Gibson and Barnes Expedition

[westinghouse]

I am going to order this jacket in either goatskin or lambskin. Is there anybody who owns one who can chime in as to the benefits of either material?

-thank you

 

[Andykev]

My opinion

"Baaaaa" or "Maaaaaa"

I have the A-2 Goat Skin. Soft and nice. I recommend it.

I don't remember, but I think it was "Vegetable tanned" and not the "Chrome" tanning. Lost the receipt a long time ago.

 

[bobjones]

I am going to order this jacket in either goatskin or lambskin. Is there anybody who owns one who can chime in as to the benefits of either material?

-thank you

I had the goatskin, and its a superb and superbly made jacket. If I didn't have to wear a suit every day - and had more opportunities to wear a leather jacket - I'd still have it. I sold it as I have 2 Aeros and finding time to wear them is a huge challenge as it is.

I never handled the lambskin jacket, only their samples, but heard it was also a fantastic, lighter weight version of the goat. Check out obi-wan forum for FAR, FAR more details, they are indy jacket experts there...

 

[Seb Lucas]

Go the goat. Tough, water resistant, doesn't tear. I have a goat Expo and it is one of the best, strongest leather jackets I have owned. I have had dozens and many custom made jobs.

Goat is tougher than lamb and almost as soft. G&B are known to have some of the best goat you can get.

Give it a wash in the machine when you get it to stop it looking stiff and new.

They are light compared to an Aero HH jacket but still pretty heavy and substantial. My 42T goat weighs 1.8 kilos (3.6 pounds).

The only hitch for me with the Expo is that it doesn't have leather sidings along the zip. Just like the film version and a bit like most A2's. I prefer sidings to give the jacket a more structured and substantial feel. A personal preference only.

Seb

 

[JanSolo]

Try to get G&B's vegetable tanned goatskin which is even nicer (but unfortunately much more expensive). I once bought a discounted jacket from them they labeled as brand new. When I received it it was obviously pre owned (Porsche service receipt found in inner pocket )and in the wrong size. As a compensation they said they would make any jacket in any leather for me. I went with a mil-spec G1 in russet veg tanned goatskin which was absolutely lovely!

 

[Nebraska Schulte]

I actually drove to Gibson & Barnes last fall to look at both a lambskin and goatskin of the Expedition. I had already made my mind up beforehand that I wanted the goatskin because of its durability. The lambskin was very nice: a buttery feel to it, and a lighter shade of brown. It's well-built for a lambskin. But for durability, the goatskin is the way to go. I've been very happy with my goatskin expedition over the past half year. This thing is by far the most comfortable jacket I've owned in that it fits so well, is quite light for leather, and I hardly notice I'm wearing it. I can wear it here in southern California most of the time right now, and have worn it with a sweater underneath during Christmas break in Nebraska.

Hope this is of some assistance.

Best wishes,
NS

 

[Doctor Strange]

I don't have an Expedition (I've got a Wested lambskin Raiders for the Indy thing!), but I have two G&B goatskin jackets: a black Civil A-2 I got in 2001, and a seal brown Historical M-422A vintage 2005.

Both are incredibly solid jackets that have held up beautifully. There are different finishes on the hides, but both are quite supple yet very tough. They shrug off rain and snow, and are nearly impossible to scratch or scuff. The A-2 is showing some fading on the epaulets and storm flap, but the M-422A still looks nearly new. (I also briefly had a US Wings goatskin Indy, and it was a less refined jacket: its goatskin was less supple, less nicely pebble-grained, and more heavily pigmented than the G&B jackets.)

Anyway, G&B's goatskin is great stuff, I'm sure you'll be happy with it.

(I'm sure their lambskin is very good too, but it's a thinner, more fragile hide. Unless you specifically want a lighter jacket for warmer weather, don't choose it. The back panel on my Wested Raiders actually got caught on my car door and tore, which would never have happened with goatskin. [Wested repaired it FOR FREE, but that's another story!])

 

[rmrdaddy]

+1 on the goat.

I have a second hand G&B Raider jacket that I purchased from a Lounger a year and a half ago or so. The hide still looks like new, great stuff.

 

[Seb Lucas]

This thing is by far the most comfortable jacket I've owned in that it fits so well, is quite light for leather, and I hardly notice I'm wearing it. I can wear it here in southern California most of the time right now, and have worn it with a sweater underneath during Christmas break in Nebraska.

Hope this is of some assistance.

Best wishes,
NS

Curious. It's not light for leather. I find it fairly heavy - not compared to Aero (which is why I don't have one of them) but heavy and cumbersom as soon as there is any sunshine. Many leather jackets are made from a lighter hide. The expo is heavy on your shoulders and I can only wear one properly in winter.

 

[Nebraska Schulte]

Curious. It's not light for leather. I find it fairly heavy - not compared to Aero (which is why I don't have one of them) but heavy and cumbersom as soon as there is any sunshine. Many leather jackets are made from a lighter hide. The expo is heavy on your shoulders and I can only wear one properly in winter.

To me, it felt lighter than this Cabela's jacket of a similar style which I had owned:

My use of the term "light" is just relative to my previous experience with the Cabela's jacket, as well as comments I've heard here and at COW comparing the Expedition to the U.S. Wings Indy-style jacket in cowhide. Perhaps "thinner" would be a more accurate term--but it's certainly not flimsy. The construction of the Expedition is much more solid than that of my former jacket. But I've been able to wear the Expedition comfortably in warmer temperatures than I used to wear the Cabela's jacket.

Because of this, I've worn the Expedition a lot more here in southern California than I ever did the other jacket. I've been just fine wearing the Expedition when walking a couple of miles in temperatures that have been into the upper 60's/lower 70's. I myself don't think of it as just a winter jacket (but by "winter" I think of winter in Nebraska, not the moderate rainy season here in southern California called "winter").



best wishes,
Nebraska Schulte

 

[Zaxxon]

I am not so fond of the goatskin as everybody else seems to be.
I have a German Airforce jacket in goat and to my believe it does not brake in nicely. Indiana Jones type jackets (imho) have to have a nice patina so I went for the Wested jacket in "Novapelle" steerhide which I find very nice.
If I had the choice of goat vs. lamb, I'd take the lamb (as the original movie jackets were as well).

Anyway, a nice jacket to have,
Zaxxon

 

[JanSolo]

Hi Zaxxon,

if it's one of the original issued German Airforce jackets the hide does have a ridiculously thick spray finish. It feels almost like plastic and will never break in. I don't think that the german issued jacket is really representative for goatskin in general. It very much depends on how the hide is processed and what tanning method was used... just my two cents.

 

[westinghouse]

I bought the Expedition, tried it on, then immediately shipped it straight back to G & B. I just didn't like the "pleather" look of the hide.

 

[Seb Lucas]

I am not so fond of the goatskin as everybody else seems to be.
I have a German Airforce jacket in goat and to my believe it does not brake in nicely. Indiana Jones type jackets (imho) have to have a nice patina so I went for the Wested jacket in "Novapelle" steerhide which I find very nice.
If I had the choice of goat vs. lamb, I'd take the lamb (as the original movie jackets were as well).

Anyway, a nice jacket to have,
Zaxxon

The latest infromation is that the key jackets were oil-pulled calf, not lamb. Two were made by Neil Cooper (not Wested) and one of these was the main hero jacket.

To me this just goes to show that the quest to get something just like it is in the movies is elusive and somewhat futile. Huge debates now rage over this somewhat banal fact.

 

[Zaxxon]

@Jan: You might be right with the finish, I bet that it's more than on a civilian jacket. Anyway I think I read somewhere that one of the reasons of the trend in military jackets towards goat skin nowadays is the fact that goat does not break in so much as steer/cowhide does and an old goatskin jacket of my youth shows no folding either.
Might be interesting to see some pictures of older goatskin A2 or so in this thread.


@Seb: I am totally with you. The quest for superauthentic film gear is pointless (at least for me). Thats why I decided for the Novapelle and not for an "as authentic as possible" jacket. I just think an Indy jacket has to show wear to have style. Oilpulled might be a very good choice as well.

Regards,
Zaxxon

 

[Doug C]

The latest infromation is that the key jackets were oil-pulled calf, not lamb. Two were made by Neil Cooper (not Wested) and one of these was the main hero jacket.

Seb, how'd this latest developement come to light ?

As for the debate for goat vs lamb... it comes down to your philosophy regarding the jacket. Go with LAMB if you lean more towards the authenticity side, you want it to age and look distressed eventually (less than forever), you're not overly afraid of it tearing (most don't tear). In other words, if you want it to look roughed up and like you don't give a crap - just like Harrison's in raiders. Would be my choice.

Go with GOAT if you're wanting a jacket that looks new a lot longer (these tend to take years and years to show any wear) - some folks like this in an Indy jacket because it looks better in their mind for wearing with semi-business attire. Also, the goat will resists rain better than the lamb, again if you're looking for less wear.

Doug C

 

[Seb Lucas]

The info came from COW where one of the senior contributers there is a fan and a finance guy for George Lucas. The story is best read over there, but suffice it to say the info came direct from Neil Cooper, the written Lucas film records, including the testimony of key costuming staff for Raiders.

 

[Doug C]

..take that with a grain of salt.

 

[Duck]

Goat!! I have the G & B an love it. To me, goat is the best for both light weight and durability.

 

[Seb Lucas]

..take that with a grain of salt.

Ah, nailing your colours the the mast, Doug... that's the spirit. I actually believe that the information is accurate, but I know it upsets many.

Anyway, I don't give toss about the actual film jacket, however, as I don't play dress ups or need to exactly duplicate the look of a fictional character. All I ever wanted was a similar jacket, only well made and of goat. G&B and USW fit the bill.