50s Leather Quality; Rants & Raves

[tmitchell59]

Wow!

I just received a vintage Harley with two rotted sleeves! Part of what started this rant was my concerns over HD Vintage Quality. This does answer question for me.

I know there are lots of reason for lots of things and this and that and variables to be added and then analyzed. I Would be very careful around their 50s Vintage jackets. They were made to a Cost not necessarily Quality. I get it 100% It was the Times.

They were made to a Cost not necessarily Quality.

All about Cost, that is a 50s thing. People probably had a similar conception of Quality then and now. There were a lot of choices in the 50s. Everyone made at least one form of Motorcycle jacket if not several styles. Leather was a strong garment in the 50s. More post-war demand led to a range of need in Quality, Quantity and of course Price.

as an Irony I could post many, many fine 1950s leather jackets, jackets that probably won't be leaving and I've got another on the way.

 

[tmitchell59]

Open my opinion being changed, but at the moment I think only something old but close to unworn would work for me!

I have them, Old and like New. They exist.

 

[jonesy86]

I don't find many vintage that fit, I need a 23.5", or 24" P to P, with at least 26" sleeves, and 25" preferably 26" back.

 

[jchance]

I haven’t handled much vintage leather jackets myself but I appreciate a thread like this one. For those to have handled many, many vintages, which ones were the gold standard (like CSC) and which ones were duds? Obviously original Buco and Sears Hercules are highly sought after and command high prices for good reasons, but how is the quality of Sportsclad/Penney’s/Montgomery Ward, Levi’s, Wolf, Blatt/Grais, Beck, Bates, Fidelity, Brooks gold label, Kehoe, etc. for comparison? To keep it simple, what are your ratings for them, 1-10?

 

[jchance]

Below is a ranking list (10 being the best) claimed by a person who has personally handled the listed jacket brands. You’d prob disagree but I’d like to hear why.

Contemporary:

Schott (7)
Ruggest West Co (6)
Master Supply Co (6)

80s / 90s:

Brooks (6)
Reed Sportswear (5)
Drospo (5)

70s:

Sears Oakbrook (6)
Montgomery Ward (5)
Brimaco (7)
Fidelity (7)

60s:

Excelled (8)
British Cycle Leathers (9)
Cal-Leather (9)
Beck (9)

50s:

Sears Hercules (8)
Harley Davidson (pre-1966 only) (7)
Kurland Star Sportswear (7)
Blatt Chicago (9)
California Mfg (8)
California Sportswear (8)

https://www.reddit.com/r/leatherjacket/comments/1lpbjqw/_/n0uxbaq

 

[AHP91]

I haven’t handled much vintage leather jackets myself but I appreciate a thread like this one. For those to have handled many, many vintages, which ones were the gold standard (like CSC) and which ones were duds? Obviously original Buco and Sears Hercules are highly sought after and command high prices for good reasons, but how is the quality of Sportsclad/Penney’s/Montgomery Ward, Levi’s, Wolf, Blatt/Grais, Beck, Bates, Fidelity, Brooks gold label, Kehoe, etc. for comparison? To keep it simple, what are your ratings for them, 1-10?

Below is a ranking list (10 being the best) claimed by a person who has personally handled the listed jacket brands. You’d prob disagree but I’d like to hear why.

Contemporary:

Schott (7)
Ruggest West Co (6)
Master Supply Co (6)

80s / 90s:

Brooks (6)
Reed Sportswear (5)
Drospo (5)

70s:

Sears Oakbrook (6)
Montgomery Ward (5)
Brimaco (7)
Fidelity (7)

60s:

Excelled (8)
British Cycle Leathers (9)
Cal-Leather (9)
Beck (9)

50s:

Sears Hercules (8)
Harley Davidson (pre-1966 only) (7)
Kurland Star Sportswear (7)
Blatt Chicago (9)
California Mfg (8)
California Sportswear (8)

https://www.reddit.com/r/leatherjacket/comments/1lpbjqw/_/n0uxbaq

There’s too much variation in between years and jackets. I don’t know much about post 1950s, my experience is that generally speaking, the newer jackets on average don’t come close to vintage, say pre 1955. Heavy horsehide from the 30s - circa 1950s is miles ahead of stuff you’ll find today.

Many makers used different leathers (goatskin, horsehide, cape skin) so it’s tough to say definitively what’s best, it comes down to preference. I’ve handled a number of vintage jackets - the best in hand I’ve felt are Ralph’s Pugh steerhide early 1940s and Guidemaster Wolf horsehide 1950.

 

[JMax]

While fun, ranking is impossible imo. There are huge differences between 70s Fidelity and 50s Fidelity MC jackets, between a 50s Kurland MC jacket and Kurkand’s other styles (the stitching on Kurland/Sportclad MC jacket was impeccable and the hide top tier), between 40s Cal and 60s Cal, between all the decades Sears had jackets made, and so on. AHP is right, the earlier generally the more impressive imo.

And British Cycle Leathers a 9 on whatever scale is a head scratcher to me. Must have handled a unicorn.

 

[tmitchell59]

I forgot about this thread! Didn't get much traction when first published. Quality has always been an interest in mine handling leather jackets. Through the years of handling vintage jackets I certainly have my favorites.

I think more about era than maker or label. 1935 through the mid 40s was the Golden Age of leather jacket styling . Many of the styles coveted today came from this time frame. I see a very competitive market where innovation was the driving force. All the large retailers sold a variety of styles in all manner of leathers. WWII changed fashion. It is easy to see in the catalogs, from fancy styles to more practical.

I believe too , that the height of Tanning was also during this Golden Age. Tanning was a huge industry during this time and tanning leather was an art and science. This produced some of the finest leather I have seen. Leathers that have now stood the test of time; many vintage leather jackets are 80+ years old and still wearable.

No matter the maker, the leather had to be quality. This is the key. If you have lousy leather it doesn't make a difference who makes or sells the jacket.

Today, there is a range of quality, in the 30s/40s it was all at a higher level. The 50s showed an overall drop in quality of leather; horsehide faded away and large production numbers demanded more jackets at reduced prices. Quality suffered, but no one seemed to notice.

This topic would make for a nice dissertation, too much for a post on a thread.

Me? I like west coast makers, which probably used leather tanned on the West Coast.

Yes, Ralphs-Pugh Steerhide is at the top of my list.

 

[ton312]

Received this (what I assume is) a 50’s labeled Sport Jack. Really nice horse. Super thick. Thicker than my Wards and short lived Durable in this style. What’s the deal with this label? Was it in fact All Weather that made these?

Not really too interested in wearing anything outside the 60’s-70’s anymore but I’ve always had a soft spot for this style
21” replacement Talon #5 en route to replace the shot to **** main zip. So I must be kind of interested. LOL.

 

[jchance]

Received this (what I assume is) a 50’s labeled Sport Jack. Really nice horse. Super thick. Thicker than my Wards and short lived Durable in this style. What’s the deal with this label? Was it in fact All Weather that made these?
View attachment 715712 View attachment 715713
View attachment 715714
Not really too interested in wearing anything outside the 60’s-70’s anymore but I’ve always had a soft spot for this style
21” replacement Talon #5 en route to replace the shot to **** main zip. So I must be kind of interested. LOL.

No connection to All Weather or Sportclad.

Photos of cool jackets owned by others (non-brand specific)

That All Weather is amazing. Some more photos: To be honest, I haven't really been into MC jackets so I'm not sure what features to look for. What do you like about this jacket in particular?

www.thefedoralounge.com

 

[ton312]

No connection to All Weather or Sportclad.

Photos of cool jackets owned by others (non-brand specific)

That All Weather is amazing. Some more photos: To be honest, I haven't really been into MC jackets so I'm not sure what features to look for. What do you like about this jacket in particular?

www.thefedoralounge.com

Thanks for the link! Kind of what I figured as I haven’t ever seen an All Weather in this style. The Penny’s jackets had a very different pocket set up with piping around the hand warmers so I wouldn’t have thought it relates to Sport clad. I’ve had this sport clad in my Etsy favs list for probably a decade. It’s ended and reposted a million times. Price never changes though. LOL.

So many makers of this banal style that for whatever gets very little love. Perhaps that’s why.

 

[jchance]

My beef with 1930s and 1940s leather jackets is their usage of cotton thread (before the commercialization of poly cotton thread in 1950), which usually rot by now if they have not gone through one entire-jacket restitching. The jacket is so fragile to wear, you can hear the seams ripped at each movement with the jacket on. It’s more like a buyer beware.

Pre-Talon #10 zippers are fragile. 1950s Conmar zipper is trash.

On the positive side, 1930s-1950s hide quality is excellent. I’m surprised they have survived this long and are still in wearable condition.

 

[jchance]

There isn’t a Penney’s thread, but how did 1950s Penney’s leather jackets compare to Sears and Ward’s?

 

[tmitchell59]

There isn’t a Penney’s thread, but how did 1950s Penney’s leather jackets compare to Sears and Ward’s?

I believe you found a Penney's thread. This is an interesting question that has had me thinking and reviewing the Penney thread.

In the 30s and 40s JC sold top quality jackets like all the other big retailers. They did not have a catalog until 1963 so there is a gap in knowledge compared with Wards, Sears and even Spiegel.

Penny started out with the Sportclad labeled MC jackets in the early 50s. These jackets, made by Kurland, are fine quality jackets, on par with the other makers. When they dropped the Sportclad label they seemed to have lost somthing. There are much fewer jackets seen with the post Sportclad label.

I now they continued to label jackets made in the West and made in California. I have had jackets made by CSC with the newer label. There were only a few makers producing for these larger retailers. To offer quality "budget" jackets Sears employed Appalachian Tanned and Tallored, I believe Penney used American in Utah. They were not up to CSC, Roughwear, standards, but cost less.

It may be that Penney was a smaller player in the 50s without the catalog option.

 

[jchance]

I believe you found a Penney's thread. This is an interesting question that has had me thinking and reviewing the Penney thread.

In the 30s and 40s JC sold top quality jackets like all the other big retailers. They did not have a catalog until 1963 so there is a gap in knowledge compared with Wards, Sears and even Spiegel.

Penny started out with the Sportclad labeled MC jackets in the early 50s. These jackets, made by Kurland, are fine quality jackets, on par with the other makers. When they dropped the Sportclad label they seemed to have lost somthing. There are much fewer jackets seen with the post Sportclad label.

I now they continued to label jackets made in the West and made in California. I have had jackets made by CSC with the newer label. There were only a few makers producing for these larger retailers. To offer quality "budget" jackets Sears employed Appalachian Tanned and Tallored, I believe Penney used American in Utah. They were not up to CSC, Roughwear, standards, but cost less.

It may be that Penney was a smaller player in the 50s without the catalog option.

Thanks! Along with Spiegel, Aldens was another big department store. Have you/anyone here ever handled an Aldens / Aldencrest leather jacket and can speak to their quality / compare it to the big three players? Any ideas as to who made Aldens’ leather jackets? I see more Aldens / Aldencrest survivors than Penney’s or Spiegel tbh.

 

[cbez]

My old Fidelity had very very nice horsehide horsehide, but not leagues ahead of modern quality ones. I'd say on par with the best vanson, shinki, nitta, polish horse I've seen.

 

[jchance]

My old Fidelity had very very nice horsehide horsehide, but not leagues ahead of modern quality ones. I'd say on par with the best vanson, shinki, nitta, polish horse I've seen.

Idk if I’m too used to vintage horsehide’s thickness or what, but I recently checked out Rainbow Country’s shinki horsehide and that thing appears paperthin compared to what I’m used to.

 

[cbez]

depends what kind. The one I sold to Mark was quite thick and stiff. Keep in mind any A-2 will be a split hide.

 

[jchance]

I’ve handled a number of vintage jackets - the best in hand I’ve felt are Ralph’s Pugh steerhide early 1940s and Guidemaster Wolf horsehide 1950.

I had a 1950s GMW HH (Ram-Jack) before that I sold at a loss (just $25, small price to pay for a lesson). It wasn’t my style, but the hide was beefy. Based on your comment, I gave it another shot and bought another 1950s GMW HH (Kit Karson) that is more in line with my style. Fingers crossed.

I’ve also taken a closer look at RP, but none has come my way yet.

 

[tmitchell59]

Any ideas as to who made Aldens’ leather jackets? I see more Aldens / Aldencrest survivors than Penney’s or Spiegel tbh.

Other than the jacket, of mine, you posted above I have not handled any Alden jackets. I don't see many Aldens, same with Spiegel.

The jacket you referenced above is in the same style as the Windward labeled style, which were made by California Sportswear.

The leather tags will tell more about the makers.