Spear point collar shirts

Discussion in 'General Attire & Accoutrements' started by PADDY, Oct 10, 2007.

  1. Rabbit

    Rabbit Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,454
    Location:
    Germany
    Yes, they are. Your notion of oxford cloth being strictly casual may come from certain fora and blogs where the "OCBD" (oxford cloth button down shirt) finds constant mention.

    In pre-WWII aesthetics, texture and pattern - which are two very different things - used to be more important than in the 50s and 60s when solid white shirts became a relatively common choice for wear with lounge suits.
    A 1950s look with white shirt:

    [​IMG]


    Before the war, shirts for lounge suits usually had some surface interest. Oxford, both the semi-solid and patterned versions, and end-on-end are good choices - patterned plain weaves, too, of course. In period photos and especially in 1930s movies, those subtle patterns easily look like white or light-colored solids. This striped shirt would probably look white in a movie.

    [​IMG]

    Especially in the early talkies (1930-34), the b&w film material couldn't handle certain colors and contrasts too well. For instance, men sometimes looked as if they were wearing lipstick because the lips would be rendered too dark in relation to the skin. Added to that we often view copies that are of lower resolution. You may sometimes see a shirt pattern during a brief closeup, but most of the time they look solid, like these low-res stills:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    On this last two images, you can see a striped pattern:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Take a look at this selection of late 20s to mid 30s tailored clothes. They harmonize best with subtly patterned shirts, or at least semi-solids like oxford and end on end without pattern. The main difference between pre-WWII and 50s/60s patterns in tailored clothes is that the early stuff tends to have more intricate patterns and stresses texture more.
    For example, the light suit on the right has a blue windowpane, but added to that it has a self-fabric windowpane and a faint stripe in another, not quite matching grey yarn.
    The tan/rust overcoat with brown buttons has herringbone as the main pattern, but it also has sections of checkerboard - a pattern within a pattern.

    You'll find the total opposite to this approach in 70s suit patterns which emphasize simpler patterns and largely disregard texture.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2015
    Tommy-VF51 likes this.
  2. APP Adrian

    APP Adrian A-List Customer

    Messages:
    364
    Location:
    Toronto
    Thanks for sharing :).
     
  3. Two Types

    Two Types I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    5,456
    Location:
    London, UK
    I have quite a few Luxire shirts and I would say the Oxford cloth ones are better than the poplin ones. Some of the poplin is fairly light and the oxfords hold their shape neater. Nothing wrong with the poplin but the Oxford seem to me to wear better.
     
  4. volvomeister13

    volvomeister13 One of the Regulars

    Messages:
    107
    Location:
    United States
    Wow, that's a huge help. Thanks, guys!
     
  5. Rudie

    Rudie Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,042
    Location:
    Berlin
    I had a shirt with a short European spearpoint made by Jantzen this spring and a lot went wrong. The neck size was two sizes too small and everything was fused instead of unfused. I sent the shirt back for alterations. Now the fit is near perfect but, again, they fused collar and cuffs. Still, I ordered another shirt from them, as the fit was better in the first attempt than any other maker I tried. Luxire couldn't even get me a decent fit after seven shirts. This time I asked for two detachable collars. Easier to replace when something goes wrong and they double the shirt life. What can I say. I micromanaged everything as best as I could and this time I received a really good shirt with a short spearpoint and a tab collar. The collars were copied from pictures (thanks to Fastuni and Papperskatt for giving me the measurements), the rest of the shirt was copied from a shirt of mine that is an exact copy of one of Baron Kurtz's early 30s British shirts.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  6. Patrick Hall

    Patrick Hall Practically Family

    Messages:
    541
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Really love that fabric Rudie. Is it part of their normal catalogue? That alone might lure my business.
     
  7. Rudie

    Rudie Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,042
    Location:
    Berlin
    Yes, it is. A very nice Oxford. They have the same in pink. It is quite difficult and time consuming to browse all their fabrics. The presentation leaves a lot to be desired. But they do have rather nice fabrics if you take the time to search them out.
     
  8. Metatron

    Metatron One Too Many

    Messages:
    1,495
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Agreed, lovely fabric. I have been looking for a nice colourful but casual and textured shirt.
    Are the collars and cuffs finally unfused this time?
    I take it this shirt has the baggy 1930s fit? I never found an original in my size. Could you please post a fit picture?
     
  9. volvomeister13

    volvomeister13 One of the Regulars

    Messages:
    107
    Location:
    United States
    Great shirt! I think I like that fabric more than Luxire's offerings. Any chance I could get the collar dimensions from you?
     
  10. Rudie

    Rudie Call Me a Cab

    Messages:
    2,042
    Location:
    Berlin
  11. fiftyforfifty

    fiftyforfifty Sponsoring Affiliate

    Messages:
    182
    Location:
    NY
    Really smart shirt with great collars
     
  12. Two Types

    Two Types I'll Lock Up

    Messages:
    5,456
    Location:
    London, UK
    That's rather nice, Rudie.
     
  13. Matt Deckard

    Matt Deckard Man of Action

    If Brooks Brothers would wimply make their buttondown pattern without the buttons, they'd have a fine spearpoint.
     
    jamesmac1801 and esteban68 like this.
  14. BR Gordon

    BR Gordon One Too Many

    Messages:
    1,152
    Location:
    New Mexico
  15. nihil

    nihil One of the Regulars

    Messages:
    206
    Location:
    Copenhagen
    [​IMG]

    Spear point collars you say...
     
  16. Bruce Wayne

    Bruce Wayne My Mail is Forwarded Here

    Guess who just bit the bullet on 5 Matt Deckard Paramount shirts?
     
    rtrann9ball and jamesmac1801 like this.
  17. rtrann9ball

    rtrann9ball New in Town

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    San Gabriel Valley
    Hey gents! I'm a novice when it comes to buying and dressing vintage. I've finally ot the chance to pick up some nice high waist trousers, but I'm having trouble finding dress shirts and would like to use a collar bar with it. Custom and vintage are a little out of my price range for the moment, but I'd still like to be as accurate as possible.

    Do you gents have any suggestions on OFF THE RACK brands that have a more vintage cut, point collar that'll do the job for the time being before I get some customs? Right now I have Croft and Barrow and Stafford shirts, but would like to try other brands that might have a better cut. Thank you in advance!!
     
  18. rtrann9ball

    rtrann9ball New in Town

    Messages:
    5
    Location:
    San Gabriel Valley
    Would love to see them if you get a chance!
     
  19. Bruce Wayne

    Bruce Wayne My Mail is Forwarded Here

    When I get them I'll be sure to post pics.
     
  20. Dreamofgilgamesh

    Dreamofgilgamesh A-List Customer

    I know you said 'off the rack' but you really should check out Natty Shirts, I have several of their shirts and the price isn't far off shop bought and you can design the sort of thing you described.
     
    rtrann9ball likes this.

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