Work and the dress down code

[Fletch]

There are still some of us that do not expect everything for nothing. There are still some of us that were spanked as children

Uh, I hate to take the bloom off your breeches here, young fellow, but you are drawing connections where none exist.

If not, do you think those who missed out on childhood spanking might benefit from getting a good beating about the head and shoulders as grownups?

 

[John in Covina]

Uh, I hate to take the bloom off your breeches here, young fellow, but you are drawing connections where none exist. If not, do you think those who missed out on childhood spanking might benefit from getting a good beating about the head and shoulders as grownups?

********
Are you saying that the abatement of the discipline of children does not exist?
OR if it does it has made no difference in their upbringing and value system?

 

[Fletch]

Neither. I am saying that disciplining your children and paddling them are two different things. Neither necessarily follows from the other.

 

[bigshoe]

Spanking and discipline may be two different things but any adult who shows up to a job interview with his parents could use a dope slap on the back of the head.
To defend some of the millenials many of my employees over the years have been students. A lot of them are now in the service and some have returned and are carrying on with life work and school. I have never had one of the described problem children. Maybe it is a Wyoming thing or a rural thing but I still know young adults who call their elders and strangers Sir and hold a door open for ladies at the mini-mart.
Tom

 

[ShooShooBaby]

oops.... posted in the wrong thread... i think.

 

[Feraud]

oops.... posted in the wrong thread... i think.

Not at all. Post away!

 

[Fletch]

Yes, we could use a few more comments about workplace attire, especially...

For my part, I just hate it that a tie and coat or a dress and heels have been turned into uncomfortable costumes - visual shorthand as in "I'm a Mac" and "I'm a PC."

Half a century ago "PC" would have been Gregory Peck as The Man in the Grey Flannel Suit, stiff and off-the-rack, and "Mac" would be Cary Grant in North By Northwest, clever and custom-fitted. That distinction has been lost.

 

[Lulu-in-Ny]

Yes, we could use a few more comments about workplace attire, especially...

For my part, I just hate it that a tie and coat or a dress and heels have been turned into uncomfortable costumes - visual shorthand as in "I'm a Mac" and "I'm a PC."

Half a century ago "PC" would have been Gregory Peck as The Man in the Grey Flannel Suit, stiff and off-the-rack, and "Mac" would be Cary Grant in North By Northwest, clever and custom-fitted. That distinction has been lost.

What a great connection; I never even thought about it. I mean, those commercials are irritating anyway, but now they'll annoy me even more.

 

[Matt Deckard]

There is the one ad where Mac goes to work.

 

[Crane's]

Strange. I try to dress for whatever situation awaits me for the day at hand. If that means a suit and tie then that's what I'll wear. If the day calls for boots, shorts and a tee shirt then that is what I'll wear. Funny thing is I was never told I was under dressed for an occasion. I have been told that I was over dressed though. Never could figure that one out.

 

[Ben]

Comfort Factor

My guess is that the trend towards business casual has a lot to do with comfort.

People claim they are not comfortable in formal clothes. I think it is because people do not know how to buy clothes that fit and most retailers don't know how to fit them. That's why a lot of folks where baggy, shapeless clothes.

Just take shirts and ties as one example. My college roommate was about six four and had an average build. One day we were going to a formal function where we were going to wear ties and the shirt he was trying to put on had a 14 inch neck! I loaned him one of mine at 16 or 16 and a half.

Since college I have put on some weight and was at a store where I wanted to try on a shirt. The woman wouldn't let me take a shirt back in the dressing room until she measured my neck.

Now, I am six-four, six-five and a shade under 200lbs. She measures the middle of my neck, not my collar, at 15 inches. I told her there was no way that was my neck measurement. She insisted, so I handed the shirt back to her and said 'Have a nice day.'

So, if that is what is happening, to people, can you blame them for not wanting to feel strangled all day?

 

[John in Covina]

My guess is that the trend towards business casual has a lot to do with comfort. People claim they are not comfortable in formal clothes. I think it is because people do not know how to buy clothes that fit and most retailers don't know how to fit them. That's why a lot of folks where baggy, shapeless clothes. Just take shirts and ties as one example. My college roommate was about six four and had an average build. One day we were going to a formal function where we were going to wear ties and the shirt he was trying to put on had a 14 inch neck! I loaned him one of mine at 16 or 16 and a half. So, if that is what is happening, to people, can you blame them for not wanting to feel strangled all day?

*******************
There is a lot of truth in the fact that so many people get dress shirts with way too tight collars and it is a horrible feeling to be choked a day. Getting a looser collar makes it much better!

A lot of things have changed in the construction of clothes, the quality of materials and the design to make wearing a modern suit or sport jacket uncomfortable since you can't move in them.

 

[ShoreRoadLady]

Originally posted by John in Covina:
There is a lot of truth in the fact that so many people get dress shirts with way too tight collars and it is a horrible feeling to be choked a day. Getting a looser collar makes it much better!

A lot of things have changed in the construction of clothes, the quality of materials and the design to make wearing a modern suit or sport jacket uncomfortable since you can't move in them.

Yep. I can't speak for menswear, but women's clothing has gone down the tubes as far as sizing/comfort goes.

Remember, clothing billed as "ready to wear" right out of the store is a very modern thing. Prior to the advent of mass-produced clothing, people made their own clothes or had them made to fit them, and them alone. Most ordinary women had the skills to alter and re-make clothing; if they didn't, they were rich enough to get some other skilled person to do it for them. Even when RTW was available, e.g. the 1920s-1940s, many women sewed anyway, for various reasons. So, to expect mass-produced clothing to fit all women - of various shapes, sizes, and stylistic expectations - is ludicrous. Which is why there are subtle sizing differences between brands. But there's not *enough* differences, IMHO. I sew, because I'm so hard to fit, and so picky about the styles & colors I like. And the clothes I really want are out of my price range!

I was going to tie this into workplace clothing somehow. Oh well, doesn't matter anyway.

I do pity you men who wear ties. I love the way they look with a suit, but I tried one once. It wasn't even tied tightly, but I hated the feeling. I mean, even *kids* know you're not supposed to tie knots around your neck!

 

[PenMan]

Ties are not really uncomfortable, in fact not at all if the shirt fits correctly. This time of year, as the weather gets colder, I wear a tie quite a bit because you retain a bit more heat than with an open shirt. So on the one hand, ties don't detract from comfort if the shirt fits, and on the other, they add to comfort in a cool environment.

I teach in a typical postgraduate environment, meaning the majority is pretty informal, with some being sloppy. A few of us have instituted Tie Tuesday (this being said in response to a post a while back asking why we don't have formal Tuesday if we have casual Friday). This seems to be working pretty well.

If you want to see at least one person's response to the very real benefits of dressing like a professional, you might find the article here interesting: http://chronicle.com/jobs/news/2008/01/2008012501c/careers.html

By the way, I reject the 'dressing up' vs. 'dressing down' distinction. I don't wear a costume, and I don't 'dress up'. But I do wear quality clothes in a classic style, that match.

 

[Diamondback]

@Miss ShoreRoad: This is why they used to make something called a "Tie It Once", which also had the fringe benefit that if anything pulled your tie too hard, since the tie was all in front and these two plastic things go under the collar, the gadget was designed to act as a "breakaway fitting", ensuring that whatever got your tie didn't succeed in choking you with it. (They worked--I had some schmuck try to strangle me on a jr.-high class trip and all he got was a handful of tie for his trouble... and some embarrassing aftermath.)

Saw 'em at Totes outlets in the mid-'90s, but can't seem to find anything like 'em anywhere anymore...

 

[miss_elise]

i like a tie - especially with a windsor knot...it's comforting and secure...although you do have to wear a proper shirt, with a proper collar, not a wimpy ladies shirt...


plus, the other thing a lot of men don't realise is the difference between a business shirt and a dress shirt, and therefore confusion reigns...

 

[Tango Yankee]

plus, the other thing a lot of men don't realise is the difference between a business shirt and a dress shirt, and therefore confusion reigns...

Well, you just confused me! I've not even heard of a "business shirt" before. [huh] What is the difference between a business shirt and a dress shirt?

Regards,
Tom

 

[Big Man]

Reminds me of a story ...

... the tie was all in front and these two plastic things go under the collar, the gadget was designed to act as a "breakaway fitting", ensuring that whatever got your tie didn't succeed in choking you with it ...

I work in a state mental hospital. We get surveyors from various regulatory agencies in here all the time. Most of them are fine folks, but every once and a while we get some real s***heads that like to try to flaunt their "power" way too much.

On one such occasion we had a real dip-wad of a surveyor here. He wanted to really make a point about the "dangers" in our hospital (he probabally still sleeps with his mommy when he goes home - you know the kind). There were a number of us from hospital management in the conference room with him for his closing. He had belittled us up one side and down the other about the "dangerous conditions" in the hospital. Then he looked over at me and said, "Is that tie you are wearing a break away tie? I could use that tie to choke you if it isn't break away."

Well, I'd had about all I could stand from this pin-head, so I stand up, lean over to him, look down at him right in the eyes and say, "Why don't you try to choke me and we'll see what "breaks away" first."

That was the end of the harrassment from that surveyor. Oh yeah, we passed the survey, too.

 

[mike]

I work in a state mental hospital. We get surveyors from various regulatory agencies in here all the time. Most of them are fine folks, but every once and a while we get some real s***heads that like to try to flaunt their "power" way too much.

On one such occasion we had a real dip-wad of a surveyor here. He wanted to really make a point about the "dangers" in our hospital (he probabally still sleeps with his mommy when he goes home - you know the kind). There were a number of us from hospital management in the conference room with him for his closing. He had belittled us up one side and down the other about the "dangerous conditions" in the hospital. Then he looked over at me and said, "Is that tie you are wearing a break away tie? I could use that tie to choke you if it isn't break away."

Well, I'd had about all I could stand from this pin-head, so I stand up, lean over to him, look down at him right in the eyes and say, "Why don't you try to choke me and we'll see what "breaks away" first."

That was the end of the harrassment from that surveyor. Oh yeah, we passed the survey, too.

:eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap fantastic! that's deserving of a filmed reenactment!

 

[anon`]

...Well, I'd had about all I could stand from this pin-head, so I stand up, lean over to him, look down at him right in the eyes and say, "Why don't you try to choke me and we'll see what "breaks away" first."

Love it. Love it! Exactly what I would've done

Alternatively, there's always bow ties!