The School of Hard Knox

Blare · Nov 25, 2020

Joel-Ruthie Simon said:
I have a Knox Twenty Custom Edge, Curious to find out the production year and model of the fedora. I think is a "Twenty" but not sure. These are the codes inside the hat: Oval: LO, To Duplicate: H 23749, Block 006, 5 1/2 Size: 7 1/4. (I believe the 5 1/4 is the crown size because that is what is measured at. Below are a couple of pictures. JESNYY@aol.com Thank you Happy Thanksgiving 2020, Stay safe.

As I said on FB. It does appear to be a Twenty which would have indicated a twenty dollar price tag. The manufacturing tag you posted there along with a few other details points to a 1950s hat. It appears someone at some point trimmed the Cavanagh felted edge (custom edge) off the hat and bound the brim with grosgrain ribbon. Very nice hat. Enjoy it... and welcome to the lounge.

Centaurus3200 · Dec 8, 2020

how common were more stingy brim Knox hats earlier than, say, the 1960s? i assume there were some in the 50's? any earlier?

i bought this Knox 20 for... $20 online (seemed fitting). pretty clean. sweatband was split at the back. i put some faux leather adhesive tape behind it and touched it up with a little black RIT dye with a Q tip. i'm learning about dating. i'm guessing it's late 50's at the earliest, but probably mid 60's?

i like stingy brims. i can not pull off a wide brim fedora. stingys seem to go well with the hipster ethos... quality leather jacket, selvedge jeans, Alden boots, etc.

Blare · Dec 9, 2020

Centaurus3200 said:
how common were more stingy brim Knox hats earlier than, say, the 1960s? i assume there were some in the 50's? any earlier?

i bought this Knox 20 for... $20 online (seemed fitting). pretty clean. sweatband was split at the back. i put some faux leather adhesive tape behind it. i'm learning about dating. i'm guessing it's late 50's at the earliest, but probably mid 60's?

i like stingy brims. i can not pull off a wide brim fedora. stingys seem to go well with the hipster ethos... quality leather jacket, selvedge jeans, Alden boots, etc.
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Sure short brims existed in many eras. Very notably 1930s.... though the 30s style tended to feature a taller fuller crown than in the 60s resurgence of stingy brims. Yours by the way appears to have a decently tall crown.

At first glance that sweatband has me thinking early 60s.
Also Hard for me to tell from the pics..... Does that liner tip have an oilskin lining over the logo?

If the sweat is in decent enough shape to get a look behind you may find manufacturing tags. If we could see those.. may help to date.

Centaurus3200 · Dec 9, 2020

thank you for the informative response!

i THINK the inner tip is oil skin. it's textured and opaque with perhaps a touch of greasiness to it. yeah, i thought about looking behind the sweatband. i've conditioned it with Bick 4, but i don't wanna risk tearing it.

here's an image from the original listing before i futzed with the sweatband stitching.

Blare said:
Sure short brims existed in many eras. Very notably 1930s.... though the 30s style tended to feature a taller fuller crown than in the 60s resurgence of stingy brims. Yours by the way appears to have a decently tall crown.

At first glance that sweatband has me thinking early 60s.
Also Hard for me to tell from the pics..... Does that liner tip have an oilskin lining over the logo?

If the sweat is in decent enough shape to get a look behind you may find manufacturing tags. If we could see those.. may help to date.

Blare · Dec 9, 2020

Centaurus3200 said:
thank you for the informative response!

i THINK the inner tip is oil skin. it's textured and opaque with perhaps a touch of greasiness to it. yeah, i thought about looking behind the sweatband. i've conditioned it with Bick 4, but i don't wanna risk tearing it.

here's an image from the original listing before i futzed with the sweatband stitching.

View attachment 287649

I’m definitely no expert. I’m sure others could weigh in. The most telling sign though is generally the manufacturing tags. But I full understand not wanting to risk damaging the sweat. We’ve mostly all experienced the dread of a mishap there.

An oilskin liner tip usually points to 1950s. Other evidence point to 1960s like possibly some details of the sweat.. also a twenty dollar short brim Cav edge might be a 60s clue. Weighing that I’ll broaden my guess to late 50s to early 60s.

In the end... it’s a nice hat. And you got a great deal on it. Anytime you can get a Twenty for a twenty it’s a good day. Enjoy it

Centaurus3200 · Dec 9, 2020

thank you!

here's the obligatory mugshot (in the bathroom) with period Art-Craft Optical Clubman Superlights

i have a handheld steamer and a hat brush. i have no idea how to shape a hat, so i haven't tried.

deadlyhandsome · Jan 6, 2021

Knox Twenty: 5 5/8” open crown and 2 3/4” brim with a Custom Edge (aka Cavanagh edge). Fantastic condition! The felt is a bit heavier than my other twenties and it makes for a great winter hat. Thanks again to @drmaxtejeda and @Randall Renshaw for brining this hat to my attention.

Blare · Jan 6, 2021

deadlyhandsome said:
Knox Twenty: 5 5/8” open crown and 2 3/4” brim with a Custom Edge (aka Cavanagh edge). Fantastic condition! The felt is a bit heavier than my other twenties and it makes for a great winter hat. Thanks again to @drmaxtejeda and @Randall Renshaw for brining this hat to my attention.

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Perfect Brent

Frunobulax · Jan 6, 2021

deadlyhandsome said:
Knox Twenty: 5 5/8” open crown and 2 3/4” brim with a Custom Edge (aka Cavanagh edge). Fantastic condition! The felt is a bit heavier than my other twenties and it makes for a great winter hat. Thanks again to @drmaxtejeda and @Randall Renshaw for brining this hat to my attention.

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Good get, Brent. And in great shape.

Randall Renshaw · Jan 6, 2021

deadlyhandsome said:
Knox Twenty: 5 5/8” open crown and 2 3/4” brim with a Custom Edge (aka Cavanagh edge). Fantastic condition! The felt is a bit heavier than my other twenties and it makes for a great winter hat. Thanks again to @drmaxtejeda and @Randall Renshaw for brining this hat to my attention.

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Looks awesome, Brent!
Congrats.

steur · Jan 7, 2021

deadlyhandsome said:
Knox Twenty: 5 5/8” open crown and 2 3/4” brim with a Custom Edge (aka Cavanagh edge). Fantastic condition! The felt is a bit heavier than my other twenties and it makes for a great winter hat. Thanks again to @drmaxtejeda and @Randall Renshaw for brining this hat to my attention.

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Super hat, Brent and a great find. Congrats.

deadlyhandsome · Jan 24, 2021

I came across this hat, and while not something I’d buy I found it interesting. Knox Pocket Hat:

deadlyhandsome · Jan 26, 2021

Know Twenty western. 6” open crown and 4” bound brim. I’m not sure if the El Pasa 400 is the model, if the 400 is for the 4” brim, or ???

Nice, but not remarkable, vintage western felt. The liner is missing and the sweatband is toast. I’m thinking of using it as a donor felt for a new build.

The hat arrived with a military cap piece that went trough the brim and crown and caused the brim to rise vertically tight against the crown. The holes in the felt were minimized with lots of steam and brushing. If I use the felt for a custom I’ll request that the holes be put at the back of the hat.

DaveProc · Apr 4, 2021

1913

BobHufford · Apr 22, 2021

Gen-u-wine Panama

deadlyhandsome · Apr 23, 2021

Knox Superfine gray homburg size 7 1/8:

Just Daniel · Apr 24, 2021

Interesting handwritten reorder / manufacturing tag.

deadlyhandsome said:
Know Twenty western. 6” open crown and 4” bound brim. I’m not sure if the El Pasa 400 is the model, if the 400 is for the 4” brim, or ???

Nice, but not remarkable, vintage western felt. The liner is missing and the sweatband is toast. I’m thinking of using it as a donor felt for a new build.

View attachment 304224 View attachment 304225 View attachment 304226 View attachment 304227 View attachment 304228 View attachment 304229 View attachment 304230

The hat arrived with a military cap piece that went trough the brim and crown and caused the brim to rise vertically tight against the crown. The holes in the felt were minimized with lots of steam and brushing. If I use the felt for a custom I’ll request that the holes be put at the back of the hat.

M Hatman · May 4, 2021

1934

Blare · Jun 2, 2021

Knox Twenty with Custom Edge and Comfit

Dark Brown Felt
5 1/2 Crown Open (approx 4 3/4 as shaped)
1 7/8 brown grosgrain ribbon
2 1/2 brim with Custom Edge
130g
Wind Trolley cord with Black Knox Logo Lapel Button

Brent @deadlyhandsome said when I posted this hat was on it’s way...

“I bet this will become a favorite. They just did everything right when they made these hats.”

I agree 100% on both accounts! This Knox Twenty arrived today. It needed a good brushing and a little bit of steam to bring it back to life... but boy did it! Was able to get out most of the “puckering” around the base of the crown and smooth out the ribbon some. A little more steam would probably get it almost perfect. The well finished felt is fairly dense with a luxurious feel to it. A nice full 5 1/2 crown. I love the proportions with the brim at 2 1/2 inches and a nice custom (Cavanagh) edge. The oilskin liner cover is in just about pristine condition. It includes the Comfit sweat cushion system Patent 2632175. I love the little detail of the Knox logo on the wind trolley lapel button. I’d have bet dollars to donuts if I was going to find one of these it would be grey before one in this beautiful brown... but I am sure not complaining.

A big thank you to @DaveProc for the heads up on this one... very much appreciated.

Blare · Jun 2, 2021

Knox Twenty continued

The School of Hard Knox

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One Too Many

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