Five Star Leather Jackets

[Aloysius]

That's not what their website says. I'll email SB and ask. SB lists their most expensive leather, Japanese leather, as adding £200.

I’m just saying what it used to be. In any case, I wouldn’t personally ever buy something from SB, even if the jacket was £100 given that they’re unrepentant criminals who stole their patterns from Aero. But many people here are fans and customers of theirs.

If you do order from them, good luck avoiding the usual measurement nightmare.

 

[TartuWolf]

@MrBlue44 If you're in UK then going Aero or SB is a no brainer - would not bother with 5*.

 

[El Marro]

Not sure whether this is the right thread for such - I posted in it because I'm considering having FS make me a custom jacket but was then wondering if I should just spend a bit more money and get something better quality.

Of course you should. Treat yourself to something nice for your birthday!

 

[Lyles]

The new HH from Shawn reminds me very much of what ELMC uses on their californian. Very easy to wear, the 5 Star pattern offers better mobility.
Eastman:
View attachment 416111
5 Star:
View attachment 416112
I would pick the 5 Star over the ELMC. My only gripe with it is there is some inconsistency in thickness, which I would call out in a future order.

Hey Ton, hope you’re well! I’m interested in ordering a jacket similar to this design from 5* in brown. Im wanting to base it on a Lewis leathers Corsair or Aero Premier Highwayman. Just wondering with your jacket, which 5* style is it based on? Did you ask for rounded shoulders with this one? Do you have any recommendations with leather/colour choices? I’m trying to get a similar colour to this jacket.

Thanks!

 

[ton312]

Hey Ton, hope you’re well! I’m interested in ordering a jacket similar to this design from 5* in brown. Im wanting to base it on a Lewis leathers Corsair or Aero Premier Highwayman. Just wondering with your jacket, which 5* style is it based on? Did you ask for rounded shoulders with this one? Do you have any recommendations with leather/colour choices? I’m trying to get a similar colour to this jacket.

Thanks!

That’s a superb looking jacket! I would think you could base this off numerous existing 5 Star patterns. I’d browse the catalog for a jacket most similar in shape, then take that jacket and tailor your measurements. I would also stress that you be emphatic about curved sleeves. My absolute biggest beef with 5 Star is that they really struggle with sleeve construction.

Looking back they did a great job on that HB of mine, and I would still pick it over the ELMC honestly….but the hide was all over the place in terms of consistency. Paper thin, thick, mid weight. Call that out too!

 

[Aloysius]

That’s a superb looking jacket! I would think you could base this off numerous existing 5 Star patterns. I’d browse the catalog for a jacket most similar in shape, then take that jacket and tailor your measurements. I would also stress that you be emphatic about curved sleeves. My absolute biggest beef with 5 Star is that they really struggle with sleeve construction.

Looking back they did a great job on that HB of mine, and I would still pick it over the ELMC honestly….but the hide was all over the place in terms of consistency. Paper thin, thick, mid weight. Call that out too!

If they got the pattern right for a change on that jacket, maybe the pattern details are still in their system and he could get your jacket with a different pocket configuration.

 

[Lyles]

That’s a superb looking jacket! I would think you could base this off numerous existing 5 Star patterns. I’d browse the catalog for a jacket most similar in shape, then take that jacket and tailor your measurements. I would also stress that you be emphatic about curved sleeves. My absolute biggest beef with 5 Star is that they really struggle with sleeve construction.

Looking back they did a great job on that HB of mine, and I would still pick it over the ELMC honestly….but the hide was all over the place in terms of consistency. Paper thin, thick, mid weight. Call that out too!

Thanks so much for your help Ton, really appreciate it! I think this might be the best one to base it on and just get the chest pockets removed
https://www.fivestarleather.us/products/civilian-vintage-1930s-classic-men-real-leather-jacket

I’ll be very clear on the shoulders, just tell Shawn the jacket curved shoulders not straight and maybe be even reference your half belt? I’ll measure my Corsair and send him through the measurements.
In regard’s to matching the colour to that jacket would you have any suggestions?

Thanks once again!

Albert

 

[spectre6000]

Last night, I finished reading all (ALL) 7,767 posts and 389 pages of this thread. Took me just about every spare minute across 9 full days, including one weekend where it got down to -20° here, and I became one with my warm and comfy recliner.

I'm an engineer, and it's been said before that this sounds an awful lot like a software problem. The machine spits out exactly what you tell it to as if it were code. Thing is, it doesn't seem the collective is fully versed in the language the machine uses. It's like if a Python engineer had to moonlight on a Ruby project; there's a lot of semi-intelligible stuff, but not everything spits out the way you want it to the first time or two you execute. The machine is very forgiving, and will "fail gracefully" by giving you something instead of nothing and not exploding, but that something seems to often have straight, tubular arms. Additionally, it seems there should be some real investigations/guidelines for measuring, but that's a different line of inquiry.

@PilotJens seems to be on the right track with his latest experimental line. Seems to me something that can be crowd sourced by the experienced and well equipped crowd here as well. We need to collectively dig up and measure a whole bunch of "good" sleeves, compare that to however many "bad" sleeves, and extract the differences. There was a post in the last few pages by @ton312 that had side by side photos of "good"/"bad" sleeves. It was immediately obvious to me that the seams were in different places from the straight on angle. I'm curious what other differences there were between those two sets of sleeves. Sounds like the Fivestar in that post is gone, but the (whatever the other one was) may not have been sold on yet.

The server on the forum seems to idle and need to be spun up when traffic is low, and during those slow load times, I've been perusing vintage jacket photos for ideas and inspiration. One thing I noticed is that some jackets use what I believe are called darts on the back panels to give them some three dimensional curvature that I've noticed is missing on a lot of the Fivestar jackets. I have a canvas trucker that has darts in the sleeves to give them the much discussed curvature, but most photos I've seen of leather jackets aren't detailed enough in the right area to know if that's a thing or not with leather. Is it? Might be the easiest path to nicely formed sleeves. Or maybe it's not a thing with leather for some reason, or there are easier ways... A wise man knows when he doesn't know, and my clue box is mostly just full of hair right now.

Edit (after below response, but written before I knew it existed... I'm slow and you guys are fast): This is my second post (first was about fixing a watch over in another sub-forum because I'm a watchmaking hobbyist and the answer was a lot easier and less involved than this), but I have owned 1 leather jacket ever, and it was a black leather mall blazer back in the late 90s when I imagine Joey Tribbiani made it cool or something. I am absolutely the design it myself demographic and the can't buy off the rack demographic. I'm short (5'5") and built like a tank (muscular with very broad shoulders), only I haven't worked out in a few years and have a dadbod now. By the time I get something with the chest/shoulders right, my hands are fully inside the sleeves, and it's halfway down my butt. I'm no collector, but I will do a super deep dive on this jacket project to get exactly what I want (a spring/fall jacket, and maybe separate shearling winter jacket), and then I'll just enjoy them until I can't any more for one reason or another. I'm looking for a 99% solution. That last 1% is SUPER expensive and results in nothing actually being able to fit the bill. I also do hifi audio, and I can make a beautiful all tube phono preamp for $600, but the "perfect" listening room costs a million dollars and takes a lifetime to build. This is like that. I want to make my 99% system, and then move on and just enjoy it while I find other rabbit holes to get lost in.

 

[TartuWolf]

Lovely and well thought out post @spectre6000, respect! (from a Python programmer)

 

[spectre6000]

Oh, also, I've noticed that people tend to ignore the linings. Lots of opportunity in the lining for cool details.

 

[Aloysius]

. One thing I noticed is that some jackets use what I believe are called darts on the back panels to give them some three dimensional curvature that I've noticed is missing on a lot of the Fivestar jackets. I have a canvas trucker that has darts in the sleeves to give them the much discussed curvature, but most photos I've seen of leather jackets aren't detailed enough in the right area to know if that's a thing or not with leather. Is it? Might be the easiest path to nicely formed sleeves. Or maybe it's not a thing with leather for some reason, or there are easier ways... A wise man knows when he doesn't know, and my clue box is mostly just full of hair right now.

Definitely not darting. It's not done on sleeves, even in textile. Do you mean additional panels?

Darts are just to take in a garment or introduce shape without altering the side, but it's never done to increase range of movement. It's not generally done on leather, or many other forms of outerwear for that matter, nor men's shirts. As far as tailoring/suitmaking, there are different schools of thought. American sack coats traditionally are undarted, as are the single breasted suits from Drape Cut tailors (such as Anderson & Sheppard and their alumni).

. I'm looking for a 99% solution. That last 1% is SUPER expensive and results in nothing actually being able to fit the bill. I also do hifi audio, and I can make a beautiful all tube phono preamp for $600, but the "perfect" listening room costs a million dollars and takes a lifetime to build. This is like that. I want to make my 99% system, and then move on and just enjoy it while I find other rabbit holes to get lost in.

Vanson/Schott. They're the Speedmaster or SL-1200, as far as the 99% option that is still in production, so you can get modern, birth year, whatever you want.

 

[2manyjacketsman]

Hello, new account here but I've lurked for years and often used this site for info and ideas. Thank you!
I recently bought a stock five star jacket on Jan 12th, 10 days ago, and never recieved any shipping confirmation. I tried emailing them days ago and got no response. Is this the normal amount of time? Seems like many of you have recieved custom jackets in 2 weeks or so. I'm also wondering if it has anything to do with the Iran Pakistan conflict...
Anyways, if any of you have also bought a jacket recently or have any insite I'd appreciate it!

 

[Furrowson]

Here you go. Press to zoom.

https://www.thefedoralounge.com/att...0907_121752_com-android-gallery3d-jpg.259205/

Sorry if you said this elsewhere, but which colour is this?

 

[spectre6000]

I goofed... pretend I quote responded to @Aloysius 's last post.

This: A wedge of material has been removed, and then it was sewn back together to create a 3 dimensional shape in the sleeve.

and this:

and the left panel of this (@Marc mndt , I believe), only it looks like an inside out version for a little flair:

 

[Aloysius]

I goofed... pretend I quote responded to @Aloysius 's last post.

This: A wedge of material has been removed, and then it was sewn back together to create a 3 dimensional shape in the sleeve.
View attachment 582846
and this:

and the left panel of this (@Marc mndt , I believe), only it looks like an inside out version for a little flair:

That sleeve doesn't look to be leather. Those jacket backs look like they're reinforcement of pleats.

 

[spectre6000]

That sleeve doesn't look to be leather. Those jacket backs look like they're reinforcement of pleats.

It’s not. It’s a canvas trucker. A wedge of material was removed, and then it was sewn back together to give the otherwise flat panel three dimensions. If it’s not called a dart (darting?) what is it? It looks to be the same technique being employed in the jacket backs (though Marc’s isn’t cut out for decorative purposes) for the same effect.

 

[Aloysius]

It’s not. It’s a canvas trucker. A wedge of material was removed, and then it was sewn back together to give the otherwise flat panel three dimensions. If it’s not called a dart (darting?) what is it? It looks to be the same technique being employed in the jacket backs (though Marc’s isn’t cut out for decorative purposes) for the same effect.

Fair enough, I did say it's "not done on sleeves", but what I meant by that is that it's not a normal part of constructing sleeves. Of course, brands will introduce all kinds of elements, but it's by no means a standard technique and if anything would be problematic because it wouldn't introduce any benefits, merely points of strain.

Not the same technique employed in the jacket backs.

This is darting, just above the pockets. As you can see it's straightforwardly narrowing the garment at that point. It is not being used to generate a pleat or something.

 

[spectre6000]

Right. It narrows the panel, and in so doing, it curves the panel and gives some dimension.

Other examples of the same:
This one does it, but ends in pleats:

In concert with an action gusset thing. This one looks sort of pleat-ish, but I think it's just the thickness of the leather:

This one is just gets a curve into the base of the back panel. As short and tight as they are, I have to figure there's very little material removed:

Ditto, only less height:

This back is fairly common, and I'm not saying it IS (whatever the term is), but it could be if the sections were angled appropriately, and as long as they are, it has a chance to create a very nice curve following the curvature of an actual human back:

 

[ton312]

I goofed... pretend I quote responded to @Aloysius 's last post.

This: A wedge of material has been removed, and then it was sewn back together to create a 3 dimensional shape in the sleeve.
View attachment 582846
and this:

and the left panel of this (@Marc mndt , I believe), only it looks like an inside out version for a little flair:

This sleeve construction can just as easily be achieved without the “darts” or “pleats”. It comes down to how the material
Is cut:

To me this is rudimentary stuff. A basic tenant in leather jacket construction. I have never seen a single 5 Star jacket with properly built sleeves. I just haven’t. I’m not bagging on them or the people who like their gear. But the sleeves for me are simply never right. I chose the example above purely because it best illustrates the curvature of a sleeve. The jacket itself was nothing particularly special.
And the collar sucked ass and was weak.

 

[spectre6000]

Simulpost!

I'm not saying the darting (don't have a better term yet, and that's what I've been calling it in my head all week) is necessary, just a method that I have in front of me that adds both curvature AND dimension. Personally, I also like the detail of it for the style that's in my head.

It clearly IS down to how the material is cut, but HOW is the material cut? What is the actual difference? This is where people with sleeves that are "good" would take detailed photos where individual panels of sleeves are made as flat as possible. I suspect, there is curvature in the cut of these panels, and that's all there is to it. What is the angle though? Is it a gentle curve along the entire length, or are is it straight at one end or the other with a curved section (X%) in the middle?

To wit, here's an image of a jacket pattern where you can clearly see curvature in the arm panels (the panels themselves down in the bottom right corner parts E and F, not shown in the macro views at the top):

I picked that one specifically for the curvature of the actual panels, but there are plenty of jacket patterns out there with clearly straight arms.

Additionally, in the interest of putting things into finite terms for entering into the Fivestar machine, what ANGLE are the sleeves mounted to the body of the jacket? Maybe relative to the side panel (or is it too variable according to waist/hem dimensions)? The angle of the shoulders probably matters as well; what is that angle from some imaginary center line? To fully code a jacket, these details need to be known, otherwise we get whatever the pattern guy on hand puts out.

It SHOULD be rudimentary/elementary stuff. To someone who went to fashion school or something, I'm sure it is. To someone who obsesses over the details of these things, it must be as well. To whomever Shawn's pattern guy, who probably DIDN'T go to fashion school, and for whom it's a job that puts food on the table, and has just been cutting out patterns that people who DID sent to be mass produced, and who doesn't receive the feedback on some random website on the internet in a language he may not even be able to read, it may not be all that obvious. Undoubtedly, several jackets have crossed his work bench with straight sleeves that people must have liked (he may not know that they're liked because they're cheaper to produce or something). Maybe even the vast majority were like this, so it must be how they "should be". But if it's so elementary, we need to be able to figure out how to express it in a manner that the Fivestar machine understands. <= THIS IS THE CHALLENGE