Ladies suits

[Lauren]

There is no doubt that many 40's styles were fabulous for women. Especially the early 40's, and I respect immensely women's ingenious uses for fabrics that were rationes (say goodbye to the suits, boys. We're making them over for ourselves... I can hear Daniel gasping right now!). However, if you compare many 40's styles they look very 1980's. Maybe not "hollywood" 40's, but take a look at some of the sewing patterns and catalogs from the mid 40's.

I think that the color palate of clothing of earlier decades shock many people. In my studies of costume, the victorians, who supposedly wore mostly black (due in part to the death of Prince Albert and Queen Victoria's choice to wear black from the time her husband died until her death) actually had a miriad of colors to choose from. I have seen some very bizarre color mixes (like bright yellow with pink, chartruse and orange, etc). No matter what era, suits look flattering and daring on a woman. Some of my favorite suits date to around 1907-1912, when the empire waist was still higher and the cut slim (think the boarding suit in Titanic). Then with the great war, women adopted a more masculine version of the suit. By the 20's it became a staple in the working woman's wardrobe... women had found the ability to hold a job that didn't nessecarily involve domestic service or factory work (think the shirtwaist factories in New York), and they were unwilling to give all the jobs back to the boys following WWI. The 30's found the classes merging and ready made clothing being available to the lower class woman as well as her high society sister, although in differing qualities of fabric, and many women were taking up office work and wore suits in order to town down their sexual femininity (considered a threat to the workplace) that was portrayed in many dresses of the time . This continued to the adoption of pants as early as 1933 to more "daring" women, and the suit and pantsuit were a more sensible alternative to a dress in WWII, as the woman now had seperates to mix and match to make her wardrobe more versitile. The suit is fasciniating in my opinion, not merely for asthetic value, but social history.

 

[jamespowers]

All in all, look at it this way, the 30's and 40's had such great style, that most designers are still using those years as reference for their "new lines".

Yes, and they end up screwing up the cut and fit. It just isn't the same. It looks better than the 70s though.

Regards to all,

J

 

[Wild Root]

Yes, this day and age is known for it's screw ups!

Root.

 

[Lauren]

Well, you're right about the 80's thing. But, I wouldn't say that the 40's look 80's, I would say that the 80's look 40's! Seeing that the 40's came first. Early 80's also had a lot of 50's influence as well. I have seen some wear 80's dresses and wear their hair in the 40's fashion and you know, it works for some. It's really sad that the 70's were really bad copies of the 20's and 30's, and then the 80's were really bad reflections of the 40's and 50's

Haha! Toatlly agree. I should have phrased it that way, since the 40's came first. UGH! Some of the 70's "30's" can make you shudder, and the same with the 80's "victorian" stuff. What amazed me was when I was in fashion school the students HATED the fashion history class that was required, and I even overheard students saying "what does this have to do with modern fashion?" I don't know why we have to take this class". Look around! Fashion is constantly recycled!

Some of the 80's stuff can be very well adapted to look 40's, and without much difficulty... then there's the 40's piece I swear is from the 80's, but upon further examination, I realize I'm wrong! It's all about the constuction when you look on the inside of the garment (tags, seam finishing, buttons, buckles, etc).

When all is said and done, the 30's and 40's suits look much more elegant on women than many modern suits. There's something about the classic styles that can make a younger woman look refined and older, and an older woman look sophisticated and younger.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Fit and balance is what I see more of when looking at the 30's suits.

 

[Wild Root]

Well, that's not exactly accurate. There was fit and balance in the later years, just a different kind. It exenterated certain areas more then the previous styles. The 30's were way more fitted and shoulders were keeping with the natural form. They did have some puffy shoulders too in the mid 30's.

In the 40's it wasn't really as tightly fitted as the 30's. But, that's because of the "Drape Shape". Long, flowing drapy styles were the thing and big shoulder pads were in like Flynn! Those outfits offered balance to a woman's or man's body, just enhanced the shoulders more and made every one look a little more broad up top.

If you want to talk bout styles that didn’t have much balance then the teens and twenties are definitely unbalanced. Look at some of the hats from the TITANIC era! Biggest hats ever. In the 20's every thing was WAY more baggy and loose. Elegant, but loose.

The 1930's offered some of the most breath taking styles! Some of the stuff Myrna Loy wore and Ginger Rogers I will never for get!

Root.

This dress of Ginger's to some may look 40's, buit it's from the 1935 RKO film "Shall We Dance".

Here is a photo of Glenn Miller with Maryon Hutton. I see a nice balance of fit here. This is about 1941.

 

[Wild Root]

I think this is just so, so, cool!

Rita, you look smashing!

This is a mid 30's photo of Joan. I'd say she has some big shoulder pads too.

Enjoy.

Root.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Fit and balance is what I see more of when looking at the 30's suits.

Ladies suits Root, suits.

 

[Lauren]

I agree and disagree with you both.

Fashion doesn't work if it's not balanced in some form. There is some exceptions to the rule, where an area is accentutated more than usually (like the widebrim hats Wild Root is talking about in the teens, which tend to make a woman look more like a nail, with the hat as the nailhead). There is formal and informal balance. In the 30's there was a very large empasis on certain areas of the body, and if you think about it, art deco was a very interesting combination of harmony, combining symmetry and the assymetrical. I think this is why in the late 20's, 30's and early 40's you will see a large bow on one shoulder, large buttons down only one side, etc. In the 40's there were a lot of "balanced" shapes, with the outfit seeming more like a mirror image of one side to another- like prints on both sides of the shoulders, pockets on both sides of the jacket, etc... but there were always acceptions to the rule. And don't forget that shoulder pads made the outfits in the 40's appear more masculine, and they reached their climax- do you think that could have something to do with the boys being away at war?

In general, I would say that the 30's accentuated the natural form of a woman (with the help of very good undergarments) and the 40's enhanced the woman's figure (with the help of very good undergarments, and padding of various forms- yes, women even padded their hips, breasts, and buttocks back then, and combined with the shoulderpads, this created quite an interesting shape). The 30's hugged the woman's torso, the 40's hugged the shoulders and hips, gently draping over the bust and waist, unless a belt was used to cinch in the extra drape. I know there are exceptions to everything, and nothing I have stated is carved in rock anywhere I have seen, but these are my general observations of the period looks. the early 30's fit much more loosely than the mid to late 30's, empasising more of the hips and upper torso (not breasts), and the late 40's became much more tight fitting, skirts became wider and longer, and outfits much more feminine- having in part to do with the end of WWII and many women returning home to make the happy housewives we have come to know and love to be steriotypical of the 1950's.

 

[Wild Root]

Cool I'll drink to that :cheers1: Root beer that is

I know this thread is about suits, but I wanted to show some other outfits just for fun.

Root.

 

[jitterbugdoll]

It is important to point out that the fashions of each era were designed to accentuate and support the desired figure of each era. For example, the long, slim lines of 1930s gowns were designed to complement the 'perfect' thirties figure--slim-hipped, narrow-waisted and in general, slinky. And yes, most women wore foundation garments to help give them that perfect figure. In fact, even those that fit the mold still wore foundation garments, as this was part of the image for a 'lady'. In the 1940s, clothing did become more tailored and masculine in response to the war. I find it very true that people confuse the styles of each decade, and they often associate details like puffed sleeves and ruffles with WWII (I find that most people can not correctly identify my outfits and hairstyles, and have said everything from “were you inspired by ‘Chicago’?� to “You look very 1960s!�) Although these elements are distinctly late 30s, they were indeed still in circulation due to rationing and the general attitude of making do with what you had. However, the styles that were designed and produced during WWII are quite different than the styles that were out at the end of the 30s.

In the late 40s, after the end of WWII, clothing again became more feminine and frivolous. Extra yardage was used and clothing was accented with detailing that had to be left off just a few years earlier. The 'New Look' was in response to the tight controls of the war--women could now buy the clothing they had been dreaming about while waiting for the end of the war—what a luxurious idea!

And because the desired build had shifted—moving from the slim 30s, to the “natural but controlled� mid-40s, to the hourglass shape of the 50s—undergarments changed as well. Now women were not wearing firm girdles to create the slim hips so popular during the war. Instead, they adopted corsolets and waist cinchers to create tiny waistlines, bustiers for that very full bust, and padding at the hips and shoulders to further emphasize the perfectly proportioned hourglass shape.

 

[Wild Root]

:clap

Well said Jitterbug!

Root.

 

[Matt Deckard]

 

[swinggal]

I own quite a few vintage suits, one being a repro made from a vintage pattern, made by a tailor in Switzerland. In fact, it looks exactly like the first suit on this thread that Matt posted. Brown tweed.

I find it very true that people confuse the styles of each decade, and they often associate details like puffed sleeves and ruffles with WWII (I find that most people can not correctly identify my outfits and hairstyles, and have said everything from “were you inspired by ‘Chicago’?� to “You look very 1960s!�)

I find this so annoying too. I don't expect people who aren't intereted in vintage clothing to know much, but jeez, even when I was 13 I could tell you what era an outfit was from, just because I watched movies a lot of from the 30s, 40s and 50's from the age of about five. But then they try and insist on telling you, "No, you are wearing a 50's outfit," when you are sporting an awesome crepe dress from 1941 :rage: Sigh.

Anyway, womens' suits are wonderful. I used to go the full early 40s look to work for ages. Suits (sometimes wide pants as well), Joan Crawford bat-wing sleeve silk shirts, seamed stockings and original shoes and I always did my hair and makeup.

When I did my hair for work I'd ususally wave and curl it rather than do heaps of rolls,and put the sides up so it was very vintage without going to extremes. What was amazing was how many people would come up to me and say, "You look amazing, I don't know what it is, but you just do." Most didn't even associate the clothes, hair etc with an era, just with a universal 'style' that is always elegant.

I have even seen the mainsteam shops like Target full of tweedy jackets with fitted waists and wide shoulders this winter in classic 40s cuts. Even fake fur capes with satin bows are there, along with heaps of repro vintage style jewellery (maracasite butterflies, flowers etc). Just a shame it will be worn in skanky way. We can only hope....

 

[Matt Deckard]

 

[Wild Root]

THAT'S RAD!

Root.

 

[Matt Deckard]

 

[jamespowers]

I suppose I should ad a picture of my wife's green gaberdine suit:

Regards to all,

J

 

[rubyredlocks]

Love this suit,Matt!
I've just started collecting vintage suits and the more casual side of vintage.
Also,hats are brilliant with a suit and I definitely need to replenish my stock there.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Good quality ladies hats are hard to find from the era. Usually they were thin low end wool, though if you look hard enough you'll find some nice fur felt women's hats. Whenever I see the better looking women's hats I tend to buy them out of fear of never seeing them again.