G-1 Jacket without a Fur Collar

Discussion in 'Outerwear' started by G-1_USN_USMC_USCG, Jan 1, 2018.

  1. G-1_USN_USMC_USCG

    G-1_USN_USMC_USCG New in Town

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Colorado Springs, CO, USA
    Fellow Jacket Collectors,
    Was just wondering if anyone had come across any documentation to support removing the fur collar from the G-1 jacket in hot climates (e.g. Cockpit USA sells a G-1 jacket version (the "Forrestal" version) which is supposed to imitate what some Vietnam War aviators did to their jackets while assigned to Yankee or Dixie Station). Does any one know if there is any truth to this suggestion? Makes for a fine and unique jacket...just wondered if it had ever really been done. Thanks for the help.

    Happy New Year
    Mike
     
  2. Fonzie

    Fonzie One Too Many

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    bn1966 and rocketeer like this.
  3. galvestonokie

    galvestonokie Familiar Face

    Messages:
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    Location:
    houston
    i've done the conversion from mouton to goatskin collar since i live in a tropical climate. results have been mixed. in some cases, the new goat collar looks too small. but YMMV
     
  4. Brettafett

    Brettafett One Too Many

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    Watch 80's cult film Tuff Turf ;)

    I understood that it was a personal thing done in theatre... Guess, as everything else in this world... depends who you talk too. Doubt it was documented unless you can find a pic.

    ANJ-3 was a A-2/G-1 hybrid, produced with a leather collar - like an A-2 and G-2 had some fun and an ANJ-3 was the result ;)
     
  5. bn1966

    bn1966 Call Me a Cab

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    image.jpg I love an ANJ 3 :)
     
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  6. Deacon211

    Deacon211 Practically Family

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    999
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    Kentucky
    I really like the ANJ as well, but I'll say personally that I think this claim is stuffed full of wild blueberry muffins.

    First of all, it's almost entirely a Cockpit USA claim and they claim it for whatever era matches the patches on their jacket (PBY pilots, F-4 pilots, etc) which seems entirely too convenient.

    Second of all, understanding that wartime practices often allow a little leeway, you really can't just do what you want with your flying equipment. Many guys in my era wore aftermarket G-1s or ones that had some subtle mods done to them. But a completely different non-fur collar is a pretty noticeable change.

    Third, you really start to wonder who is doing the work on these alterations. Not many tailor shops on Guadalcanal! I'm being facetious of course. But, again depending on the era, Navy/Marine flyers didn't exactly have access to a lot of people who could do this work. Much of the day to day repair work in a squadron is done in the paraloft. And while some of those guys were very talented, much of it is purely functional.

    "Need velcro on your flight suit? All we have is black; and we're sewing it on with green Nomex thread that we use to sew your G-suit!" ;)

    Lastly is the "why?". Pilots already had a summer weight flying jacket in cloth. Why shred your G-1? Especially since you are either going to be flying around at 20,000ft where it is cold, or sitting on the carrier in the South Pacific, where it is so hot you won't be wearing it at all. It just seems like an awful lot of effort.

    Of course, I'm sure there is one guy who did it. So, much like the Cockpit's claim that "an actual Forrestal" pilot picked out the patches for that jacket, you probably can't say that the claim is UNtrue....just perhaps not AS true as the catalogue would have you believe.

    My opinion entirely of course as always.
     
    Technonut, thor, bn1966 and 2 others like this.
  7. galvestonokie

    galvestonokie Familiar Face

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    Deac et al: if memory serves the Aero page is at least partially correct. i have seen a few of these issued ANJ jackets for sale and they vary (shocker) even within the ANJ designation--some had epaulettes, some didn't. but all i've seen had a leather collar and a bi-swing back. what i remember is that this was a short-lived effort to standardize leather flight jackets among the services. but soon, the USAAF decided on nylon (i think) jackets. i believe the ANJ is a better jacket than the A-2 parent because of the bi-swing back. military aircrews must move around some.

    i do agree with Deac, that in my squadron no one (that i knew of) made many changes to issued flight gear. in my case, i had to return it when i was through with it and they wanted it to resemble the issued product. i did get the paraloft guys to adjust the fit of a nylon-velcro paraloft-produced shoulder holster and to update the black paint job on my helmet. i did read somewhere that some Navy pilots purchased mink somewhere while on a Med cruise and had replaced the mouton/dynel G-1 collars with mink. but this would be pretty easy to do and get away with as long as the collar resembled the dark brown original color--and you had someone to do the tailoring.

    just a historical side note: although i believe the leather jackets (G-1 and A-2 families) are generally preferred today over nylon or nomex, we preferred the nylon WEP jackets while flying in Southeast Asia in the winter. we tended to be extremely practical. the reasons for this preference were simple: the WEP jackets were warmer, and IMHO afforded more movement in the back of a gunship (where gunners were responsible for firing and maintaining 6 machine guns per aircraft. and this sometimes included stepping outside into the slipstream to clear guns or assist in jetisonning rocket pods.) i also believe that while Naval service pilots were issued G-1s in flight school, enlisted aircrew received jackets (when available) at the squadron level. i wore an M-65 field jacket while flying for the first couple of months until i obtained a WEP jacket.

    just sayin... bob
     
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  8. galvestonokie

    galvestonokie Familiar Face

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    another thought: at the time we wore the WEPs, no one (that i know of) ever mentioned the fact that they were not nomex and therefore a risk in flight. not sure when the WEPs were no longer issued but i expect in the mid-late 1960s although i understand they are still worn around the squadron area when not flying.
     
    Flightengineer likes this.
  9. Flightengineer

    Flightengineer Practically Family

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    580
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    It was always a mystery for me why nylon was used for these jackets, in case of fire in cockpit, burn injuries are guaranteed.
     
  10. bn1966

    bn1966 Call Me a Cab

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    One that passed through my hands

    photo (9).JPG
     
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  11. galvestonokie

    galvestonokie Familiar Face

    Messages:
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    Location:
    houston
    regarding the use of nylon in the popular WEP jackets, i assume there were two reasons for the nylon. these jackets were being phased out in the 1960s, so i assume they'd been around a while, maybe before the introduction of nomex. during the 1950s, seems like the USAF was also using lots of nylon jackets. also, the WEPs were intended to be the top half of a "poopy" suit, to be worn as an undergarment in a cold weather environment. but who really knows??
     
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