Public Enemies

Forgotten Man · Dec 10, 2009

Atinkerer said:
For instance; "In 1906 John's mother died. He was just three. He disappeared while the family was at the funeral home. When finally found he was standing on a chair trying to wake up his mother."

You know, its parts like that were left out of a film about a "person" that could have made it more interesting.

That's what Mann missed out on... Building the man who became "Dillinger" the bank robber!

Atinkerer · Dec 10, 2009

There you go!

Brian Sheridan · Dec 10, 2009

Forgotten Man said:
You know, its parts like that were left out of a film about a "person" that could have made it more interesting.

That's what Mann missed out on... Building the man who became "Dillinger" the bank robber!

Mann made a film that examined what was essentially the last stand of the "wild west" bank robber. This wasn't a Dillinger biopic. We didn't get a back story on Dillinger just as we learned very little about Purvis. Both men were more symbolic of the changing times and how crime was handled by law enforcement and perceived by the public.

I think Mann deserves credit for not making simply a biography of Dillinger. He aimed higher. Whether or not he achieved on that level is debatable but the debate should be on if his vision was fully realized on screen.

KY Gentleman · Dec 10, 2009

Brian Sheridan said:
Mann made a film that examined what was essentially the last stand of the "wild west" bank robber. This wasn't a Dillinger biopic.

I defintetly got that out of the movie, too. The developement of technology and the strengthening of the FBI curtailed the "wild west" type of crime spree. Good point!

High Pockets · Dec 10, 2009

My "pre-ordered" DVD came this afternoon!

Got the popcorn machine warming up!

Forgotten Man · Dec 10, 2009

Brian Sheridan said:
Mann made a film that examined what was essentially the last stand of the "wild west" bank robber. This wasn't a Dillinger biopic. We didn't get a back story on Dillinger just as we learned very little about Purvis. Both men were more symbolic of the changing times and how crime was handled by law enforcement and perceived by the public.

I think Mann deserves credit for not making simply a biography of Dillinger. He aimed higher. Whether or not he achieved on that level is debatable but the debate should be on if his vision was fully realized on screen.

Aimed higher? lol Simply making a biography? lol You guys SLAY me!

You all seem to come to the same assumption that making a movie that includes small details, a building up of a character, and being historically true would mean a PBS biography of a bank robber... lol that's hilarious!

The truth is, it's TOUGH to make a movie that's accurate and entertaining but, it's possible. The sights may have been set high but, hit way below the mark. Creating and establishing a story is vital to a good movie, Mann missed on this. You can tell a story about a historic person, toss in historic facts and make people connect and learn as well as enjoy it all. Instead, they just toss you in wile a jail break is in progress, you feel as if you just joined the film half way through and it's full of 34-36 cars and poorly picked props... not to mention that the chain of events after the jail break weren't in order until the Biograph scene.

I truely think that people really want to know MORE about who John Dillinger was, his story, not just another modern "action" movie taking place in 1934.

Atinkerer · Dec 11, 2009

After seeing that movie I just had to get a DB overcoat

Brian Sheridan · Dec 11, 2009

Forgotten Man said:
Aimed higher? lol Simply making a biography? lol You guys SLAY me!

You all seem to come to the same assumption that making a movie that includes small details, a building up of a character, and being historically true would mean a PBS biography of a bank robber... lol that's hilarious!

The truth is, it's TOUGH to make a movie that's accurate and entertaining but, it's possible. The sights may have been set high but, hit way below the mark. Creating and establishing a story is vital to a good movie, Mann missed on this. You can tell a story about a historic person, toss in historic facts and make people connect and learn as well as enjoy it all. Instead, they just toss you in wile a jail break is in progress, you feel as if you just joined the film half way through and it's full of 34-36 cars and poorly picked props... not to mention that the chain of events after the jail break weren't in order until the Biograph scene.

I truely think that people really want to know MORE about who John Dillinger was, his story, not just another modern "action" movie taking place in 1934.

I am sure we will all be looking forward to your "Dillinger" movie when you make it.

ratpack66 · Dec 11, 2009

I got the dvd on Tuesday.So far I must of watched it 5 times

Bruce Wayne · Dec 11, 2009

I just checked out the Blu-Ray extras. the only extra it has that is not on the DVD is a gangster movie trivia challenge.

Levallois · Dec 11, 2009

I found the "Public Enemies" movie to be entertaining. Unfortunately, that's pretty much all I care about anymore. Biographical? Historically accurate? Multi-dimensional characters? No, nope, not even a little bit. Did I enjoy it? Affirmative, you bet, yessiree! That's why I asked Santa to bring me the Blue-Ray for Xmas.

Nonchalant · Dec 11, 2009

Brian Sheridan said:
I am sure we will all be looking forward to your "Dillinger" movie when you make it.

It's a shame he won't, as I'm sure Forgotten Man could do a better job - he counts some serious students of John Dillinger and 1930's crime wave history amongst his friends, and could use them as consultants.

But Mann of course was more interested in telling a slight story about how the sun was setting on the flashy, shoot from the hip old west gunslinger, who was being supplanted by a new, faceless and better organized mafia. It's all interspersed with a few set piece action sequences and a "love" story - and vaguely set in some time period that resembles the 1930's. Very little period flavor or historical context such as the American public's own infatuation with Dillinger, or even the Great Depression was evident. The members of the Dillinger gang, who were all strong personalities in their own right, were explored but briefly.

For such an expensive film as this must have been, the now well-worn Saving Private Ryan "you are there" style cinematography and rapid fire editing made the production feel cheap. Except that with Mann this approach was used for the entire film, and not merely limited to the shootouts (which weren't very bloody at all - see the 1970's version). It seemed that half the film was spent looking at close-ups of Johnny Depp's nose while he was firing a Thompson.

All Forgotten Man needs to make his film are a couple of camcorders, and some 1940's cars - why nitpick about minor historical details such as these, what's a few years here or there going to matter, right? The modern audience can't tell the difference anyhow.

Mr. 'H' · Dec 11, 2009

Nonchalant said:
It's a shame he won't, as I'm sure Forgotten Man could do a better job - he counts some serious students of John Dillinger and 1930's crime wave history amongst his friends, and could use them as consultants.

All true.

Nonchalant said:
Very little period flavor or historical context such as ... the Great Depression was evident.

Well, here it was....

KY Gentleman · Dec 12, 2009

ratpack66 said:
I got the dvd on Tuesday.So far I must of watched it 5 times

I'm right there with you. I keep re-watching, too!

Marc Chevalier · Dec 12, 2009

KY Gentleman said:
I'm right there with you. I keep re-watching, too!

Maybe you two should watch it together on your couch or something.

.

Atinkerer · Dec 12, 2009

So, oxblood hats are the color of eggplants? I thought oxblood would be more reddish brown, but judging from the picture on Optimo it's eggplant color. I can see Depp wearing it, maybe, but it's not for me I think.

Tony

Brian Sheridan · Dec 12, 2009

I just re-watched it again last night. I enjoyed it more. Mann told the story he wanted to and did quite a good job. He apparently did not want to make a documentary, much to the chagrin of many here.

Unfortunately, despite some critical acclaim, PE did not do well at the box office. "Amelia" did even worse. Those results will hurt the chances of more period films being made. We can expect more vampires and less fedoras in the future.

Marc Chevalier · Dec 12, 2009

Brian Sheridan said:
Unfortunately, despite some critical acclaim, PE did not do well at the box office. "Amelia" did even worse. Those results will hurt the chances of more period films being made.

And it might hurt the chances of more Mann films being made. Every cloud has a silver lining.

.

Bruce Wayne · Dec 12, 2009

Atinkerer said:
So, oxblood hats are the color of eggplants? I thought oxblood would be more reddish brown, but judging from the picture on Optimo it's eggplant color. I can see Depp wearing it, maybe, but it's not for me I think.

Tony

The Oxblood appears as different colours under different lights situations.

Levallois · Dec 12, 2009

Brian Sheridan said:
Unfortunately, despite some critical acclaim, PE did not do well at the box office.

Mann movies aren't blockbusters. "Heat" did even worse than Public Enemies when it was released but made up for it in DVD sales. I am told that for a movie to make money, it must take in twice what is cost. Rumors were that PE cost about 100 mil to make and it's taken in 206 mil domestic and foreign (more foreign money than domestic!). Couple that with what will be healthy DVD sales and Mann will continue to make movies for us to enjoy (or not).

John

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