French Hats and makers.

[Daniele Tanto]

Second homburg or diplomatique made in France arrived in the past days.

Quite rare to find a Gelot, even less so of this color. Dark gray with blue highlights.

The shape is the classic one of the "normal shaped" homburgs. Size 58 centimeters or 7 1/4 in the US.

The curled brims are 5 centimeters long, the ribbon, the same color as the felt, is 4 centimeters high and the crown, completely open is 13 centimeters.

The inside reminds me that the hat is almost a hundred years old and is perfect, a little less so on the outside where there are small imperfections that can easily be resolved.

The question is which hat manufacturer made this Gelot?

No information at inside the sweatban and the mystery continues....

 

[steur]

Second homburg or diplomatique made in France arrived in the past days.
View attachment 605605
Quite rare to find a Gelot, even less so of this color. Dark gray with blue highlights.
View attachment 605606
The shape is the classic one of the "normal shaped" homburgs. Size 58 centimeters or 7 1/4 in the US.
View attachment 605607
The curled brims are 5 centimeters long, the ribbon, the same color as the felt, is 4 centimeters high and the crown, completely open is 13 centimeters.
View attachment 605608
The inside reminds me that the hat is almost a hundred years old and is perfect, a little less so on the outside where there are small imperfections that can easily be resolved.
View attachment 605609
The question is which hat manufacturer made this Gelot?
View attachment 605610
No information at inside the sweatban and the mystery continues....

That is an outstanding beauty of a hat! Great find, Daniele.

 

[batankyu]

Hi, I purchased this short brim "Motsch Fils" black fedora at a garage sale for 5 euro along Prado beach in Marseille on Sunday 20 April 2024. I wondered if there was any chance to put some date range on it.

All I know is that Etienne Motsch founded his hat shop in Paris in 1887 and that Hermes bought the shop in 1991. Obviously some son must have taken the succession of his father at some point in the century since the hat is a "Motsch Fils" (Motsch Son) but I have no clue when.

The sweatband is black says "PUR LIÈVRE" (pure hare) on the front and "Motsch Fils - Paris" on the right side. The same label on the black inner lining has worn off and is mostly unreadable now. The ribbon is in the same felt material as the hat, without bow. There's a tag hidden behind the sweatband at the back: it is serrated with 3 cells: the widest one on the left says "135 noir" (black), the middle one says "REF. 98568", the most norrow on the right says "ENTRÉE 5" and maybe "10".

Pictures of the hat on imgur



Front view.

Rear view.

Left side view.

Right side view.

Top view.

Bottom view.

Sweatband, Front view.

Sweatband, right side view.

Inner lining.

Tag behind back of sweatband.

Tag behind back of sweatband.

Owner.

 

[steur]

Hi, I purchased this short brim "Motsch Fils" black fedora at a garage sale for 5 euro along Prado beach in Marseille on Sunday 20 April 2024. I wondered if there was any chance to put some date range on it.

All I know is that Etienne Motsch founded his hat shop in Paris in 1887 and that Hermes bought the shop in 1991. Obviously some son must have taken the succession of his father at some point in the century since the hat is a "Motsch Fils" (Motsch Son) but I have no clue when.

The sweatband is black says "PUR LIÈVRE" (pure hare) on the front and "Motsch Fils - Paris" on the right side. The same label on the black inner lining has worn off and is mostly unreadable now. The ribbon is in the same felt material as the hat, without bow. There's a tag hidden behind the sweatband at the back: it is serrated with 3 cells: the widest one on the left says "135 noir" (black), the middle one says "REF. 98568", the most norrow on the right says "ENTRÉE 5" and maybe "10".

Pictures of the hat on imgur



Front view.

Rear view.

Left side view.

Right side view.

Top view.

Bottom view.

Sweatband, Front view.

Sweatband, right side view.

Inner lining.

Tag behind back of sweatband.

Tag behind back of sweatband.

Owner.

Cool find and for the price you cannot go wrong. The style suggests it's mid sixties to mid seventies.

 

[steur]

Mossant heather looked promising. Turned out to be a size 55 with the overwelt brim at 6cm and the crown at 10cm at the center dent. No labels inside the hat other than a small size label. With some stretching I can just about make it fit, but it still looks too small a hat. Too bad; a nice looking hat, but should have been a size or two bigger (or seven sizes, Brent).

 

[steur]

Mossant for Sools. Turned out a size 56 (just right!) with the stitched brim at 6cm and the crown at 10,5cm. Very thin and lightweight felt designated Castor Hudson. Weighs 84 grams. The colour is called Charcoal. The brim stitching is the special feature on this one: extremely fine and close to the brim edge.

 

[moehawk]

Mossant for Sools. Turned out a size 56 (just right!) with the stitched brim at 6cm and the crown at 10,5cm. Very thin and lightweight felt designated Castor Hudson. Weighs 84 grams. The colour is called Charcoal. The brim stitching is the special feature on this one: extremely fine and close to the brim edge.

Nice score!

 

[steur]

Nice score!

Thank you, John. Sools and Mossant were a good combination back then.

 

[moehawk]

Maurice Pirot.



The brim is2 inches, and the crown 4 1/4 inches as creased. 124g. The felt is top notch, as is the rest of the materials and construction. No indication of who made it, the only markings under the sweat is the small stamp pictured. I am thinking right around 1960 on this one.

 

[steur]

Maurice Pirot.

View attachment 611842 View attachment 611843 View attachment 611844 View attachment 611845 View attachment 611846 View attachment 611847 View attachment 611848 View attachment 611849 View attachment 611850

The brim is2 inches, and the crown 4 1/4 inches as creased. 124g. The felt is top notch, as is the rest of the materials and construction. No indication of who made it, the only markings under the sweat is the small stamp pictured. I am thinking right around 1960 on this one.

Cool find, John and a nice looking hat. Can't recall having ever seen a Maurice Pirot hat.

 

[moehawk]

Cool find, John and a nice looking hat. Can't recall having ever seen a Maurice Pirot hat.

Thanks Stefan!
I hadn't heard of him either, and a quick Googling only gave references to this hat on eBay. Made it even more intriguing. I was hoping for clues as to the maker, but it looks like another French mystery hat.

 

[Daniele Tanto]

Maurice Pirot.

John, there are many mysteries in European hat making where retailers have branded hats made by large, medium and small hat makers as their own. Some like Sools have declared provenance, others have branded and sold them as their own.
In Italy I found some examples in some Borsalinos that have the Cappellificio Cervo manufacturing label, others, like in France, made a dedicated lining that hid any origin. This situation continued in Italy until a few years ago.

 

[steur]

This well known Mossant poster will be on auction next week over here. Description: Capiello, Leonetto (1875-1942). Mossant Colour lithogr. poster, 160x115 cm., signed on the stone, 1938, laid down on linen.
- Sl. agetoned; a few sm. hairlines in the ink; sm. repair in blank margin in upper right corner.

Expected price between €600 and €800, auction costs not included. Could go higher of course. That's a bit much for my taste, but if anyone's interested I'll give you the link.

 

[Steve1857]

This well known Mossant poster will be on auction next week over here. Description: Capiello, Leonetto (1875-1942). Mossant Colour lithogr. poster, 160x115 cm., signed on the stone, 1938, laid down on linen.
- Sl. agetoned; a few sm. hairlines in the ink; sm. repair in blank margin in upper right corner.

View attachment 612325

Expected price between €600 and €800, auction costs not included. Could go higher of course. That's a bit much for my taste, but if anyone's interested I'll give you the link.

A truly wonderful poster, Stefan.

I'm still kicking myself for not pulling the deal on a Mossant poster I could have had if only I'd been willing to travel to pick it up.

It still would have been cheaper than that one though.

Will it really go for that price?

I'm thinking, how many real hats could you buy for €600 to €800.

Ah, well, a man can dream

 

[steur]

A truly wonderful poster, Stefan.

I'm still kicking myself for not pulling the deal on a Mossant poster I could have had if only I'd been willing to travel to pick it up.

It still would have been cheaper than that one though.

Will it really go for that price?

I'm thinking, how many real hats could you buy for €600 to €800.

Ah, well, a man can dream

Well, it's the same auction house I got the Borsalino catalogue from and that went for twice the starting price. They will start at €600 anyway and go up from there. It will buy quite a few real hats for sure, but we've got no shortage there. so...
There's a lot of 140 plus Polish filmposters in there as well, which starts lower! How's this for invasion of the body snatchers (at least that's what I think it is)?

 

[Steve1857]

Well, it's the same auction house I got the Borsalino catalogue from and that went for twice the starting price. They will start at €600 anyway and go up from there. It will buy quite a few real hats for sure, but we've got no shortage there. so...
There's a lot of 140 plus Polish filmposters in there as well, which starts lower! How's this for invasion of the body snatchers (at least that's what I think it is)?

View attachment 612334

Please send the link to the auction house, Stefan. It will be fun to follow the bidding.

 

[moehawk]

John, there are many mysteries in European hat making where retailers have branded hats made by large, medium and small hat makers as their own. Some like Sools have declared provenance, others have branded and sold them as their own.
In Italy I found some examples in some Borsalinos that have the Cappellificio Cervo manufacturing label, others, like in France, made a dedicated lining that hid any origin. This situation continued in Italy until a few years ago.

Nothing wrong with a good mystery!

 

[MikeinRome]

Mossant Castor (Beaver) Homburg from Sools that arrived from Vannes, Brittany several days ago. The finished brim is 2 1/2 inches front and back and 2 1/4 inches on the sides. Open crown is 5 1/2 inches. I love this hat! I don't understand why this hat only rated 2 stars while an average Borsalino Quality Superiore sold by Sools that's for sale on eBay rated 3 stars. I feel pretty confident that this is easily the better hat.

 

[Steve1857]

Mossant Castor (Beaver) Homburg from Sools that arrived from Vannes, Brittany several days ago. The finished brim is 2 1/2 inches front and back and 2 1/4 inches on the sides. Open crown is 5 1/2 inches. I love this hat! I don't understand why this hat only rated 2 stars while an average Borsalino Quality Superiore sold by Sools that's for sale on eBay rated 3 stars. I feel pretty confident that this is easily the better hat.

Great find, Mike.