Ascots

Marcus · Sep 1, 2009

If it does taper (don't have it in front of me), it's not very much. Could it be a bow tie?

Barchetta52 · Sep 1, 2009

Looks like an ascot to me. My flight instructor - convinced he is a reincarnated Battle of Britain pilot - wore one in the 1980's and gave me a couple. Once you get the hang of, it's kind of cool for certain occassions.

Spitfire · Sep 1, 2009

Looks like you just got yourself a Ascot - or Cravat, like we like to call it over here. But it's a nice one. Wear it in good health.:eusa_clap

Wolfmanjack · Sep 1, 2009

Yep, thats an ascot (AKA a day cravat).

Wear it, you'll look great in it...and the ladies love 'em.

Here is how you tie it. Enjoy.

Bugsy · Sep 2, 2009

I too think it's an ascot. Wear it well. They're wonderful.

Torpedo · Oct 2, 2009

Hello,

I have decided to try cravats, or ascots as they are known too. I have got a brace of them, all vintage 60's, some classic patterns, some more daring:

1. No label, acetate
2. Grosvenor range by Tootal, acetate
3. No label, acetate (?)
4. Grosvenor range from Tootal, acetate.
5. No label, silk
6. Tootal, acetate

The first is banner-cut, (straight without shaping), the others shaped and pleated. 2, 3 and 4 would be reversible.

I will let you know when I actually start to wear them!

Lionheart · Oct 2, 2009

Nice collection!:eusa_clap

Torpedo · Oct 2, 2009

Not one to make any idle threats

, today I am already sporting one of the above collection...

Spitfire · Oct 2, 2009

Really dashing, Topedo!!!!:eusa_clap :eusa_clap

Torpedo · Oct 3, 2009

Spitfire said:
Really dashing, Topedo!!!!:eusa_clap :eusa_clap

Thank you, I had some inspiring examples in this very thread, if you know what I mean...

MarkL · Oct 7, 2009

Love your ascot, Torpedo!!!

Torpedo,

You look amazing in that ascot!!! And I love the photos you posted a few days ago of your collection. Great start!!!!

Mark

Torpedo said:
Not one to make any idle threats , today I am already sporting one of the above collection...

BinkieBaumont · Oct 7, 2009

The Cravat in the Antipodes

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,25718954-5013173,00.html

Evan Everhart · Oct 8, 2009

Torpedo said:
Hello,

I have decided to try cravats, or ascots as they are known too. I have got a brace of them, all vintage 60's, some classic patterns, some more daring:

1. No label, acetate
2. Grosvenor range by Tootal, acetate
3. No label, acetate (?)
4. Grosvenor range from Tootal, acetate.
5. No label, silk
6. Tootal, acetate

The first is banner-cut, (straight without shaping), the others shaped and pleated. 2, 3 and 4 would be reversible.

I will let you know when I actually start to wear them!

The term "cravat" is applied to the thing itself and is derived from "Croat" as originally, the things were seen worn by Croatian mercenaries when they had marched into France after a victorious campaign in which they were employed by the French monarchy. This was some time in the mid to late 1600s if I recall correctly. The French admired their nifty neck-wear so much that they began to emulate them.

This explains the neck-wear itself only; it was originally a square of silk or lace which was folded on the diagonal with the opposing points meeting in the middle at the middle edge where one would fold an edge to form a triangle. after the initial two points are folded and meet, narrow folds are folded along that same initial fold until one has numerous voluminous folds that look like to trapezoidal figures meeting along a line; wide bottom to wide bottom, then one takes this folded piece of fabric with the line showing outside and wraps it about the neck and folds it in any number of ways.

The cravat is only known as an Ascot when one folds it in a square knot in such a manner that the center of the knot is smooth and square. This is then often pinned through with a stick pin that has a cap for the edge so as to avoid the pin poking one's jugular. The pin is usually worn at either a diagonal or horizontally. This is the same style of neck-wear that equestrians wear for formal fox hunting, dressage, and various other forms of formal equitation. Good show then. Enjoy!

By the by, the Ascot should really be worn with a stand up collar. I wear it on occasion with an open collar when casually riding, but when I doing so, I usually do not wear a stick pin. Furthermore, when wearing an Ascot and stand up collar, I always wear a waist-coat as well. It's the height of fashion as they say...Later then!

grantway · Oct 16, 2009

ascots - shirt collar

Agree that the weight of the material helps in retaining the knot. A button down collar also helps stops the ascot /cravat from slipping down. I prefer heavier silk ascots; I also have a couple of large silk squares that look good. I think this form of neckwear is having a bit of a comback as I have noticed more of them in advertisements and few younger guys in Sydney wearing. People give give me comlpiments when I wear mine.

Alexi · Oct 16, 2009

Evan Everhart said:
The term "cravat" is applied to the thing itself and is derived from "Croat" as originally, the things were seen worn by Croatian mercenaries when they had marched into France after a victorious campaign in which they were employed by the French monarchy. This was some time in the mid to late 1600s if I recall correctly. The French admired their nifty neck-wear so much that they began to emulate them.

This explains the neck-wear itself only; it was originally a square of silk or lace which was folded on the diagonal with the opposing points meeting in the middle at the middle edge where one would fold an edge to form a triangle. after the initial two points are folded and meet, narrow folds are folded along that same initial fold until one has numerous voluminous folds that look like to trapezoidal figures meeting along a line; wide bottom to wide bottom, then one takes this folded piece of fabric with the line showing outside and wraps it about the neck and folds it in any number of ways.

The cravat is only known as an Ascot when one folds it in a square knot in such a manner that the center of the knot is smooth and square. This is then often pinned through with a stick pin that has a cap for the edge so as to avoid the pin poking one's jugular. The pin is usually worn at either a diagonal or horizontally. This is the same style of neck-wear that equestrians wear for formal fox hunting, dressage, and various other forms of formal equitation. Good show then. Enjoy!

By the by, the Ascot should really be worn with a stand up collar. I wear it on occasion with an open collar when casually riding, but when I doing so, I usually do not wear a stick pin. Furthermore, when wearing an Ascot and stand up collar, I always wear a waist-coat as well. It's the height of fashion as they say...Later then!

psst. croat was a common term for light calvary (aka hussar) that dressed in the "Croatian" style, even the Scots fielded "croats" in the Bishops and Civil Wars. The croats that the term cravat came from were probably just frenchmen dressed up funny.

Lionheart · Oct 16, 2009

grantway said:
Agree that the weight of the material helps in retaining the knot. A button down collar also helps stops the ascot /cravat from slipping down.

Agreed - but I also wear ascots with regular spread collars. It does tend to take more patience to keep the ascot from slipping with a spread, though. Especially if you wear your spread collars on top of your sportcoat lapels.

BinkieBaumont · Oct 16, 2009

"I have rather a "Stable" of Ascots, my favourite was an Austin Reed, which i lost a few years back unfortunately, they look splendid with a simple Polo Shirt with high boots and a riding crop, or with a tweed jacket, a shirt in pale checks and a shooting stick."

What is the term for a multitude of "Ascots" a Flock, a gagle, a pride, a stable? Mmmmmm?"

Evan Everhart · Oct 16, 2009

Alexi said:
psst. croat was a common term for light calvary (aka hussar) that dressed in the "Croatian" style, even the Scots fielded "croats" in the Bishops and Civil Wars. The croats that the term cravat came from were probably just frenchmen dressed up funny.

Actually sir, they were Croatian Mercenaries fielded by the Austro-Hungarian allies of the French. Furthermore, Croatians are a far faaar cry from Hessians or "Hussars" which were entirely different from the Croatian or Slavic and Scythian or Dacian derived Croatians. Hungarians are hence Hun; Magyar derived people and the style of dress worn by Hungarians and Croatians are quite mutually exclusive and distinct from one another as can be observed from various historical illustrations, especially those dealing with military uniforms.

Incidentally, the Croatians can arguably be presented as one of the oldest groups of Western people to make and continue the use of neck-wear, particularly knotted and perhaps decorative neck-wear at least in part, as may be observed on Trajan's column in the portion depicting the defeat of the Dacians and Thracians who lived in what is now Croatia, Yugoslavia, Romania and other adjoining districts though, not as a cohesive cultural force as such.

Furthermore, the Croatians are not particularly known for their cavalry as are the Hungarians.

That is all.

Evan Everhart · Oct 16, 2009

grantway said:
Agree that the weight of the material helps in retaining the knot. A button down collar also helps stops the ascot /cravat from slipping down. I prefer heavier silk ascots; I also have a couple of large silk squares that look good. I think this form of neckwear is having a bit of a comback as I have noticed more of them in advertisements and few younger guys in Sydney wearing. People give give me comlpiments when I wear mine.

Try it with a detachable collar shirt sir, either with or without the collar attached. It's rather dashing in most instances. Furthermore, the detachable shirt really suits the cravat beautifully and is more or less historically contemporaneous with it.

I wear my cravats like that all the time, tied into an Ascot knot (square knot), sometimes pinned, and usually with my riding clothes, my frock coat, or my cut-away coat. (sometimes when I feel particularly historically sentimental, I'll wear an Ascot-tied cravat with a three piece tweed suit and a stand up collared shirt with single cuffs - for cuff-links, and some spats. ) The dissimulation between my own accouterments and those of my fellows in the street and abroad is certainly gratifying, edifying, and amusing...

As to your knot sliding about...Are you tying an Ascot knot? If you're just using a "once through" type of knot, (I cannot for the life of me remember the technical term for those things as I never use them except as the basis for other knots) it may be sinking because the "once through" knot does not have much structural integrity. Try an Ascot knot with your cravat. I have always done so and never had any problem with my cravat flinching, sliding or swaying. I hope I've helped in some way and thanks for reading!

grantway · Oct 16, 2009

cravats

Lionheart said:
Agreed - but I also wear ascots with regular spread collars. It does tend to take more patience to keep the ascot from slipping with a spread, though. Especially if you wear your spread collars on top of your sportcoat lapels.

Hi Lionheart
I like the look of widespread collars but that style doesn't suit me. I have several cravats / ascots (and I don't know the collective noun for a collection of them....? a 'cravatalection'?).

And, Hi Evan Evaneverhart, I tie them in different ways and usually manage to find a suitable knot to ensure they stay in place depending on the sort of material. Still, it's fun some times to readjust them periodically.

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