5th Avenue New York

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 5, 2009

Known to book lovers as the home of Scribner's Sons and hat lovers as the retail home of just about every hat maker of the Golden Age - Knox, Dobbs, Cavanagh - they all wanted a 5th Avenue address on their label - 5th Avenue New York was the epicentre of culture, fashion and style throughout the 20th Century.

This thread is for photos and stories of 5th Avenue in its heyday. Got a photo of a famous 5th Avenue hat shop, restaurant, landmark? Post it here.

Let me start with Charles Scribner's Sons, one of the world's great publishing houses and the drivng force behind American literature. F. Scott Fitzgerald, Henry James, Ernest Hemingway, Arthur Train, Will James, Thomas Wolfe, Alan Paton, Marjorie Rawlings and just about any other US author of note found their start at Scribners.

The publishing house, printer and shop were a 5th Avenue landmark for generations.

Scribners moved from Broadway to this building at 153-157 5th Ave in 1894:

The bookshop was always a feature of Scribners

They moved to 311-319 West 43rd in 1907

More to come...

dhermann1 · Dec 5, 2009

Great idea for a thread! I used to love that old Scribner's on 5th Ave. It killed me when they sold the place.
Yes, SOOO many iconic places on 5th Ave! The Public Library, Lord & Taylor, Bergdorff Goodman, Van Cleef and Arpels, Cartiers, the Plaza Hotel, Central Park!
But it's not what it used to be. A lot of schlock shops have been interspersing themselves among the swanky joints.

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 5, 2009

In May 1913 Scribners moved to 597-599 Fifth Avenue

And the bookshop

The bookshop just prior to its closure in 1989. It was first sold to Rizzoli International Bookstores in 1984 (the same year that Scribners publishing merged with Macmillans) before being sold again to Barnes & Noble:

And the buidling today (at least the name remains above the door):

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 5, 2009

Where were the 5th Ave hat stores?

Most of the hats that bore the "5th Ave New York" tag on their famous lables would never have been anywhere near New York. They were made in factories elsewhere and sold by retailers farther afield. So why was it necessary to claim a New York address? Where were the retail stores that gave the famous hat makers the right to claim the address???

I guess that 5th Avenue, home of Saks and other fashion houses, was seen as the style centre of the USA. The hatmakers wanted some of that reflected glory.

So I went looking for photos of the old 5th Ave hat stores. So far I haven't been able to find even one. The closest I've come is this story on Arnold's Hatters NY that the author claims was once Knox Hats.

http://images.google.com.au/imgres?.../images?q=Knox+hat+5th+avenue&hl=en&sa=G&um=1

Does anyone have any 5th Ave hat shop pics?

Brad Bowers · Dec 5, 2009

Great idea for a thread!

These are the best photos I have. Sadly, they are the only photos I have.

Crofut & Knapp had several Fifth Avenue addresses over the years, but their most famous one was at 620 Fifth Avenue. After 1908 it was also home to Dobbs Hats. 620 was the company's NY headquarters. They were forced to move to a new location in 1928. Their building, and others, of course, was destroyed to make way for Rockefeller Center. The British Empire building is on the site of the old C&K store now.

The most famous of the early Dobbs addresses was 244 Fifth Avenue, home of Dobbs & Co., the retailing end of the business, and a separate entity from the Dobbs hat brand. They later opened a huge store at 57th and Fifth, which was too much store to support in the Great Depression, as Dobbs & Co. went bankrupt in 1931. Not the brand, or the parent company Cavanagh-Dobbs, Inc.

In 1932, John Cavanagh presided over the opening of a new Dobbs shop at 711 Fifth Avenue. No photos of that one.

Brad

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 5, 2009

Fantastic pics Brad. So, the label address referred to the retailing headquarters and not the manufacturing HQ. If I remember rightly, Stetson combined their manufacturing and retail hq at their Philadelphia precinct.

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 5, 2009

a 5th Avenue shopper in 1946

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 6, 2009

1911 Easter Parade

Bowlers/Derbys everywhere with the occasional topper and homburg.

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 6, 2009

and again

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 6, 2009

1924

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 6, 2009

Alfred Stieglitz's 1893 classic photo 'Winter on Fifth Avenue'

BinkieBaumont · Dec 6, 2009

"Good Lord! Talk about a Bump!"

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 6, 2009

40 Fiftth Ave in 1896

40_Fifth_Avenue,_New_York,_North_of_34th_Street,_by_Alfred_S._Campbell.png

Brad Bowers · Dec 6, 2009

Ephraim Tutt said:
Bowlers/Derbys everywhere with the occasional topper and homburg. Hardly a fedora in sight!

The caption at the website says it's the Easter Parade, 1911, which would explain why we're seeing only the more formal hats.

Brad

duggap · Dec 6, 2009

Good observation Brad. I was going to ask the question of how come no fedoras. I am sure you noticed the one gent in a top hat. Great pic.

skyvue · Dec 6, 2009

Brad Bowers said:
The caption at the website says it's the Easter Parade, 1911, which would explain why we're seeing only the more formal hats.

Brad

I was just about to comment on this -- a) I didn't think that was the 1920s or '30s, and b) everyone's dressed very formal. I was going to guess it was the Easter Parade or some similar event.

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 6, 2009

Thanks Brad. That makes sense. I've amended the above.

A very formal turnout for a holiday parade. Times have indeed changed.

Brad Bowers · Dec 6, 2009

What struck me was the ubiquity of the derby. We know that to be true without seeing this photo, of course, but it really was a utilitarian hat for most men, regardless of social standing or wealth. I would have expected to see more homburgs and top hats for the Easter Parade, which I consider to be more formal, but there are far more derbies than anything else, underscoring that it was a more formal hat than I previously thought. Great photograph.

Brad

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 6, 2009

I reckon the guy in the topper is the Monopoly Man!

I'm thinking your Dobbs store did a roaring derby trade at Easter.

Ephraim Tutt · Dec 9, 2009

I came across this bit of information on the Knox Hats building at 450 5th Avenue in a discussion on the redevelopment of the site:

"The new tower would be a couple of doors to the west of the 29-story tower at 450 Fifth Avenue that was erected by the Republic National Bank in 1985 and designed by Eli Attia with a staggered north façade that wraps around the former Knox Hat Building. The Knox building was designed by John H. Duncan in 1902 and sensitively remodeled into a bank building by Kahn & Jacobs in 1965.

Mr. Higgins said that the restoration of the former Knox building will recreate a curved glass entrance marquee on Fifth Avenue, replace a missing cast-iron railing on a cornice, replace non-original multi-pane windows with single-pane windows, make various needed repairs, but retain the non-original storefront configuration on 40th Street because, he said, it is bettered centered to the upper façade."

See: http://wirednewyork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11274

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