"I Don't Wanna Grow Up"

[Paisley]

I just read about something called "rejuveniles": "This curious modern hybrid, adult in physique yet deliberately madcap and childlike in tastes, habits and sometimes dependency, is also variously known as a 'kidult', a 'grup', a 'twixter' or an 'adultescent' in a culture half-mad with 'Peter-Pandemonium'."

This is, of course, in contrast with the days of 50 or more years ago when many people had little formal education and started work early; when women had a couple of kids by age 21; and children sometimes helped support their families.

Was it better when kids weren't children for long, since it instilled responsibility and character, or is it better now that many people never grow up, but seem to be having more fun?

 

[MelissaAnne]

To my thinking, this is a double-edged sword. We need to keep our childlike attitude about a lot of things in this world, but we also need to impose our adult mentality on many more. Responsibility comes to mind - taking care of kids, paying your bills, etc., don't generally fall under the "kid" category. And when an adult displays this kid mentality, it only creates heartache.

I've seen this mentality mostly in adults who had to become responsible at a very early age - like taking care of younger siblings after the loss of a parent, or just because there were just too many kids for the mom to take care of. If the childhood was robbed and the child had to fast-forward to adulthood, then I can completely understand why as adults they don't want to have the responsibilities. Unfortunately, it's usually very difficult to break this cycle.

I really admire those that have created a healthy balance between the two - child and adult - something that is difficult to do.

 

[magneto]

Was it better when kids weren't children for long, since it instilled responsibility and character, or is it better now that many people never grow up, but seem to be having more fun?

Respectfully, I think this is a false dichotomy (either behaving like an adult at a child's age, or being an adult and behaving like a child). I think the problem is these modern day people acting like children are not keeping the good/idealized aspects of childhood (from wide interest/curiousity/dare I say, faith), but rather self-centeredness and petulance and lack of consideration for others, abdication of grownup responsibility : the Freudian "king baby" syndrome writ large. (Again, not to offend anyone but I don't think "being as little children to enter the Kingdom of Heaven" meant this kind of childishness (living with your parents until age 40 and playing Nintendo in your fleecy tracksuit.)
Disjointedly, Ellie.

 

[mysterygal]

Today is for sure better. The problem I see is that a lot of parents are just not stepping up to the plate with thier role of parenting. Kids need discipline, some more than others. Most of what a child learns is modeled by the parents. There is a slow process of where 'mothering' is gradually decreased to where the adolescent can start learning good choices on their own.

 

[Lady Day]

Today the attitude of 'you have to do it right the first time' overtakes a lot of kidults, and when they do fail, instead of the try again mentality, they retreat to mommie and daddie to hold them and coddle them and tell them 'you can say here as long as you need to'. They say this to kids who have never gotten feet under them to make it in that big wide world.

Also a lot of kids now a days dont want to work up the ladder of success. They want to get the top spot with no 'paying your dues' work at all. And when that does not happen, see paragraph one.


LD

 

[Mrs. MK]

It was better then than now

In my opinion, things are worse now than they were. As far as raising kids, I think you have to have a balance with children. They need to learn to be responsible as is appropriate for their age, but I don't think they should be pushed into growing up too soon.

 

[Feraud]

I just read about something called "rejuveniles": "This curious modern hybrid, adult in physique yet deliberately madcap and childlike in tastes, habits and sometimes dependency, is also variously known as a 'kidult', a 'grup', a 'twixter' or an 'adultescent' in a culture half-mad with 'Peter-Pandemonium'."

What a co-incidence. I was just browsing Barnes and Noble and came across a book called Rejuvenile : Kickball, Cartoons, Cupcakes, and the Reinvention of the American Grown-up. I wonder if it is the same book.
The question of "growing up" is a tricky one. It certainly does seem that young adults today are less mature and do not display "adult" tendencies. It is easy to judge young adults today and say their parents aren't doing a good job, etc. We have to take into consideration how different today is from say the 1940's. There is no World War going on, there is much less social pressure for women to marry, stay home, and have children. Many more men and women today are receiving and continuing education. Our economy today tends to push adults back into the workplace therefore moving potentially maturing adults "back to square one", etc. There are many external factors that one could use to argue and say young adults in the 21st Century need to ...adapt themselves in order to fit in and succeed in today's society! For better or worse the higher divorce rate is another factor that tends to put a person at a "square one" position.
Technological advances are such that entertainment and social activities are not as conducive to social gathering as they probably were in the past. For example, I can sit at home and play video games, watch dvd's or sports channels on cable t.v. I am not defending childish adults but trying to show a bigger picture than we probably consider when ponder these "then vs now" questions..
My overall opinion is parents are not raising their children in a responsible manner. All you have to do to see this is go to dinner or a movie in NYC. The spoilded brats run rampant over their ineffectual parents. This can take a toll from one generation to the next.

 

[Matthew Dalton]

I think a lot of the kids running wild might be to do with parents no longer using physical punishments on their kids, like spanking. Of course not everyone did it at any time, but it used to be much more mainstream.
Personally I'm going to aim to never do it with my kids.
My feeling is people now see it as horrible, but they don't bother to research alternate disciplines that actually WORK to take it's place.
All I see now is generally they shout at the kid, the kid shouts back and then goes back to what he/she was doing.

 

[Lady Day]

What a co-incidence. I was just browsing Barnes and Noble and came across a book called Rejuvenile : Kickball, Cartoons, Cupcakes, and the Reinvention of the American Grown-up. I wonder if it is the same book.
The question of "growing up" is a tricky one. It certainly does seem that young adults today are less mature and do not display "adult" tendencies. It is easy to judge young adults today and say their parents aren't doing a good job, etc. We have to take into consideration how different today is from say the 1940's. There is no World War going on, there is much less social pressure for women to marry, stay home, and have children. Many more men and women today are receiving and continuing education. Our economy today tends to push adults back into the workplace therefore moving potentially maturing adults "back to square one", etc. There are many external factors that one could use to argue and say young adults in the 21st Century need to ...adapt themselves in order to fit in and succeed in today's society! For better or worse the higher divorce rate is another factor that tends to put a person at a "square one" position.
Technological advances are such that entertainment and social activities are not as conducive to social gathering as they probably were in the past. For example, I can sit at home and play video games, watch dvd's or sports channels on cable t.v. I am not defending childish adults but trying to show a bigger picture than we probably consider when ponder these "then vs now" questions..
My overall opinion is parents are not raising their children in a responsible manner. All you have to do to see this is go to dinner or a movie in NYC. The spoilded brats run rampant over their ineffectual parents. This can take a toll from one generation to the next.

I understand what you are saying but you have to admit that since the Baby Boom generation, the first generation after the war, that parenting did take a drastic turn. It use to be, 'let the kid be a kid, but also let them know that you WILL need to grow up, and not generally at your own pace', to 'we have to keep them kids as long as they can so they dont 'miss out' on their childhood and hate us afterwards'. The narcism of it all as about a smelly as a fresh cut onion.

I know 30 year olds who still live at home and have no intention of leaving. They are not there to help with rent or an extension of the family structure. They are being 30 year old kids, because someone didnt lay the tracks for standing up and making it.

LD

 

[Feraud]

I think a lot of the kids running wild might be to do with parents no longer using physical punishments on their kids, like spanking.

I do not think so. Children do not wake up one day and decide to run wild and get arrested. They start small. Tantrums, throwing things, demanding, etc... This is where you nip it in the bud and it requires no physical punishment. I believe parents are not establishing early on how they expect their children to behave in public, towards parents, adults, and other children.

I understand what you are saying but you have to admit that since the Baby Boom generation, the first generation after the war, that parenting did take a drastic turn. It use to be, 'let the kid be a kid, but also let them know that you WILL need to grow up, and not generally at your own pace', to 'we have to keep them kids as long as they can so they dont 'miss out' on their childhood and hate us afterwards'. The narcism of it all as about a smelly as a fresh cut onion.

I know 30 year olds who still live at home and have no intention of leaving. They are not there to help with rent or an extension of the family structure. They are being 30 year old kids, because someone didnt lay the tracks for standing up and making it.

LD

I see what you are saying and it makes me ask the question. Was it the Baby Boom Generation that raised those children who laid the groundwork for all we hold terrible today in parenting? So much for "The Greatest Generation"...[huh]

 

[jake_fink]

I do not think so. Children do not wake up one day and decide to run wild and get arrested. They start small. Tantrums, throwing things, demanding, etc... This is where you nip it in the bud and it requires no physical punishment. I believe parents are not establishing early on how they expect their children to behave in public, towards parents, adults, and other children.

Feraud,

You're my hero. Thank-you. Reason is a wonderful thing, ain't it?

 

[Twitch]

One thing for sure is that kids leave home at a later and later age. I see way too many people where I bite my tongue from saying, "Hell, when I was your age I was married and had a kid," when they begin some tirade about how tough they got it but can't be responsible for anything at all.

 

[Feraud]

Living at home is not necessarily the same as being lazy or spoiled. Due to the economy or educational demands I can see a child living at home in their 20's.
That is different from a young man who lives at home and his mommy is still doing his laundry!
My son (currently 12 yrs. old) is welcome to live at home while he is attending school, starting a business, saving for marriage, or a home mortgage. I expect to get a definite sense of a "Life plan" in terms of his actions.

 

[Matthew Dalton]

I do not think so. Children do not wake up one day and decide to run wild and get arrested. They start small. Tantrums, throwing things, demanding, etc... This is where you nip it in the bud and it requires no physical punishment. I believe parents are not establishing early on how they expect their children to behave in public, towards parents, adults, and other children.

Good point. It boggles my mind how any parent could fail to nip those buds though.

How do you think this happens? Perhaps something to do with many families having no stay-at-home parent?

 

[Lady Day]

I see what you are saying and it makes me ask the question. Was it the Baby Boom Generation that raised those children who laid the groundwork for all we hold terrible today in parenting? So much for "The Greatest Generation"...[huh]

I think a lot of it was the parents of the BBG, in wanting to give them everything they didnt have. Its a domino effect from there.


LD

 

[LizzieMaine]

Don't forget the biggest influence on the upbringing of Boomer kids -- Dr. Spock. If you go back and read his book, he never advocates not disciplining kids, but a lot of parents tended to misinterpret what he did write -- Spock encouraged mothers to bond emotionally with their children, and he discouraged spanking, but he never told parents to not set boundaries or forgo discipline entirely. Unfortunately, too many parents didn't get far enough in the book to get that message.

Dr. Spock used to summer around here, and he'd occasionally stop into our local hospital for checkups -- he was very elderly by this time. As it happens, my mother works the admission desk at the hospital, and of course when Spock came in, she knew who he was and decided to have a little fun. And the following dialogue ensued...

Ma -- Dr. Spock, huh? The one that wrote the book?

Spock -- That's right. Did you use it?

Ma -- I sure did.

Spock -- How'd your kids turn out?

Ma (without looking up) -- They're all in jail!

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Back in the '60s, my mom's pediatrician gave her this advice: "Read Dr. Spock's book cover-to-cover, then throw it away." In other words, study, but don't neglect to give your common sense a workout.

.

 

[Feraud]

Good point. It boggles my mind how any parent could fail to nip those buds though.

How do you think this happens? Perhaps something to do with many families having no stay-at-home parent?

In reality it is very easy to under discipline! Two working parents are one example in many when it comes to letting the children slide.
Here are quick examples:
- Parenting through guilt. Some adults have had a rough life growing up and and/or bad relationship with their parents and feel guilty disciplining their children. They think by not disciplining their children they are fixing their dysfunctional family relationships. That never works.

- Mom & Dad work 9-5. The attitude is one where the last thing anyone wants to do when they come home is discipline children. The result you let minor bad behaviors slide until they get out of hand.

- Not understanding how children need and grow with good structure. You
teach them this is for dinner, no more television for the day, time for bed, reading time, etc. These things should be rarely negotiable. Especially on school days!

- Parents who are not as smart as their 3,4,5 year old child! Parents do not realize their young children are learning exactly how to get what they want by their behavior! For example. A child wants daddy's attention. They say, "daddy come play with me." Dad ignores. The child throws a doll at a china cabinet. The child now has daddy's undivided wrath (a.k.a. attention). Your child has now learned a lesson. Don't blame them for learning!

- "Women's work". Some men "in the old days" took less parenting responsiblilty than is necessary for the child. It was a "woman's job" to raise the kids. This was not always the case but I have seen it in my own and others families. These "traditions" sometimes carry over into current families.

- Too many children. I know we love our big families but can a stay at home mom or dad really discipline 4, 5, or six children! And keep their sanity?? Of course it can be done but I have seen siblings feel neglected and withdraw or act out based on lack of attention. Does the middle child syndrome ring a bell?

- Being a single parent. The toughest job of all! Society tends to look down on these parents (usually a woman). These parents are the mom and dad to their children. This is the hardest and least appreciated job around.

I am sure our members can come up with many other situations they have experienced to add to the list.

 

[Paisley]

Yes, it all starts with parenting. But after a point, you can't blame your parents for how you have turned out (everyone here seems to get that). That's part of growing up.

So, how about when people grow up: is it Ok for them to be "rejuveniles" if they don't hurt anyone? If they meet their responsibilities, whatever those may be? Is society losing out because many adults want to stay kid-like in many ways?