackets. Have you noticed the vast majority of used jackets from all makers tend to be advertised as 'Mint' or hardly worn?
I dont abuse my jackets but tend to wear them a lot when it's cold, sometimes around the house and in the car even though it has a heater.

Some of them cold be exaggerations, though we're all such (as dear Stewart at LW would put it) "jacket queens" that it wouldn't be the first time somebody bought one that never got worn, or that they sold because that one tiny detail niggled so much.... lol

Unfortunately I have only ever seen the prices of things like this go up every now and then, not just clothing but everyday items. Maybe computers and some electronics, the price is high when new, i.e. Digital camera, but as the techy part improves and becomes cheaper, the higher tech object stays almost static, simply meaning better value for money. But when did a pair of Levi's actually get reduced in price because they are not now made in San Francisco but Turkey, or Indonesia.

Yeah, it'll be up to stay up. I hope not to rise again until inflation catches up! IT's a shame - I'd love a Redskin B3, but as I already have a LW model and an ELC 42 pattern Irvin, it really isn't necessary at all, purely an indulgence. My real gripe is that it's pushed the used market up. There are occasionally people on eBay now looking for an Aero the kind of money that they probably actually paid new.... sometimes even getting it. I've been priced out of most new ELC stuff now; hopefully used items won't follow!

Based on bad descriptions on eBay, how many people buy a repop thinking it's original?

Possible. I've seen some poorly worded ads in the past... I've also seen others which use language creatively to the point where if you really do read it all, you know it's a repro, but it seems to me designed to catch out those who are less vigilant but in a way the seller can still shrug off the blame later on. Used to be a guy I remember did that with pre-printed autographs and some very creative use of differently sized fonts.... I was surprised eBay didn't run him off (may still be on there for all I know) - about half his feedback was negative, full of people who'd thought they were buying real autographs, everyone of them responded to by him in abusive tones like "It says pre-printed in the auction, IDIOT! Ca't you read, Douche?" and so on. I like to believe Karma will bite those people in the rear eventually - especially if it's expensive flying jackets. More commonly what I see are ALCs being sold by the unknowledgeable as "Genuine RAF Irvin!" - I don't think they are trying to pass them off as wartime issue, but it's amazing how many people appear to think that their official status means they are contemporary, or even accurate repros!

That's just stupid. Now, an exception: I find a perfectly worn in or new /almost new Good Wear online. It will fit based on the numbers. I want it now, not 15-18 months. I'd pay more than Na new one for that. People often do. Otherwise, um, no.

I can see that too. Especially for a hardcore re-enactor who has a big event coming up...

even a peace campaigner could have become a jacket collector

Some already are.

Then in the text way at the bottom was the description "Genuine WWII authentic jacket Beacon NY. Then I remembered a chat with Ken a Lot of years back When Gary Eastman made a few jackets with that label. Yes the seller did admit it was not original WWII but then he never claimed it was, just a clever use of the word Authentic.

Barnum would have had a field day if he'd had access to eBay.

 

[rocketeer]

More commonly what I see are ALCs being sold by the unknowledgeable as "Genuine RAF Irvin!" - I don't think they are trying to pass them off as wartime issue, but it's amazing how many people appear to think that their official status means they are contemporary, or even accurate repros! .

I take it ALC is Aviation Leathercraft rather than Aero Leather Clothing. As Aviation LC has the rights to the name, they are entitled to produce an Irvin in pink sheepskin with tassles and describe it as a genuine Irvin. As it is they produce a brown sheepskin with hand warmer pockets that most sports car drivers enthusiasts call a flying jacket.

 

[ButteMT61]

I think many being sold as "vintage WWII" jackets are honest mistakes. Most folks don't research an item too much. I know enought to (barely) be safe in auctions, but still ask experts if need be. Money is harder to part with than ego lol