Los Angeles or San Francisco: Which city is more vintage, more Golden Era, more noir?

Mr. 'H' · Sep 20, 2008

For any Californians, or for anyone who has lived there, I would like to ask which end of the Golden State has cities with a more Golden Era feel? In specific, a more noir feel?

I don't necessarily mean which city was more noir back in the 40s. I mean which city is more vintage now, in terms of living there in 2008?

When I think of LA, I think of all the major noirs, I think of Sunset Boulevard, Double Indemnity, L.A. Confidential, the whole Black Dahlia affair etc. But has this noir past been subsumed in the sprawl of modern freeways and suburbanization?

Then again, outside LA, there are so many towns that look vintage: Pasadena and so on.

When I think of San Fran, I think of Dark Passage, Vertigo, Sam Spade.

Then I think of Santa Rosa, where Hitchcock filmed Shodow of a Doubt (and where The Man who wasn't There was set as an homage to the former). I also think of The Killers, and that coastal town where the Birds was set.

JimInSoCalif · Sep 29, 2008

San Francisco by far. That city has a great deal of charm and history.

Los Angeles is such a sprawl that the name applies to a lot of different areas and I don't think there is anything charming about downtown L.A. except for the Bradbury Building.

http://www.archiplanet.org/buildings/Bradbury_Building.html

The pictures don't do it justice and I believe that it has been used in more movies than stated on that page. 25 years ago or so, the city talked about condeming it because it did not meet current fire codes, but sanity prevailed.

Pasadena has some lovely areas, but, alas, when you get that far away from the coast, it tends to be rather smoggy.

For much of the L.A. area, when things get old, they either get run down or torn down. We don't seem to be too much for preservation down here.

Cheers, Jim.

dhermann1 · Sep 29, 2008

Wasn't Sam Spade from Frisco? Wasn't Nora Charles? And how about Lauren Bacall driving that neat 47 Ford woody in Dark Passage, and Kim Novak leading Jimmy Stewart a merry chase? And dear beautiful Irene Dunne in I Remember Mama. I rest my case.
Somehow when LA is the setting for a film, it's merely a backdrop. San Francisco becomes more of a character in the story.

The Wolf · Sep 29, 2008

I agree that San fran is more noir.
Santa Rosa still has a lot of the golden era charm however the downtown of "Shadow of a Doubt" is hidden in the new downtown.

Sincerely,
The Wolf

Lady Day · Sep 29, 2008

SF is designed to be lived in, not just a place where you sleep.

You dwell within the citay, you go out and relax in it, you are part of the microcosm.

Of corse Im partial

SF also still has working street AND cable cars.

LD

MK · Sep 29, 2008

.

For me it is even. Due to Sam Spade, SF will always be a part of Noir history, but don't forget all the Philip Marlowe stories were set in LA. Also so many Nior movies were shot in Hollywood and the surrounding areas that trying to seperate LA from Noir is like separating the bone from the marrow.

Mr. 'H' · Sep 30, 2008

Wow, super feedback here.

(check out the poll results)

I really had pre-supposed LA until I actually started to think about it properly.

I love Lady Day's comment about how San Fran is a city to live in, not just sleep there. How apt.

I saw a screening of Vertigo on a 70mm print and I can't get San Francisco out of my head. I am mesmerized by it.

Mr. 'H' · Sep 30, 2008

JimInSoCalif said:
I don't think there is anything charming about downtown L.A. except for the Bradbury Building.

Cheers, Jim.

Hi Jim,

I love the Biltmore Hotel.

I personally am completely enamored of it!

Ace Fedora · Oct 1, 2008

I love San Francisco. I've only been twice, but I would move there in a heartbeat. Every street, every building, every object just seems to ooze history.

My travel budget has been slashed since the second kid came along, but I'm hoping to be back next year.

LelaViavonie · Oct 1, 2008

I truly Love SF... But I do live in Old Town Orange.. A beautiful historical place that just takes you back in time. There are still little markets from the 40's still running and the houses surrounding the Orange Circle are all amazingly beautiful and well taken care of. They were all built between the years of 1900's to 1952.. around there... the little town is so friendly.. everyone rides their bikes.. stops at the local coffee house to chat...they have wonderful antique shops and record shops... furniture shops that make repo furniture from the 40's and 50's... its just my kind of place.

Like I said.. I love SF. but to visit.. I always get lost

Mr. 'H' · Oct 1, 2008

LelaViavonie said:
There are still little markets from the 40's still running and the houses surrounding the Orange Circle are all amazingly beautiful and well taken care of. They were all built between the years of 1900's to 1952.. around there... the little town is so friendly.. everyone rides their bikes.. stops at the local coffee house to chat...they have wonderful antique shops and record shops... furniture shops that make repo furniture from the 40's and 50's... its just my kind of place.

That sounds really nice and quite vintagey.

Do you have any current photos of the town? Do you think it's a great place to live?

LelaViavonie · Oct 1, 2008

I do have photos.. but Im actually at home right now on my mac.. and well.. i forgot how to right click on this thing to get the link.. lol

I absolutely think its a great place to live....

Its quite... and neighbors are always outside watering their laws.. talking to each other... when your ride by on your bike they say hi... i have never lived in a place like that before.

Its very safe.. they have a wonderful neighborhood watch program.. and all the neighbors keep and eye out on the kids...
They have a civic center where the kids can go play.. they have swing lessons at the woman's club (open for all) They have a street fair once a year for october fest.. and TONS of delish food from all around the world.

Once I found this place.. I knew I was going to call it home

LelaViavonie · Oct 1, 2008

Here is the link to the city... they have some pictures.. but i have more that I have personally taken

http://www.oldtowneorange.com/index.html

Inky · Oct 1, 2008

LelaViavonie said:
Its very safe.. they have a wonderful neighborhood watch program.. and all the neighbors keep and eye out on the kids...
They have a civic center where the kids can go play.. they have swing lessons at the woman's club (open for all) They have a street fair once a year for october fest.. and TONS of delish food from all around the world.

Once I found this place.. I knew I was going to call it home

And Old Town Orange has a great Cuban restaurant, Felix's Continental Cafe in the circle. (I grew up in Fullerton).

I love the old parts of OC!

I have to add that Balboa Park in San Diego and some parts of the city still have a beautiful Golden Era vibe.

decodoll · Oct 2, 2008

As a native Californian who lived in San Francisco for 15 years, it wins by a landslide! Please don't call it San Fran or Frisco though! If you want to abbreviate, it's simply SF. The others are a big local faux pas.

V-Sweetheart · Oct 2, 2008

I am second generation native, although I live elsewhere temp.

I say that SF is more vintage out of the two. As stated, LA Was the site of several noir films, however that noir feel has not been retained. SF has retained quite a deal of the original places. Yes several of the old haunts are gone, but one can currently live vintage in SF. In addition to cable and street cars, there are several vintage era monuments (Coit tower, Beach Chalet, Maritime museum), Apartment buildings too numerous to list (The Dark Passage apartment building for one) not to mention original restaurants (Bimbos, Tadich Grill, Far East, Sam's)Plus don't forget the Golden Gate Bridge ! Oh yes and several private clubs from the Vintage era that have been preserved (SF City Club, the Elks). Whew. I could go on and I have not even started on the surrounding areas. But to add to the "Noirness", there is of course very active and thriving vintage dressing scenes. Yes, multiple groups that sometimes over lap and sometimes don't. Those people dress, drive and live in some darned fabulous vintage places. Not to mention one fellow flies vintage planes, and another owns his own private rail car. (There used to be a vintage air service but I think they discontinued it.) Ok, I need to stop, because I don't want to bore you. But yes there is a lot of vintage in SF still.

Widebrim · Oct 2, 2008

dhermann1 said:
Wasn't Sam Spade from Frisco? Wasn't Nora Charles? And how about Lauren Bacall driving that neat 47 Ford woody in Dark Passage, and Kim Novak leading Jimmy Stewart a merry chase? And dear beautiful Irene Dunne in I Remember Mama. I rest my case.
Somehow when LA is the setting for a film, it's merely a backdrop. San Francisco becomes more of a character in the story.

But Phillip Marlowe was from L.A. And I Remember Mama is as noir as Plan 9 From Outer Spacelol... I'm prejudiced, but to me, L.A. seems more than a "backdrop" in films like The Blue Dahlia, Sunset Boulevard, Criss Cross, Quicksand, Gun Crazy, and This Gun For Hire. As to which city still retains the "noir" flavor, I would say that it is a tie between the two. If you have lived in L.A. all your life (or at least a good part of it), and are a fan of noir, then you're likely to know where to look. The advantage SF has over L.A. is that it still has whole sections which are vintage, whereas in Los Angeles everything is so spread out; one finds a couple of commercial vintage buildings here, a block of vintage houses there, several old alleys everywhere, and so on. Besides the Bradbury building, there is the Biltmore, Union Station, the downtown post office, Philippe's, The Pantry, Cliftons, the sleezy Skid Row motels, all the movie theaters on Broadway that still haven't turned into discount jewelry stores, and of course the Oviatt on Sunday nights when it becomes the Cidada Club!...And Hollywood still has a noirish feel to it, at least at night; when you turn left from Hollywood Blvd. onto Las Palmas, it's Gun Crazy all over again.

Mike1939 · Oct 2, 2008

My vote is for San Francisco. I used to live on Bush St. between Taylor and Mason in a apartment very similar to Sam Spades, as shown in the Maltese Falcon. Every time I stepped in the elevator and closed the gate it reminded me Brigid O' Shaughnessy's face. When I walked down Bush street to work I would pause a moment at Burritt and gaze at the plaque where Miles Archer was done in. Sometimes I'd stop at John's Grill for lunch or spend the evening sipping Gin and Tonics at the Top of the Mark when there was a swing band playing.

In my opinion San Francisco takes the cake for being vintage and noir. As for Los Angles proper I've never lived there. Though I did grow up within the county and there is a lot of vintage atmosphere in the smaller towns.

Miss 1929 · Oct 4, 2008

San Francisco and Oakland!

Although I love SF - and lived there for about 15 years... I also adore my new home of Oakland. More Art Deco buildings in downtown Oakland than anywhere else outside of Manhattan...plus the people are friendly on the street, there are several cute neighborhoods with streets suitable for walking and shopping (so if you live near one, you can walk and not drive), lots of trees. And MUCH more affordable housing than SF.
If only they would bring back the Key Route streetcar system, I would be in heaven!

JimInSoCalif · Oct 6, 2008

Mr. 'H' said:
Hi Jim,

I love the Biltmore Hotel.

I personally am completely enamored of it!

Oh, you are right of course, it is wonderful. It has been so long since I have been downtown I forgot about it.

I think I won't make any more absolute statements as there are probably a few other treasures that I have forgotton about. As someone said above, they are scattered about. It is too bad they are not all in one place.

At one time people used to go to downtown L.A. and Hollywood too to department stores to do their shopping, but that was back in the days of trolley cars.

Thanks for the correction and the photo, Jim.

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