Rebellion...

[The Wingnut]

I'll try to make this short, as I have a tendency to write in the fashion of Tolstoy if I'm not careful.

I figured out one of the main reasons I dress in vintage, and it was pretty aparrent to me last night. I'm rebelling....not so much against authority, but against my own age group.

When I travel, I dress well. I find that you're treated with an extra measure of courtesy. I had a short hop from Portland to Sacramento, and was told no less than three times, 'nice hat'. Of course, I was wearing my best suit, one of my favorite ties and a pair of oxfords shined to mirror perfection, but the hat was what got the attention.

I noticed most people in my age bracket 20-30 were dressed either trendily or sloppily(which isn't necessarily mutually exclusive), and I got the hardest stares from them. One girl in particular made and broke eye contact three times while I was walking toward her. I finally held the stare and she turned away completely.

Is it intimidating, impressive, or just weird? Maybe a combination? It's probably different things to many people. I noticed one small group of young men laughing after I passed them. No outright derision, but I could tell the laughter was triggered by my manner of dress.

I've got to the point where I avoid eye contact and just set my jaw and look as if I know where I'm going and what I'm doing. I suppose I do it partly for the attention, as well, but it's more of a middle finger in the face of my generation for being such disprespectful slobs. Call me arrogant, you're probably right.

Just an observation from a rebel...

 

[Mr. 'H']

I concur.

 

[jamespowers]

I think you are probably right. It is a part of not wanting to be "in" or trendy but to be an individual.
Sociology tells us that the clothes evoke a reaction from people that is learned. The wearing of a white lab coat in a commercial for some pharmaceutical tells us that this is a doctor or a researcher who knows what they are talking about but it is just a white lab coat. The dufus could be an actor who just finished serving a table at lunch. It is about the reaction it evokes.
Dressing well implies that one is rich, an executive or an important person. Today that is usually not what we are looking for. The rich are impugned. They try to "blend in" by dressing like slobs as well now to avoid the stigma. You are giving it to them with both hands when you dress like that and don't care about the reaction you get. Likely it will be: "who does he think he is?"
This is just the opposite of what it used to be before. The regular people dressed and groomed so they would not be thought of as poor or low class. They didn't want to be thought of as a bum or as slovenly. They wanted to appear rich even though they weren't. If they only owned one suit it was good enough to keep up "appearances."
I suppose now the attitude has changed from Horatio Alger to one of Upton Sinclair. Even Octavian lived to be nearly eighty by appearing to be pious and poor as emperor. His appearance didn't make people feel like he was superior you see.
The funny thing is that most people can afford to look nice. They choose to look bummy. They just can't understand how you could choose to look dressed and neat. In that sense they are feeling the finger.

Regards to all,

J

 

[Andykev]

I think is the Class vs. NO Class

Remember when we all sat down at McCovey's in Walnut Creek? We all wore hats, and Jamespowers' friend (sorry I forgot his name) was the best dressed at the table. I had my fedora, as did Art, MK,..well ALL of us. The waiter made it a point to ask if we were, what? a club or movie or whatever it was. See, we looked sharp.

So, I have long ago become thick skinned. Used to worry about wearing my hat to work. Well, five years and every day, no one gives me a second look now.'

Is it rebellion? Maybe your feelings are that. I have seen the Wingnut in person. He dresses to perfection!

 

[Lauren]

Good for you. Don't give them the satifaction of acting like them- even in rebellion.
:clap

 

[MK]

?

Hey Wingnut! How come you were in my town and didn't even look me up? What brought you to Portland?

 

[The Wingnut]

*affects Mafioso voice* Fambily.

Seriously, though, I was in Alsea (near Waldport, which is about 40 minutes west of Corvallis) for Thanksgiving. Only flew in and out of Portland. I spent the last two days on the Warm Springs Indian Reservation, and came over Mount Hood to get to Portland. We had chains on for most of that drive.

Spent all my time tending to family. Spent a few days at OSU making composite armor samples, went elk hunting, worked on Dad's '58 Willys Utility Van, went up 4-wheeling in the Coast Range. Pretty busy.

 

[Zemke Fan]

What an interesting thread...

Wingnut, thanks for articulating your feelings about this subject... Isn't it strange that with ALL of the craziness in the world (especially here in the U-S-of-A) a young man dressed well (albeit vintage) would be the source of such derision and a teenager with purple hair, 12 visible piercings, and a roll-of-flab showing at her exposed midriff is all but invisible?

I went to a black-tie event last night in Washington and you should have seen the crowd. (Read my thread about Senators Stevens and Inouye and the American patriot award for details.) The men were either in black tie or dress uniforms. There were dozens of service-women also in their best and civilian women dressed to kill. It reminded me again that SOME things in America ARE still respected by SOME people. I don't know how many people last night disagree with our Nation's political posture, but I guarantee you that every single one of the 500+ support our men and women in Iraq and elsewhere who daily put their lives on the line so that the rest of America can dress any way they damn-well please.

 

[Braxton36]

Good point!

I'm constantly amazed at what people will wear out of the privacy of their own home. Clothes that I wouldn't wear to work in the yard have now become travelling clothes.

I actually grew up being taught that you "dressed up" to travel on an airplane, train, or to go downtown.

I travel quite a bit on business and I tend - comfort aside - to always wear at least a tie and blazer if not a suit. I find I get better service all the way around. And, it's a lot easier to express righteous indignation if you're at least dressed like you have the potential for being a jackass.

 

[flat-top]

I've always said this: people mock what they don't understand. I have been dressing in full on vintage forever, and have gotten my share of stares, looks, chortles, giggles, comments, etc, from people my own age, while the older folks always compliment me and my style. That's because they get it. Although last week, I wore a two tone "Hollywood" or leisure jacket to work and got TONS of compliments from all kinds of people! It was a strange change of pace, and I went home feeling great! It's amazing how weird it felt to be "accepted". The only time I feel truly appreciated is when I go to something like Viva Las Vegas!
Rebels RULE!!
flat-top

 

[Sefton]

Even one small seemingly insignificant item can do it. I rarely wear anything like a suit. I am often hatless. A-2 and khaki pants, leather dress shoes. Not dressed up at all. Now if I put on a tie it throws people off...it's as if they can't imagine anyone wearing a tie without a suit and outside of a business situation. Back in the golden era men often wore a tie in less than formal occasions. Long gone are the days when the milkman,postman,gas station attendant, etc. wore one.

You don't have to make much of an effort nowadays. Simply wearing a pair of pants with a waist located at your waist is a start!

 

[scotrace]

You hit it

...I've got to the point where I avoid eye contact and just set my jaw and look as if I know where I'm going and what I'm doing...

It's all in the attitude. Look like dressing as you do is the most natural and desirable thing in the world. Cultivate a ready smile and willingness to laugh. Be interested and interesting. Work on good posture, graceful carriage, confident air. And always keep in mind that those slouchy slobs will be serving french fries to your grandchildren...

 

[Senator Jack]

Well this is a never-ending thread now, isn't it? So being that we're on this subject again, it's as good a place as any to give my latest report from New York.

The other night I went to see Max Raabe and the Palast Orchester, a 1920s/30s jazz orchestra from Germany. The show was beautiful, dazzling, and elegant. The crowd, not so much. I hadn't been to Carnegie Hall in over a decade, and I was appalled at what people showed up in. T-shirts. Jeans. Sneakers. Without dubiety, my friend and I were the best dressed people there, and that's hard to believe considering the sort of people who go to Carnegie Hall on a regular basis have far more money than I will ever make in my life. I guess in our own way, we were giving a finger to the rich, and I have to say it felt good.

The kicker is, to my thinking I wasn't really wearing anything that special. A black pinstripe suit, black shirt, white bowtie, pocket silk. My friend had on a white fringed dress and sport a fur cape (real or not, I don't know) At intermission, people inspected us like a project at a science fair. They smiled, dipped their heads, made conferring noises. After the show, a reporter asked for our comments, saying 'I saw you two in there and just had to talk to you.' I was going to say something about the crowd but bit my tongue. They wouldn't have showed it anyway.

Funny, I've been wearing vintage a long time and its only in the last few years that people have begun to treat me like I'm some sort of big shot. I think the crowd has become so far removed from any age of elegance that they don't remember anything about it - it's a dim recollection at best. 'Oh yeah, people used to care about how they looked. That's right.'

By the way, should the orchestra return and tour near you, do make every effort to attend. It was by far the best concert I had attended in a long time.


Regards,

Senator jack

 

[Vladimir Berkov]

I got to see Max Raabe and the Palast Orchester when they played in San Antonio last year. They were incredible as you said, the best concert I have ever been to I think. After the concert I even got to go to a party with Max and the band so it was a truly spectacular evening. Most of the crowd that I remember was dressed fairly well, the people who were at the party were mainly wearing suits and ties or sportcoats and ties.