Hat Project - Advice needed

[ScottF]

I started repairing this Knox Twenty last night, and now I'm wondering if my approach is advisable. The sweatband was glued to the hat in the front third. The liner was also glued in. The sweatband is thin and has surface cracks all over the outside. Even after re-blocking in a woolite solution, the color is much duller than what was under the ribbon (but still okay). The hat has my favorite look and it's a color I've wanted, so it's a keeper and needs to be repaired.

Because of the nasty glue job at the front of the sweatband, the ribbon was also stretched and partially removed. So I removed the ribbon, used Lexol on the sweat, removed all pieces of glue, re-blocked using woolite solution.

Results are shown below. My plan is to use the stitching awl to do the front 1/3, overlapping the sides that are still stitched. I'll probably put the same ribbon back on it. I also have a friction wear at the front point of the crease that is pretty bad, but not through.

The hat's a nice Cavanagh-edge fedora with a 2 7/8" brim, and the felt, while faded, is in great shape. Should I continue with my plan, which would save the leather sweatband, and basically just 'restore' the hat, but which would take quite a bit of effort and yield less than the hat's potential? Or is it worth sending in to Optimo for a rebuild, given its faded state and the friction wear at the front of the crown? I've only done my own repair work so far, so not sure what hatters are capable of doing with something like this.

 

[Brad Bowers]

The sweatband is not worth saving for wear; it's too far gone. It probably wouldn't last a month, if that. Remove it and save it for posterity, but definitely replace it.

Brad

 

[ScottF]

The sweatband is not worth saving for wear; it's too far gone. It probably wouldn't last a month, if that. Remove it and save it for posterity, but definitely replace it.

Brad

Thanks, Brad. I was afraid of that.

 

[tonyb]

The sweatband is not worth saving for wear; it's too far gone. It probably wouldn't last a month, if that. Remove it and save it for posterity, but definitely replace it.

Brad

Ditto.

Because that felt is wearing thin at the front pinch, Scott, how 'bout flipping it around? You know, turn the front into the back. Doing this properly, so that the crown shows no signs that it was ever any other way, very likely requires reblocking. (I'm not sure I know what you mean by "re-blocking in a woolite solution," but I'm guessing you let the hat soak for a while. By reblocking I mean removing everything attached to the felt -- the sweatband and ribbon and liner -- and working the body onto a block and leaving it there until it's thoroughly dry and wrinkle free.)

It looks like an almost ideal hat to experiment with, but unless it has a sentimental value, it's not really worth the cost of a professional overhaul. It's faded, its felt is wearing thin, etc. Chances are good that you could purchase a suitable block, and maybe a flange, too, for about the same money.

Oh, and you can reinforce that thin spot. But it's still a good idea to flip it around.

 

[buler]

If he strips the hat completely could he turn it inside out and get back more of the original color and hide the thin spot?

B

 

[tonyb]

Depends on what kinda shape the innards are in. But then, it's a felted (Cavanagh, Custom, Mode, whatever) edge hat, so if it were turned inside out the purty part would be on the underside of the brim.

 

[tonyb]

It also depends on how faded the brim is, on both its sides. Short of anything truly extreme and potentially ruinous (such as redyeing the felt), it'll never be a like-new hat again, but there's no reason it can't be made into a cool-lookin', presentable lid, suitable for wear with more casual attire.

Me, I'd opt against turning it inside out, because of the edge thing, and because it's faded enough on its brim that the difference in color between it and what is now the inside of the crown would be quite noticeable. Or so I imagine.

 

[ScottF]

It also depends on how faded the brim is, on both its sides. Short of anything truly extreme and potentially ruinous (such as redyeing the felt), it'll never be a like-new hat again, but there's no reason it can't be made into a cool-lookin', presentable lid, suitable for wear with more casual attire.

Me, I'd opt against turning it inside out, because of the edge thing, and because it's faded enough on its brim that the difference in color between it and what is now the inside of the crown would be quite noticeable. Or so I imagine.

Thanks Tony, Buler, Brad.

Tony - I just happen to have a block and flange that are perfect for this hat. Flipping it inside out would be great but I hate to hide that Cavanagh edge (which is partly why I bought it) and I actually like the faded color fine. Only problem with flipping it around is that a little of the old color would show at the top middle of the bow, but I think it's worth doing. I've already removed the sweatband and ready to start.

Thanks, all!

 

[ScottF]

One last question - can anyone point me to a thread that describes how to use a vintage block to re-block a hat? I have done this only once, first soaking in a woolite solution before putting on the block. This worked well, but I'd like to read how you guys do it. I've searched high and low, and can only find info related to naptha - is this the way it really needs to be done?

 

[tonyb]

A device called a "puller-down" (you gotta love those old hatter's terms) comes in handy but it isn't necessary. Just make sure you've thoroughly rinsed out any cleaning agent first and be very careful that the brim is equal width all the way around. And if it isn't, take it off the block and start over. Don't trust your eyes. Use a ruler.

Also make sure the body is thoroughly ON the block -- in other words, no loose material at the top of the crown. You may have to massage it a bit with your palms to really get it on the block. And this is another place where you can end up with an uneven brim, if you don't guard against it.

Once you're satisfied you have the body properly on the block, tie it off with a cord at the bandline (or brim break or whatever your favored term for it).

EDIT: It is possible to tear the felt. Not likely, but possible. So be careful, especially with that worn spot.

 

[ScottF]

A device called a "puller-down" (you gotta love those old hatter's terms) comes in handy but it isn't necessary. Just make sure you've thoroughly rinsed out any cleaning agent first and be very careful that the brim is equal width all the way around. And if it isn't, take it off the block and start over. Don't trust your eyes. Use a ruler.

Also make sure the body is thoroughly "on" the block -- in other words, no loose material at the top of the crown. You may have to massage it a bit with your palms to really get it on the block. And this is another place where you can end up with an uneven brim, if you don't guard against it.

Once you're satisfied you have the body properly on the block, tie is off with a cord at the bandline (or brim break or whatever your favored term for it).

EDIT: It is possible to tear the felt. Not likely, but possible. So be careful, especially with that worn spot.

Thanks again!

 

[tonyb]

Only problem with flipping it around is that a little of the old color would show at the top middle of the bow, but I think it's worth doing.

You could replace the ribbon with a wider one, wide enough so the new bow would cover that evidence of fading. Or that replacement ribbon could be made into a pleated bow or some other style that would also hide the evidence.

 

[ScottF]

You could replace the ribbon with a wider one, wide enough so the new bow would cover that evidence of fading. Or that replacement ribbon could be made into a pleated bow or some other style that would also hide the evidence.

I'm thinking this hat is going to be my "The Natural" imitation I've been thinking about building. I laid the original ribbon around it for this shot, and it's pretty close - color's off a little, but the ribbon is perfect and could be duplicated in the correct color. Finding an appropriate wide-brim with the Cavanagh edge from Hobbs' hat isn't easy, and this one came already beat-up.

 

[tonyb]

Sounds like a winning plan to me.