Remove your hat?

[Naphtali]

Long-term solutions to nearly all problems posed -- from oafish people and business entities to smoking bans -- include banding together to form private clubs with private premises. Or, if that is not feasible, to band together and meet socially REGULARLY ?ɬ† la Asimov's "The Black Widowers."

Rather than feel excluded, be exclusionary. If you build it, they will come. And eventually, "we" become a larger group than "them."

Oh, I'm in Missoula, Montana, if any of like mind care to join me.

 

[Raindog]

Naphtali...That could be the answer. Walnut pannelling....Leather chairs...whiskey and port aplenty....cigars from large humidors, free to members...I'd join that!


Jeff.

P.S....AND HUNDREDS OF HAT PEGS WITH A SECURITY GUARD ON THE DOOR!

 

[Naphtali]

Free? Hardly!

Break-even? You betcha!

 

[Raindog]

Haha! Only the cigars would be free Naphtali! I'd say a small profit at the end of the year could be donated to an establishment to persuade them to fit hat pegs or have a hat check girl....


Jeff.

 

[tonyb]

Dang, Naphtali and raindog, you guys are onto something. In the Midwest of my childhood years it was common for folks to turn parts of their basements into at-home cocktail lounges, complete with wet bars and refrigerators and neon beer signs on the walls. Out here on the wet (and relatively mild) side of the Cascades, houses often don't have basements at all.
But I've long contemplated building a second structure on our property in Seattle, where my sister-in-law currently resides. The lot is large, by city standards, and the existing house is small, so a modestly sized new structure could go in without completely eating up the yard. The vision is to trim out and furnish the basement in gentlemen's club style. One of these years, maybe.
Years ago, the fine folks living across the street, in a house with a basement, often hosted all-night gambling sessions. You wouldn't have known anything was happening there unless you knew them well enough to earn their confidence. Well, there were also all those additional cars parked on that long, sleepy dead-end street. But beyond that, their activities had no impact on the neighbors whatsoever. They were quiet, respectful, discreet. In other words, they behaved like grownups should. I miss 'em.

 

[Lincsong]

Wasn't it a 1974 movie?

I thought Mandingo was a 1974 movie about a slave in the the Antebellum South, and Mandango was Kramer mispronouncing Mandingo from the movie. A private club to smoke cigars, play golf, hunt, target shoot, hold a boxing match, discuss events and such as you please is probably not allowed in the U.S. anymore. I'm sure as soon as one was started up again 1,000's of feminist, communists, anti-capitalist, anti private property lawyers from San Francisco and New York would be suing, saying the club is racists, bigot, homophobe, anti-poor, anti-woman, not diverse, unhealthy, unsafe etc. That it is exploiting the busboys, waiters, cooks, janitors, and groundskeepers and all the huddled masses. I believe that the feminists sued the Male Only clubs in San Francisco under the Commerce Clause saying that because women weren't allowed and the men sometimes discussed business, that inter-state commerce was affected. Same about that woman who is suing Augusta National Golf Club. But, like Groucho said; "I wouldn't want to belong to any club that would allow me to be a member."

 

[Biltmore Bob]

Are you related to me???

Here's the thing....most people are idiots, present company excluded of course. Most people will wear and do whatever most of the other sheep do. Along comes a goat who dresses nice and removes his hat indoors. The sheep say, "Oh, he's nice," but they keep doing whatever the rest of the sheep do. Even though they look like crap. It's accepted crap. The poor old goat don't change nothin'.

So, the hell with it. I'll leave my hat on, thank you.

 

[Biltmore Bob]

You're doing great, ZF....

I think it mostly depends upon the joint you're in and the locale.

If you're in some big city fancy-pants restuarant with huge-stick-up-their-butts patrons and nobody else has a hat/cap on while they're eating, you're going to look pretty ridiculous if you don't remove yours. On the other hand, in a cafe in a small town where the male patrons are wearing "Chainsaw World" ball caps and the women are chewing gum and smoking while they eat, then I think it would be quite acceptable to keep your hat on your head.

AND, before ya'll go all PC on me, I spend time in both kinds of places!

BTW... How'd I do on this post BB? Am I getting this "best defense is an offense" approach to posting down right?

...but I think some of the best food is in a greasy spoon diner or Barbeque Shack. I like real food and real people. I can't stand a pretentious snob, so I steer clear of those high falutin' eatin places. While I would never wear a Chainsaw World Gimme Cap, most of those people are the salt of the earth. Give you the shirt off their back if you asked. I was almost in tears watching those WVa coalminers after the mine tragedy. Salt of the freakin' earth, and not an Ambercrombie tee shirt in the crowd.

Let's talk about movies next, shall we?

I know...I know, I'm a butt hole....

 

[Zemke Fan]

I think...

we all make mistakes when we pigeon-hole people with such meaningless stuff as: smoker vs. nonsmoker; city vs. country; liberal vs. conservative; Texan vs. Marylander; fancy restuarant patron vs. diner folk. What matters to me? Can you count on the person to do what they say? Be there when you need them? Stand by their principles? Are they kind and considerate? Thoughtful and not callous? That's what matter's when all is said and done...

PS: As W might say: "Not gonna rise to the movie bait, not gonna do it...!"

 

[Mr_Misanthropy]

I know this is kind of an old topic, but I figure this is a relevant question. I'm one of those folks who always removes a hat inside a restaurant of ANY kind of a house or church, etc. But I was wondering today, what about in a large grocery store, or a mall or Target or something? It seems like it'd be more of a hassle than anything, maybe the same sort of thing as a gymnasium or stadium. Thoughts?

 

[Sinatra]

I take my cue on on this issue from my favorite artist:
http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/hopper/street/hopper.nighthawks.jpg

However, I respect anyone believing otherwise.

 

[Mr_Misanthropy]

Most apt observation, Sinatra. Nighthawks is one piece I definately need framed and on my wall.

 

[Magus]

Well for me it depends on the place and the situation. If I have on my "worn down beater" hat and have been working outside in it...and go down to the local mexician restaurant or coffee shop or burger joint for lunch, well then the hat stays on, because the head under it is worse than the hat.

If I am out with my wife and we go to a club with a "vibe" to it (Jazz club, dance club/bar martini bar etc...)the hat stays on. In that case its part of the "feel" of the evening.

If we are out to dinner for a romantic evening...nice eatery..off comes the hat, but I carry it with me and place it somewhere at our table.

As to hat checks...you rarely if ever find them here on the west coast if you do, the people running them have no idea how to properly handle a good hat. Interestingly enough...for all the bad things said about the French...hostess at restaurants in France know exactly how to take care of hats and coats. In every restaurant when out for an evening meal (ok...night time as the don't even start searving until at least 7:30pm) the hostess assisted us in taking off your coat and hat, then carfully hung the coat on a rack and placed the hat there as well. At the end of the meal they brought us our coats and helped us put them on as well. Gotta give credit where it is due.

 

[Mr_Misanthropy]

Yes, I can definitely agree with you mostly there. I think with my new fedora coming I'll want to show it off, and one of my favorite places here in town happens to be a Mexican restaurant, and come to think of it, it has a perfect ambiance for a vintage suit and hat. I'll try to get pics, I've been meaning to anyways. Anyways. I guess I'll start bending my rules and wearing my hat in some more places.. before now, I've really never worn hats at ALL, except for when I was in the service, and wore them on duty, I rarely wore hats, so, it's all new. But, I'm excited and looking forward to it.

 

[Barry]

Mine comes off indoors for the most part. I like the way I look in Fedoras and Caps but there is no way I'm going to sit in a nice restaurant or someone's home and keep 'em on. The hat comes off the minute I walk in the door....unless I'm taking a photo for the Fedora lounge. (Had to go back in and edit this one, hah hah).

Btw: I think sitting in a diner is an exception to the rule.

I will be on campus today and I'll try to stop by the library and pull up Post, Vanderbilt and Manners and see what they have to say.

Barry

 

[RedPop4]

I agree with the last few posters. I, normally, remove my hat indoors as a matter of courtesy. It's interesting how society has rebelled against things like this claiming it was all arbitrary to begin with. I normally leave that hat ON in grocery stores, big-box retailers and such as it is too much to try and keep track of the hat if it's removed.

Remember Bum Phillips never wore his hat when he coached indoors? Fun stuff.

 

[John in Covina]

Public & public respect.

We did run thru some of this recently and there is a theme where it has to do with what kind of place it is, what you are there to do and whether or not you need to show respect to the place or people. So, if you have any inkling you should remove your hat, taking it off probably would not be wrong.

If you are in a busy "pedestrian" place like a train station, bus terminal, hotel lobbey you can get away with not removing your hat. Visiting a church or mortuary, no option, hats off.

If you are eating it is probably a good idea and the better the establishment is the better it is to take off the hat. But if the place is crowded and finding a place to put your hat becomes problematic, then keeping it on becomes more of an option.

Now take the same situations listed above but you are meeting a client, hats off. So level of place and persons you are interacting with help shape the situation.

We need a emoticon of smiley tipping his hat!

 

[Michael Mallory]

Unofficially, if you're at a table in a restaurant, pop the lid. If you're at a counter, then it's okay to leave it on.

 

[RedPop4]

JiC very well said, and I agree totally.

 

[Pilgrim]

Having scanned through some of the old guides and new comments, I've internalized this set of rules:

- Hats on in corridors and elevators (public spaces), off in private offices.

- Hats may (not must) stay on at the bar, but should be off at any the restaurant table.

- Tip or remove hat to a lady (even if she's probably just a female).

- Hats come off for sit-down meetings; they stay on for standing - ran into you in the hallway - meetings.

- When I park a hat with a flat brim, it sits on the brim. When the hat has a shaped brim that might flatten, it sits upside-down, on the crown.

Works for me.