Horsehide Perfecto-style jackets

Discussion in 'Outerwear' started by nattevagten, Feb 26, 2020.

  1. nattevagten

    nattevagten New in Town

    Messages:
    29
    Hey

    I got myself a Schott Perfecto 613 jacket in the autumn and I am now thinking about getting another jacket in a slightly larger size for warmer layers. As the above jacket is made of steerhide, I am considering a horsehide jacket this time.

    Hence, how does the Schott horsehide compare to their steerhide and is it generally a nice leather?

    My other options include getting a double-rider jacket made of Blattwerk, Horween Lux, or Clayton horsehide. If you have any experience with any of these leathers, I would love to hear about it as well.

    Something to consider - the horsehide shouldn’t be any thicker or heavier than Schott’s steerhide; it can be slightly lighter, though.

    Thank you!
     
  2. Harris HTM

    Harris HTM Practically Family

    Messages:
    921
    Location:
    the Netherlands
    I own 2 618s, one in steer and one in HH. I bought the steer in 2012, it is thick and heavy, great leather.
    My HH was bought in 2015. It is lighter and thinner, really shiny and supple and shows great grain. However: last year I visited the NY schott shop and I realized that the HH they use now is different: less shiny, thicker, heavier and stiffer. Much closer to steer.
     
    nattevagten likes this.
  3. Carlos840

    Carlos840 Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,994
    Location:
    London
    I have two Schott jackets made from HH, one black and one brown.
    They are super smooth, super shiny, with a very vinyly feeling topcoat, both are breaking in in a similar fashion.

    You can see pics of the black one here:

    https://www.thefedoralounge.com/threads/legendary-products-inc-trojan-horse.96661/

    No pics of the brown one yet.

    Personally i am not a big fan of it, it feels fine, but doesn't feel special.
    I would rate Lost world, Shinki, or CXL higher as they are iMO hides that have much more character, show nicer evolution as you wear them and are more interresting to wear day to day than Schott HH.
    Saying that i feel the same about their steer, so maybe it's just that their leathers don't have what i like in leather.
     
    KissMyMuscle and nattevagten like this.
  4. nattevagten

    nattevagten New in Town

    Messages:
    29
    Interesting! Didn't know they use new HH now. I always had the impression that their HH is like you described - lighter and thinner and quite shiny. I'm not a huge fan of Schott’s steerhide (it simply doesn’t feel that special), so if the new HH is even closer to steer, I might have to look elsewhere.
     
  5. jacketjunkie

    jacketjunkie One Too Many

    Messages:
    1,822
    Location:
    Germany
    Stick to Schott if the jacket fits you fine. Just get a 613HH and call it a day.
     
    Carlos840 and nattevagten like this.
  6. Monitor

    Monitor

    Messages:
    10,540
    Seconded. Great jackets, quality, sturdy hide. Warm, comfortable, deals well with crappy weather. You can't go wrong with it.

    I had the 618 in HH & loved the jacket.

    Check out this Legendary D-pocket, made by Schott.
    https://www.thefedoralounge.com/threads/schott-black-stallion.99834/
    @AmericanIron wore it for years. A lession to us all.
     
    marker2037 and nattevagten like this.
  7. Edward

    Edward Bartender

    Messages:
    20,755
    Location:
    London, UK
    If you're going used, be careful to check Schott's HH. There was a time - over a decade ago now - when they used to stick felt backing onto their HH in order to give it more body. Those jackets weren't bad as such, just that the hide itself was not as thick as it first appeared.

    And don't buy a Schott from the UK - the price for them here now is madness!
     
    Carlos840 likes this.
  8. nattevagten

    nattevagten New in Town

    Messages:
    29
    The prices are slightly cheaper in France (buying online). I found a new one for around €850 (around £715). Then again, SB jackets start already from £550.
     
  9. Carlos840

    Carlos840 Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,994
    Location:
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    I've said it before and i'll say it again, Schott are not worth the asking price new.
    They made sens when you could buy them for $450, but the current prices are IMO silly.
    I would buy a used one without hesitation, but i would never pay new price, not when you can get so many other much nicer jackets for less money.
     
  10. dannyk

    dannyk Practically Family

    Messages:
    679
    Agreed. I own several and have owned and sold/traded several. I think they get a lot of undue hate. They are pretty good jackets overall. Especially for off the rack. But the prices they are at now, not worth it. Charging anywhere from 700-1200, just cant justify them anymore. The only good part about them is they are tons for good prices on Ebay, Etsy, Grailed, on here. If you really want a Schott go the pre-owned route for sure.
     
    Edward likes this.
  11. Edward

    Edward Bartender

    Messages:
    20,755
    Location:
    London, UK
    I have a 618 I bought some years ago in excellent condition on eBay for GBP£180; before that, I was going to buy one of Silverman's own brand (GTH) P-types at about £150 new. I decided at that price the Schott was worth it (I'm always wary of the environmental issues and working conditions of manufacture in the far East), but in all honesty, comparing like for like I don't find the Schotts worth what they can command new. Which is not to say they are bad jackets - far from it - but there is a significant premium to be paid for them, partly owing to US manufacture, partly owing to the strong dollar, and partly, to be blunt, a 'brand tax'. The Schott does have a much greater consistency, of course - many cheaper jackets you need to go through the rack for the better ones - but it's not significantly better when you do get a really good cheap one.

    Of course I speak here to the standard line; there are special edition ones they do that I'm sure are as good as some of the brands we prefer in this part, but the price for those in astromical.

    SB have never managed to command the prices I suspect they would like to charge (most likely around what Aero sell for now, had the original business plan for AL as then was panned out). The Aero modsel based on the Perfecto-style (morel ikely in overallfit on a Durable, but anyhow..) starts at £725 nowadays. Having owned one (in steer) and comparing it directly against my 618....in all truth, the only reason the Aero is going and I'm keeping the Schott is that when I bought the Aero I discovered the difference in fit - it's very neat in the waist, cut as period correct, and I'd need to go a size up. In truth, though, it's a vastly superior jacket. For a tenner between them, the Schott wouldn't ever get a look-in for me.

    I've yet to see a Hercules in person, though I get the impression they're on about the same level as the Schott. That would be an interesting comparison, given the Hercules are Wested-level money (though they certainly present better on the website than Wested do -and again, Wested aren't bad either, but maybe more realistically priced than the Schotts).

    Again, I'd emphasise that I don't think the Schotts are bad jackets as such, just that, as Carlos says, there's much better out there for the same money.
     
    Carlos840 and dannyk like this.
  12. Monitor

    Monitor

    Messages:
    10,540
    You guys have to understand that Schott is a name. Half of what they charge is for that Schott logo right now and let's face it, they have every right to do so because they are the last major players still around. RMC, Aero, Vanson, Japanese brands, not to mention small time makers like Himel or GW... They're literally nobodies compared to Schott. Doesn't matter how much better their jackets are. Who cares.

    Schott is big time. They're not big in Japan, they're big everywhere. They're doing colabs with major players. They can dictate the price and people will pay. People are paying. Not us but honestly, who cares about us. We're a joke. Kylie Jenner wears Schott. Dua Lipa wears Schott. She's not wearing GW, she won't wear Aero or Himel. "Oh oh, I can get a custom jacket for that kind of money" Good for you. Schott doesn't care.

    Schott costs a lot of money because (insert brand name here) costs a lot of money. It's a moot point. If you were Jason, what would you do if you saw that some nobody is selling a copy of YOUR jacket for three times as much money?

    Is Schott Perfecto worth the money it costs now? No. Is any cross zip on the market worth the money it costs? No. Is buying Schott over any other brand a mistake? No.

    Buy the jacket you like.
     
  13. Edward

    Edward Bartender

    Messages:
    20,755
    Location:
    London, UK
    In the end, it's all subjective. Some people will pay, some won't. Some will find the "heritage", the being a big player, the brand, worth the price of entry, and some won't. Schott certainly seem to be able to find enough people out there prepared to pay their prices; as long as they do that, it won't change.
     
  14. dannyk

    dannyk Practically Family

    Messages:
    679
    Let me just say I agree. I’ve defended Schott alongside of you many a time. And I love them and I get it. I guess my point is simply Schott has such a long history and such a massive used market that you can get really incredible Schotts for way cheaper used. It’s not that Schott isn’t worth anything new, they have value, it’s just go on eBay, etsy, or grailed right now and there’s hundreds of options. More than any other brand or maker. You can sometimes find them dirt cheap brand new from people. Some are ridiculously priced of course. And some maybe you save 100 bucks, but hey that’s 100 saved. So to me it’s not that they aren’t worth whatever they charge it’s that market for them “used” is so huge and good, there’s deals there to be had.
     
    steve u likes this.
  15. nattevagten

    nattevagten New in Town

    Messages:
    29
    Does anyone know what's the approximate bottom hem measurement of Aero's motorcycle jacket in size 38? I contacted their customer support, but they only sent me chest, shoulder, and back measurements. All I know is that the jacket has a considerable drop (chest/waist) compared to Schott and might be uncomfortable in the waist.

    I'm considering Aero at this point, but I have my doubts because of the measurements. The jacket has a 22" chest, which is six inches larger than my own chest measurement (exactly 38" on t-shirt) and might be too extreme even for layering, or perhaps not?

    I thought getting a second jacket is perhaps easier, but it certainly doesn't look like it so far.. I wish I could just stick to my current 613 in size 38, but the 17.5" shoulders don't allow layering. The other measurements (19" waist, 21" chest) are fine.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2020
  16. Finn Vigorous

    Finn Vigorous Familiar Face

    Messages:
    61
    I guess you're referring to Cafe Racer models. I got a Sheene (in CXL horse), which is a Cafe Racer with spread collar, in size 40 and the hem is 19.5" stretched. The taper steep as the jacket is 23" pit to pit.
     
  17. nattevagten

    nattevagten New in Town

    Messages:
    29
    I meant Aero's cross zip (Perfecto-style) jacket. It's simply called a 'Motorcyle Jacket' (link below) on their website. I'm not familiar with Cafe Racers, but I think they have slightly different measurements.

    http://www.aeroleatherclothing.com/product-detail.php?id=65
     
  18. Monitor

    Monitor

    Messages:
    10,540
    I don't recall at the moment what my 42 Aero MC jacket was around the waist but I know it was very, very tight. Like, the rest of the jacket was super roomy everywhere around but the bottom hem was skintight to the point that I couldn't zip it up over layers. It was something crazy, from 24" P2P to like 19" waist. Honestly, I didn't like it much at all even though it was beautiful to look at.
    I think you'd be much happier with the J-106. Very comfortable style, not so extremely cut. I was much happier with it straight from the box than I ever was with an MC jacket even after a few months of non stop wear.
     
    nattevagten likes this.
  19. Finn Vigorous

    Finn Vigorous Familiar Face

    Messages:
    61
    Oh, I see, wasn't aware of that model. I guess you can try again contacting Aero to get the approx. hem width.

    And I second what Monitor says, I wouldn't consider a heavy-tapered jacket, especially when intended use is with thicker layers.
     
    nattevagten likes this.
  20. Imuricecreamman

    Imuricecreamman Practically Family

    Messages:
    523
    If I were to go the SB route I'd check out the Black Clayton horsehide. I think that would be perfect for a motorcycle style jacket. It's probably the most charismatic leather I've encountered so far.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
    sweetfights, El Marro, Bfd70 and 3 others like this.

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