Need advice to purchase a Montecristi Panama

[Paladin]

I'm brand new to the forum, found you just in time! My hat collection includes a number of Borsalinos, a custom Howard Johnson (an Indiana Jones made by the original makers of the hat for the movies), a gray Italian straw fedora by Parabuntal (I believe that's the maker, not the style--I'm not as well-educated as some here), a straw boater made in Italy (strangely enough, no manufacturer's name, only a church or some sort of building imprinted on the liner) as well as the normal felt and straw westerns for more regular wear down here in Texas (I do have a custom by O'Farrell). I also include several British military berets that I'll wear when the weather gets very cold and on trips up north during the winter. Oh, almost forgot my favorite western, a great Charley One-Horse cavalry straw that I wore every day on safari in South Africa (when I figure out how to do it, I'll post a photo of myself in the African bush with the straw). I'm the "hat guy" in my family, I've collected and worn hats over the past 40+ years.

Now, to get to my questions....I'm interested in purchasing a Montecristi Panama. I've been in email contact with Brent Black to educate myself and make a decision on the style I want and the amount to invest. I've also seen the seller on eBay (Robert Weber of Panamahatworks) and communicated a bit with him. My question is are there others I haven't identified to discuss a Montecristi purchase? And what have you all heard about my two sources so far? One more--Brent has a new fedora style "The Gatsby". I'm considering that along with the Classic. Has anyone seen a Gatsby from Brent? It's tough to make a decision on style when you can't try it on first. Especially since my hat size is a big one--24 1/8.

Any counsel you fellows can offer on deciding on a source for a Montecristi, and the style? Thanks in advance for whatever help you can provide.

 

[Paladin]

I didn't realize that the Panamabob I was referred to in another post was the fellow I emailed with recently who's selling on eBay and owns Panama Hatworks. He actually recommended this forum to me. I can be slow....

 

[Panamabob]

Welcome to the forum.

To correct one error...Wilson Espinales is the owner of Panama Hatworks of Montecristi and is my brother in law. You can have our Ecuadorian RUC number (revenue/resale) if you wish.

I'm the Head English Speaker and bookkeeper dude and the guy who doesn't want to send up crappy hats!

Keep exploring and enjoy!

I hear only good things about Brent Black's hats, Milton Johnson's hats, Graham Thompson's hats, and Art Fawcett's hats, and our hats blocked in USA. Sometimes I am confused as to who blocks Black's hats, but I've never asked directly.

Some don't like our hats as blocked in Ecuador and some do. The issues lie in the leather quality and the bands....much better in USA than in Ecuador, no doubt, but we are working on that.

The only thing I suggest is that you ask a ton of questions regarding the weave, color, size of crown/brim, etc.

And, don't pay more than you have to.

 

[rayk]

I would suggest a lot of research on Montecristi hats prior to jumping into the market, as I'm sure you would be hesitant to blindly accept recommendations from those who are strangers.

The Panamabob of whom you speak is our own Robert, a contributing member of this forum, and, in my experience, a gentleman of unimpeachable character who will explain to you everything you need to know about both Montecristi hats and the markets in which they are sold, then, send you off to shop your hat. But given that Robert is amply qualified, I'll allow him speak for himself.

Brent Black and Milton Johnson are indisputably capable and talented hatters. I've had email communications with BB, and he is a true gentleman, and one of fine reputation; however, his prices are, at least for me, too high; Milton Johnson, too, demands prices that are simply stratospheric.

Optimo is another option that you might consider. I left a message requesting information on the availability of high weave count Montecristi hats (1800+ wpi) with Optimo, and Graham, the owner(?), left a return message. From that voicemail Graham appeared to be a fine and knowledgeable gentleman who would invest all that was necessary to provide a fine product that met with customer approval. Given that I'm not at this time ready to invest what would be necessary to purchase a hat of this quality from Optimo, I've chosen to not further waste the gentleman's valuable time.

To my mind it would appear that BB and MJ sell primarily to three types of individuals: those who desire a fine Montecristi, but have not done the necessary research to assure the finest hat at the most reasonable price; those who obdurately cling to the price-point/quality nexus; and those who possess fortunes and/or fame that render price-point a vulgar topic that concerns we inhabitants of the nether world of the working person.

I would never suggest that you could not get a superlative Montecristi hat from BB, MJ, or others. What I am saying is that for true fino quality of say 1200+ wpi, you can be assured of much higher prices for comparable quality from these other sources than from Robert.

Good luck on your quest.

 

[rayk]

I guess Robrt spoke for himself before I had the chance to post...you're very fast, Robert.

 

[gcollins]

Hey Paladin:

PanamaBob is right, ask a lot of questions and do some study. but I too love the Brent Black hats. Brent is pretty straightforward about what you get for the money....and being in Hawaii, he doesn't do much low end business. He is not the value hatter. He sells to the guy who wants what he wants. And that's why a guy like Brent sells a hat called the Gatsby.

You get what you pay for and you get a fabulous hat and awesome block--if you dn't like it return it and he'll make you another one. They're not cheap. but you can buy an audi with the same engine as the BMW or you can buy the BMW straight out. Just a choice.

I love the gatsby style hat from Brent. I tried one for my head size but the crown was just too high for my long oval. I prefer the classic fedora and the aficionado that are just plain awesome designs. Brent's internet photos do not do justice to the classic fedora...but check out the Hartford York site for the aficionado design if you like--the most awesome panama design around.

I personally received the classic fedora. Fabulous. It is a BMW with the 17" wheels, more powerful engine, and tiptronic (sp?) transmission-- that's what I wanted and that's what I paid for.

Regards,
G

 

[Paladin]

Great input fellows, thanks. Do you have any web site addresses for the other hatters you mention? Gcollins--I'm glad to hear from someone who tried on one of Brent's Gatsbys. From the description, I had a feeling it might be too much hat for someone with a large size, which mine is (24 1/8"). Same might be said for Bob's Indy Jones style. I'm thinking the classic is probably the best way to go, wear it, enjoy it and if I want a change of pace, perhaps the Afficionado eventually as an alternative.

I look forward to any further input any of you might have on the subject. It's appreciated.

 

[Panamabob]

www.hatshop.com is Worth and Worth...forgot them last time.
www.montecristihats.com is Johnson
www.brentblack.com is Black of course


There are more.



Black lists 900 weaves per square inch as a special hat...we sell them for less than his lowest priced hat....what weave count does that have?

Montecristi is Montecristi. The blocker is the blocker.

 

[Paladin]

Bob--Thanks for the links. Can you elaborate on the blocking differences in Ecuador and the US? Do I understand correctly that yours are blocked in Eduador? Also to expand on your comment "a blocker is a blocker". I'm new to the technical aspects of this, so understanding your comments and philosophy would be educational for me. As a layman, I would think the blocker's role in the process would be key to the right hat. I may be misunderstanding something, so your clarification would help. Thanks.

 

[gcollins]

Hi Paladin:

You have a sizable head, my man, but I think the gatsby fits a guy like you better than me. For a bigger build, a taller hat and wider brim, like the gatsby just might work. Tell BB your size and ask him to send you the hat to try. If you don't like it, then that's his issue to deal with. That's how he needs to work as a custom hatter of the finest customer service.

If he is not willing, then no loss for you. I love that design.

G

 

[Panamabob]

Paladin,

We have a blocker in USA who we work with and block in Ecuador.

The USA blocking is superior, no doubt, but many like the rusticness of the Ecuador blocks.

If you do a search for Montecristi on here or Panama you'll see several friendly discussions and lots of photos of our hats blocked by at least 2 different blockers in USA and other photos of other vendors.

 

[Paladin]

Bob--I think your idea about having BB send the Gatsby to try the style makes good customer sense. But how would you normally handle remuneration in that case? Would it be sent on spec without prior payment, send a deposit? I've never done business with him, he doesn't know me from Adam. I'm certainly an honorable potential customer. And I do believe it would be superior customer relationship-building to just say "hey, I understand your concern about whether the style would look good--I'll send you the hat and either return it if you aren't fully pleased or send payment". Is that customarily done in the long-distance hat business?

 

[gcollins]

The thing I like about BB is that he will even block more than one hat for you, send them to you and let you choose...perhaps without any payment. That's pretty cool. Again, he is not the value hatter. He is the man who makes a great hat and has the marketing skills to draw customers in. What's wrong with that market?

In the end, like a car, no one will pay you the same amount second hand, for a hat that you paid. It's a hat, man! Most people don't give a squat. It's all up to what you value and how you value a maker's hat.

You're the man, it's your plastic, and BB doesn't hang here lurking for business. Why is that again?

I checked out the New Mexico guy, his hats sem to only appeal to the market that vacations in New Mexico.

I don't know everything. I just like a nice hat! Why are we here? Pat Tillman isn't.

Regards,
G

 

[Panamabob]

Please, don't mistake my intentions for being on this forum. What I have found on this forum are individuals who care enough to tell me the truth so that we can make our product better.

The guys who've bought Montecristis through this forum know what they've paid and what value the hats do have that they've received in return. They know we didn't make much....and I think they appreciate the hats.

 

[SHARPETOYS]

Welcome to the lounge!
I love Montecristi hats of all blocks and weaves. This has been posted before and i hope it helps on your quest.

Here are of some pictures of my hat blocked and un blocked.The hat has wpsi in excess of 1700. It took my vendor over 7 months to find this hat. Am i happy very much so and i guess thats the botton line.

http://fedoralounge.skyblueproductions.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=943

 

[gcollins]

PanamaBob:

Right on, my man. Your reputattion is impecable, and you provide great hats at great prices! I'm going to buy a hat from you, then have BB block it for me into the hat you see in my avatar.


And look at the Sharpetoys hat....first time on this site I was admiring that hat. Really fits your face well. Such a stud!

Regards,
G

 

[Paladin]

Sharpetoys--Maybe because it's Friday, I'm easily confused. But I got the message that Bob did your hat, but who is "Art"? He blocked it? Did you purchase the unblocked Montecristi then had someone else block it for you? Thanks for clarifying.

 

[SHARPETOYS]

I understand i bought the hat from Panamabob un blocked and Art here at the lounge blocked it for me on a vintage Bogey style block with a vintage ribbon. Here is Arts web site for you.


http://www.vintagesilhouettes.com/m_hats_fedoras.htm

 

[SHARPETOYS]

I did a search here on Montecristi hats and we have 3 pages on these fine hats. It may take some time but its a good read.

http://fedoralounge.skyblueproducti...id=16540&sortby=lastpost&sortorder=descending

 

[Panamabob]

Gcollins,

The last I heard is that Brent Black will not block our hats.

A customer told me that his hat was refused for blocking.

That is all I know. You'd better ask first.